off topic Buffalo Bills 2015

[nfreeman]

Well.....it's at least nice to see one Pegula front office employee ...

 

It's not clear to me why this continues to be an issue, but I have suspended GoDD for 90 days again.  Either he'll figure out that the child molesting jokes are not OK, or he won't. 

[sabills]

 

Page one of the police report. If its true his son stayed behind, then the self-defense thing completely falls apart to me. I'm not a parent, but I can't imagine if you're worried for your own safety you feel ok leaving your kid there. If this was self defense the move should have been: 1)Whatever leads up to altercation 2) Punch guy 3) Grab kid and get home 4) Call police. 

 

EDIT:added the bold

Edited July 13, 2015 by sabills

[That Aud Smell]

it's a bad, weird story. if anything, it sounds like HIS KID was trying to cover for his dad's misdeeds.

 

what do we know about this guy? turned on his colleagues in bounty gate (that's actually a mixed bag, i realize). trashed his franchise quarterback to a reporter. roughed up a kid in the middle of the night over a beach chair.

 

see ya. here's hoping you find your way onto the wagon, into anger-management counseling, etc.

Edited July 13, 2015 by That Aud Smell

[shrader]

it's a bad, weird story. if anything, it sounds like HIS KID was trying to cover for his dad's misdeeds.

 

what do we know about this guy? turned on his colleagues in bounty gate (that's actually a mixed bag, i realize). trashed his franchise quarterback to a reporter. roughed up a kid in the middle of the night over a beach chair.

 

see ya. here's hoping you find your way onto the wagon, into anger-management counseling, etc.

 

The story is actually kind of funny in that report.  It lays out exactly like this:

 

1. Hey you, you stole my chairs!

2. Grab rod and throw it in the water

3. Push.

4. Punch

5. Threat

 

There's a whole hell of a lot left out between #1 and #2.  I have no idea what to think of this whole thing, but there really isn't much to be learned from that report.

[Hoss]

A 48-year-old male who is 6-4, 215 and punched a teenager in the face over beach chairs. I don't care much about what else happened.

[IKnowPhysics]

"We're going to build a bully and see if you want to play against us for 60 minutes."

[Eleven]

A 48-year-old male who is 6-4, 215 and punched a teenager in the face over beach chairs. I don't care much about what else happened.

 

What if the three teenagers came at him first?

 

(Not that I think this is what happened, but you've gotta be a little open minded.  All you are seeing is one side of the story.)

[Drunkard]

"We're going to build a bully and see if you want to play against us for 60 minutes."

 

Let's hope the Patriots put some chair stealing teenagers on their offensive line this season.

[sabills]

What if the three teenagers came at him first?

 

(Not that I think this is what happened, but you've gotta be a little open minded. All you are seeing is one side of the story.)

This is what I'm saying with the thing with his kid. Three teens come at you, you feel it's dangerous enough to punch someone, you don't leave your child behind after the altercation.

 

I believe in due process, but if it turns out he hit a guy out if anger, not self-defense, I don't care if the guy was 17 or 37, I want the offender off my team. I have no time for that crap, especially from a coach who is supposed to help boys become men.

[Eleven]

This is what I'm saying with the thing with his kid. Three teens come at you, you feel it's dangerous enough to punch someone, you don't leave your child behind after the altercation.

 

I believe in due process, but if it turns out he hit a guy out if anger, not self-defense, I don't care if the guy was 17 or 37, I want the offender off my team. I have no time for that crap, especially from a coach who is supposed to help boys become men.

 

I agree w/ you, but the police report comes from only the alleged victims' perspective, so who knows if they're telling the truth about that bit?

 

I agree w/ your second part, too.

[sabills]

I agree w/ you, but the police report comes from only the alleged victims' perspective, so who knows if they're telling the truth about that bit?

 

Yup, absolutely. We'll see how this shakes out.

[shrader]

This is what I'm saying with the thing with his kid. Three teens come at you, you feel it's dangerous enough to punch someone, you don't leave your child behind after the altercation.

 

I believe in due process, but if it turns out he hit a guy out if anger, not self-defense, I don't care if the guy was 17 or 37, I want the offender off my team. I have no time for that crap, especially from a coach who is supposed to help boys become men.

