off topic Buffalo Bills 2015

[nfreeman]

On one hand I like the fact that Whaley is allowed to do his job, Rex his, and Pegula be the owner. OTOH, I see no reason whatsoever for the move. Still, given what Whaley has assembled here, arguably one of the best rosters in the NFL, there's no way I want him gone. 

 

 

I have a few questions.

 

 

Who was the last GM for the Bills that fielded a really good team?

 

Did he ruffle some feathers and piss off the owner?

 

I'll take a pissed off owner and a darn good football team.

 

 

Holy unproven assertions about the worst franchise in the NFL for the past 15 years Batman!

 

Separately:  if FJ says Whaley lied to him -- then I believe Whaley lied to him.  Certainly Whaley wasn't the first, and won't be the last, GM to lie to a player, but it's another chip on the "Get rid of Whaley" side of the scale IMHO.

[Eleven]

 

 

Form the players who are rostered by the GM.

 

In any case, Rex is not your average NFL coach. He also has a direct report to the Pegulas.

 

This seems to have been a business issue, based on what's being reported.

 

 

I'd be shocked if the coach has final decision with personnel moves than the GM.

 

The GM gives the coach 90 players from which to select 53.  I don't think a GM *normally* decides who makes a football team.

 

I don't have time to follow Graham's tweets this morning, but what you all are reporting, combined with Fred's remarks, makes me think that Whaley did something out of the ordinary here.

[That Aud Smell]

Whaley appears to have screwed up on some level.

 

So too has Graham, for reporting/tweeting last night that Whaley went rogue.

[nfreeman]

I'm left to infer that he does this sort of thing intentionally. He gets good information from reliable sources, Tweets out a scoop in a misleading manner ("rogue"), gets blowback from all corners, retweets and mocks the trolls and #youranidiot types, and plays coy with those asking more serious questions. 

 

He has as much admitted in subsequent tweets that it wasn't so much a matter of being rogue, as being a poor communicator.

 

He's tweeting now, trying to walk back the use of rogue. Pinning the term on his source.

 

 

Graham really seems to get into a lot of wee-wee contests on Twitter.  I don't think he realizes that they make him look just as bad as the bozos he's arguing with.

[LastPommerFan]

Graham really seems to get into a lot of wee-wee contests on Twitter.  I don't think he realizes that they make him look just as bad as the bozos he's arguing with.

 

It's seems to be endemic to the current TBN Sports department.

[TrueBlueGED]

Graham really seems to get into a lot of wee-wee contests on Twitter.  I don't think he realizes that they make him look just as bad as the bozos he's arguing with.

 

I don't think he cares. In fact, I think he gets off on it.

[woods-racer]

I just think Whaley has broad shoulders and is taking the burden of releasing the most likeable Bill in a decade. If Pres, GM, HC, OC all sat in a meeting and agreed it was time, they also chose a fall guy.

 

If Whaley walked up to Fred Jackson and told him it was his decision and he was sorry, but he had to do it because....

 

That means Fred was free to pin his anger on a man and not the organization. Hence his quotes of love of the organization but being blindsided by Whaley.

 

On the business side I can seem them acting shocked, that is their best defense. But Russ works out a deal so M&T gets their monies worth and Fred gets his endorsements. 

 

It all ends well if the Bills make the playoffs.

[Hoss]

Graham is also more able to put out reports like that without facing any consequences. He's no longer on the Bills beat the way others are, so when he reports something like that the actual reporters at the games and pressers are the ones who face the music. Not Timmy.

[Lanny]

The coach decides who makes the team.

 

The GM gives the coach 90 players from which to select 53.  I don't think a GM *normally* decides who makes a football team.

 

I don't have time to follow Graham's tweets this morning, but what you all are reporting, combined with Fred's remarks, makes me think that Whaley did something out of the ordinary here.

I think he has the final determination who makes the team. The coach certainly has input on what is needed and who is best for his scheme.

 

DW: I look at it this way. Coach is in charge of the 46 guys on the field. I’m in charge of the 53. We discuss things every day. I have full support of every decision he’s made this year.

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/What-theyre-saying-Doug-Whaley-Doug-Marrone-wrap-up-2014/c60656e5-7dfb-48a6-bc20-86a738eec9b7

 

Edited September 2, 2015 by Lanny

[WildCard]

Holy unproven assertions about the worst franchise in the NFL for the past 15 years Batman!

Every analyst on ESPN and NFL network doesn't doubt the validity of that claim, Robin

On some more bad news, McCoy doesn't sound ready for weel 1, according to someone inside the Bill's organization. Source says they want him to be ready, and he can probably play, but at his rate of recovery rate now, it would probably do more damage than good to have him start versus the Colts. Making the FJ cut all the more astounding 

[That Aud Smell]

Carucci tweets that it's expected that Cassel will be released. Money a factor.

[tom webster]

I'm sure you could. But are the players associated with those campaigns what Buffalo's leading (and perhaps starchiest) private corporation would want? I'm guessing not. There's the cohort that has players with bad or weird off-field issues (drag racing, synth pot, orgies, engagement ring fiasco, etc.), a cohort of players who just don't present polished enough (probably Watkins, Gilmore), and a cohort of players who would just lack the requisite recognition factor (Preston Brown is all I got there). 