 

I missed some details as I really haven't read anything other than that police report.  What is this detail about "you don't leave your child behind"?  I'm kind of curious about what that means.  A quick google search tells me the kid is 21, so I'm not really sure how leaving your child behind would factor in here.

[wjag]

Am I the only one who is disturbed that a copy of your arrest report is on the internet?  As a society, we do not need to see everything that is out there.  We just don't.

[shrader]

Am I the only one who is disturbed that a copy of your arrest report is on the internet?  As a society, we do not need to see everything that is out there.  We just don't.

 

Aren't they public documents?

[Hoss]

Am I the only one who is disturbed that a copy of your arrest report is on the internet? As a society, we do not need to see everything that is out there. We just don't.

The police posted it and arrest reports are generally public information.

[wjag]

I knew  the fact that you got arrested was out there; I was unaware that all the nitty-gritty details are also released.

[sabills]

I missed some details as I really haven't read anything other than that police report. What is this detail about "you don't leave your child behind"? I'm kind of curious about what that means. A quick google search tells me the kid is 21, so I'm not really sure how leaving your child behind would factor in here.

It mentions that "Zachary", his son, stayed behind, helped them look for their fishing poles, and talked to them a bit. Like eleven said, that's just one side of the story, we'll see what comes out later.

 

 

EDIT: just looked,that report doesn't say that it's his son, but it is mentioned on the sheriff's Facebook page, as cited here:

 

http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/2521232-aaron-kromer-arrested-latest-details-mugshot-on-buffalo-bills-offensive-coach

Edited July 13, 2015 by sabills

[Eleven]

I knew  the fact that you got arrested was out there; I was unaware that all the nitty-gritty details are also released.

 

Some states.  In New York, good luck getting anyone's police report but your own unless you're the victim or you have a court order.  Or a connection.

[...]

A 48-year-old male who is 6-4, 215 and punched a teenager in the face over beach chairs. I don't care much about what else happened.

 

 

Really?  You're on track to be a star in the media, then.

 

Back in reality-land, I train and train with teenagers in martial arts.  A "teenager" can be pretty big, even a 13 year old, depening on genetics.  They can also be pretty aggressive, and thanks to the socio-politics of the day, pretty fearless.  In the dark, you might not know you're dealing with a youngster, especially if you feel threatened. 

 

But let's not let reality get in the way of a good narrative and 4 hours worth of flaying and scorching a person before all of the facts are established.

 

And, Mike Schopp, you're a hypocritical idiot of the highest order.  You, on the one hand, complain about people being naïve, ignorant, stupid, and lacking facts to help form your opinions.  But here you are, you ass, on the air doing that exact thing. 

[Hoss]

Really?  You're on track to be a star in the media, then.

 

Back in reality-land, I train and train with teenagers in martial arts.  A "teenager" can be pretty big, even a 13 year old, depening on genetics.  They can also be pretty aggressive, and thanks to the socio-politics of the day, pretty fearless.  In the dark, you might not know you're dealing with a youngster, especially if you feel threatened. 

 

But let's not let reality get in the way of a good narrative and 4 hours worth of flaying and scorching a person before all of the facts are established.

 

And, Mike Schopp, you're a hypocritical idiot of the highest order.  You, on the one hand, complain about people being naïve, ignorant, stupid, and lacking facts to help form your opinions.  But here you are, you ass, on the air doing that exact thing. 

One - AGAIN, I don't know how many ###### times I have to repeat this... I am NOT here as a member of the media. Any reference to that is entirely irrelevant and insulting.

Two - It was too dark for him to realize he was punching a teenager, but it wasn't dark enough for him to not threaten to kill their family... Because adults definitely threaten to kill other adults' families.

 

Reality is that there is very little supporting him at this point. VERY little. In REALITY, there is nothing supporting Kromer aside from the hope that the teenagers were lying. There are very few scenarios where Kromer can come out of this looking like anything but an idiot who deserves to be fired.

We have no reports of injuries to anybody but the one teenager... If there was an actual scuffle there would be other reported injuries. The report that his son stuck around to assist them after his alleged ###### father decided to punch one of them in the face is damning. Why would he do that if he was just involved or witnessed them fighting with his father?

 

Sorry. There just aren't any avenues that look good here. Kromer should've been fired already.