 

Maybe Kyle Williams was their other option. That might have actually worked. 

 

As for the retired players, I think M&T did that for a while (Thurman, among others), and has moved on to wanting newer faces.

 

I think maybe you misunderestimate the extent to which Fred eclipsed the other players in terms of marketability.

 

Finally, I don't imagine that the "rogue" issue here is that M&T was caught totally flat-footed, nor that the Bills business people would have wanted a say in whether Jackson stayed with the team. My sense is that the Bills business people were not kept in the loop, and that M&T found out through media reports and that this was a very bad look with the team's biggest corporate sponsor.

I respect your point but aligning themselves with Sammy Watkins or Rex Ryan, for instance, seems to make more sense to me especially if you want to tag onto the "new era."

As far as your last paragraph, I get this and I'm sure that Russ would have and probably should have been the one to break the news but the sponsor has to know going in what the chances of something like this happening, especially given the rumors of a release during the off season and given the likelihood of a 34 year old running back not making the team. 

[darksabre]

Carucci tweets that it's expected that Cassel will be released. Money a factor.

 

Thank god. 

[tom webster]

Graham really seems to get into a lot of wee-wee contests on Twitter.  I don't think he realizes that they make him look just as bad as the bozos he's arguing with.

 I had a brief exchange with Wawrow about this as well. Being old school, I find it totally inappropriate especially the exchanges that happen as the night grows long and it seems that alcohol becomes a big part of the evening. On the other hand, I realize my opinion means little in the twitter world.

Holy unproven assertions about the worst franchise in the NFL for the past 15 years Batman!

 

Separately:  if FJ says Whaley lied to him -- then I believe Whaley lied to him.  Certainly Whaley wasn't the first, and won't be the last, GM to lie to a player, but it's another chip on the "Get rid of Whaley" side of the scale IMHO.

 

 

I can't believe all the over reaction to the Whaley lied narrative. Every superior in every industry lies, or at least misleads every subordinate at some point. It is part of the job. 

[SwampD]

I find this all very silly.

[WildCard]

I find this all very silly.

[Doohicksie]

I can't believe all the over reaction to the Whaley lied narrative. Every superior in every industry lies, or at least misleads every subordinate at some point. It is part of the job. 

 

So is the subordinate naively believing the lie.  It's just the role each part plays in the kabuki dance of employment.  (I've been laid off 4 times, I know how it works.)

[tom webster]

So is the subordinate naively believing the lie. It's just the role each part plays in the kabuki dance of employment. (I've been laid off 4 times, I know how it works.)

And the rest of the dance is the employee blaming the boss. It's the circle of life.

[Doohicksie]

Amen.

 

 

 

 

 

Ah, to be old and cynical.

[woods-racer]

I find this all very silly.

 

 

 

Well played gentleman, well played.

[musichunch]

And the rest of the dance is the employee blaming the boss. It's the circle of life.

 

All true. Many of us are still upset about Fred leaving.

 

I stand by what I said earlier. Whaley seems to be doing a great job, but I don't know about him as a person yet. 

[nfreeman]

All true. Many of us are still upset about Fred leaving.

 

I stand by what I said earlier. Whaley seems to be doing a great job, but I don't know about him as a person yet. 

 

What is this based on? 

[Johnny DangerFace]

What is this based on? 

 

His job is to assemble a talented roster.  Do you not think he has done this?

[That Aud Smell]

I don't have time to mine the drafts since 2010, but my sense is that his "hit rate" is better than your average bear.

 

When I look at the roster, and I see guys like Dareus and Gilmore (arguably both home runs (at a slot where, yes, you need to homer)), and then even guys like the 3rd rounder who's going to start on the OL, I see a GM who is developing a good track record as a roster builder.

 

If you believe what you read, there is a consensus around the league that, QB notwithstanding, the Bills have a top-10 roster.

His job is to assemble a talented roster.  Do you not think he has done this?

 

I believe he has.

[nfreeman]

His job is to assemble a talented roster.  Do you not think he has done this?

 

I don't have time to mine the drafts since 2010, but my sense is that his "hit rate" is better than your average bear.

 

When I look at the roster, and I see guys like Dareus and Gilmore (arguably both home runs (at a slot where, yes, you need to homer)), and then even guys like the 3rd rounder who's going to start on the OL, I see a GM who is developing a good track record as a roster builder.

 

If you believe what you read, there is a consensus around the league that, QB notwithstanding, the Bills have a top-10 roster.

 

I believe he has.

 

I think his job is to put together a good team that makes the playoffs and can do some damage once it gets there.  He has not done this.  Making a bunch of splashy moves is not equivalent to doing this.

 

It may or may not happen this year (and it will almost entirely depend on the play of a QB who's never started an NFL game, or his presumed backup, whom most observers had deemed a washout until 2 weeks ago) -- but until it does, I don't see that he has accomplished anything.