Edited July 13, 2015 by Hoss

[...]

One - AGAIN, I don't know how many ###### times I have to repeat this... I am NOT here as a member of the media. Any reference to that is entirely irrelevant and insulting.

Two - It was too dark for him to realize he was punching a teenager, but it wasn't dark enough for him to not threaten to kill their parents... Because adults definitely threaten to kill other adults' parents.

 

Reality is that there is very little supporting him at this point. VERY little. In REALITY, there is nothing supporting Kromer aside from the hope that the teenagers were lying. There are very few scenario where Kromer can come out of this looking like anything but an idiot who deserves to be fired.

We have no reports of injuries to anybody but the one teenager... If there was an actual scuffle there would be other reported injuries. The report that his son stuck around to assist them after his alleged ###### father decided to punch one of them in the face is damning. Why would he do that if he was just involved or witnessed them fighting with his father?

 

Sorry. There just aren't any avenues that look good here. Kromer should've been fired already.

 

 

Are you not in the media, and is that not your career goal?

 

The threat is hear-say.  It is not an established fact.  There has been no trial yet. 

 

It is not an established fact that the man hit the kid.  That is alleged.  There has been no trial yet.

 

You can take pretty much all of the info in that police report and toss it aside until there's a trial or a plea. 

 

Until then, you're going on A POLICE REPORT which are well known to be lacking in facts.

 

If the Bills were to fire the guy before this went through due process, is there a chance the dude could sue?  I don't know, maybe.

 

Ever heard of the Duke lacrosse case?  You think that's an out-lier?

[shrader]

The police report says that he threatened to "kill his family", not his parents.  So let's not leap to judgement based solely off of a misreading of that report.

[Hoss]

Have we not paid any attention to the progress the league has made in not waiting around for the judicial system? The Bills should not be waiting around for the judicial system here. Just like the Bears didn't wait for the judicial system on Ray McDonald. If this were any other team we wouldn't be defending Kromer. Most wouldn't care but those who would would have wondered why he wasn't fired already...

[shrader]

Ever heard of the Duke lacrosse case?  You think that's an out-lier?

 

We can many other events that are far more recent to support this as well.  Go look through some of the stuff talked about in the politics thread and see how stories evolved after the initial witch hunt from the media.  We're in such a ratings driven rush nowadays that we just immediately report these stories without actually digging up any info on them.  You'd think that people would learn from this stuff and actually let a story play out a bit before casting judgement.  I know that I want to hear more of this story before casting him aside or keeping him with the team, but unfortunately that's a rare opinion today.

[Hoss]

Are you not in the media, and is that not your career goal?

 

The threat is hear-say.  It is not an established fact.  There has been no trial yet. 

 

It is not an established fact that the man hit the kid.  That is alleged.  There has been no trial yet.

 

You can take pretty much all of the info in that police report and toss it aside until there's a trial or a plea. 

 

Until then, you're going on A POLICE REPORT which are well known to be lacking in facts.

 

If the Bills were to fire the guy before this went through due process, is there a chance the dude could sue?  I don't know, maybe.

 

Ever heard of the Duke lacrosse case?  You think that's an out-lier?

No. It is not my goal in being here. My goal in being here is to discuss sports and be a fan. My goals outside of here are none of your business unless it is relevant to the discussion or I bring it up. Neither of which are true here. Move on. If you're going to reference my job then the only relevance here is that I sift through police reports every single day and completely understand that they are not entirely based in facts. I likely have more experience in dealing with police reports and understanding them than anybody here outside of those with experience in the field of law.

 

The FACTS were have right now - teenagers claim that Kromer came at them heated about CHAIRS and pushed one before punching him on the face and launching the pole into the water. They claim that. No disputing that. We also have the FACT that the individual who was allegedly punched has injuries to his face consistent with a strike to the face. We also know that there are no other reported injuries, and we also know that Kromer hasn't even claimed self defense yet (which seems to be what everybody here wants to do for him).

 

Again, I KNOW that the report isn't fact. I KNOW that there's still a long way to go before he is convicted of anything (it may never happen). I KNOW these things just as much as you do. But I also know that the team shouldn't be waiting around for the judicial system. The league and its teams have moved beyond that lazy way of doing things. They need to move on.

Edited July 13, 2015 by Hoss