Sabres are ruining Murray's plan---what does he do??

[Doohicksie]

Like Sam Reinhart? I mean we drafted Sam Reinhart and it's like everyone is just ignoring his existence.

 

I thought it was pretty obvious that I was talking about the upcoming draft. McDavid and Eichel both project out to be potentially "generational" talent. I think Samson will be a fine player but I don't know that he will have that kind of impact on the team (although looking what he's doing with the Ice, it looks like he is capable of carrying a team).

 

I think you meant the antithesis of antithesis there.

 

He should be introduced to the word epitome. It would be quite an epiphany.

[tom webster]

If TM had only one plan then we, as Sabres' fans would all be in a world of hurt. No good executive creates a business plan without preparing for every possibilty. Building a sports team is a fluid situation as you never know exactly how things are going to unfold. Will player X develop early, late, not at all? What impact will player Y have on overall plan?

 

As others have stated, its way too early to know how this season will play out but I am confident that TM has a plan for every scenario.

[Robviously]

Silly or not it is something he has to handle. I think we all assumed the obvious rebuild route was a bottom 2 finish this year, I think GMTM thought the same. It will be interesting to see if he forces it or let's the team go in a natural direction (up or down). Truth is probably in the middle. There are gonna be trades for sure, and with some key prospects no longer waiver exempt next year, call-ups wouldn't surprise me either

If he did, then Tim Murray ruined Tim Murray's plan. No one forced him to bring in Gionta, Moulson, and Gorges. What's our record without those three? If he wanted to assure a last place finish, bringing in a proven goal-scorer like Moulson, a leader like Gionta, and a top-4 defenseman like Gorges was probably a huge mistake.

 

And if Murray really didn't think a bottom-5 finish this year was necessary for what he has in mind, then I'm interested to see what he plans to do. Is he that confident that he can find star players later in the draft? (Or just in this draft?) Is he confident he can make a huge trade to remake the team? (And is that why we hear Myers rumors daily?)

[Stoner]

If he did, then Tim Murray ruined Tim Murray's plan. No one forced him to bring in Gionta, Moulson, and Gorges. What's our record without those three? If he wanted to assure a last place finish, bringing in a proven goal-scorer like Moulson, a leader like Gionta, and a top-4 defenseman like Gorges was probably a huge mistake.

 

And if Murray really didn't think a bottom-5 finish this year was necessary for what he has in mind, then I'm interested to see what he plans to do. Is he that confident that he can find star players later in the draft? (Or just in this draft?) Is he confident he can make a huge trade to remake the team? (And is that why we hear Myers rumors daily?)

 

Love the new sig.

 

[Johnny DangerFace]

If he did, then Tim Murray ruined Tim Murray's plan. No one forced him to bring in Gionta, Moulson, and Gorges. What's our record without those three? If he wanted to assure a last place finish, bringing in a proven goal-scorer like Moulson, a leader like Gionta, and a top-4 defenseman like Gorges was probably a huge mistake.

 

I think bringing in moulson, gionta, and gorges were definitely meant to improve the team, but it still looked like a god awful roster. It was still expected to finish near the bottom. And let's not pretend it's those three player carrying this team. With a game in hand we are 7 points from the bottom. It is the big jump in Ennis and Girgensons on offense, and big jumps from Myers, Zadorov, and Ristolainen on defense. Stafford has had a big increase as well, and both our goalies have been fantastic.

 

All that is a good thing though

Edited December 14, 2014 by Johnny DangerFace

[Robviously]

I think bringing in moulson, gionta, and gorges were definitely meant to improve the team, but it still looked like a god awful roster. It was still expected to finish near the bottom. And let's not pretend it's those three player carrying this team. With a game in hand we are 7 points from the bottom. It is the big jump in Ennis and Girgensons on offense, and big jumps from Myers, Zadorov, and Ristolainen on defense. Stafford has had a big increase as well, and both our goalies have been fantastic.

 

All that is a good thing though

It's not those three players carrying the team but they've been huge in helping us win.

 

Ennis is playing like Ennis, and Girgensons took a big step forward, but Moulson completes that line. Without him, we'd still have zero good lines. Myers seems like a new man playing with Gorges this year. I think Gionta's leadership has helped as well -- last year's team crumbled after a bad start; this year's team roared back.

 

I don't think you make those moves if you're trying to finish dead last again. And you wouldn't make them if you're just hoping to finish last either.

[Stoner]

Things are shifting though. With the p-word cropping up now and the Sabres one of the hottest teams in the league, and opponents likely to start taking them more seriously and playing their starting goalies, the pressure will build. Can they handle it?

[apuszczalowski]

If Murray rips apart this roster and starts dumping players so that they will not be able to compete and secure a last place finish, a quality well run organisation would/should show him the door.......

 

I want a GM that doesn't need to pick 1st (or second) overall or have to find a saviour in some young kid in order to build a contending team. A good GM can use all resources to build a winner and doesn't have to win a lottery in order to build his winning team.

[SabresBillsFan]

If Murray rips apart this roster and starts dumping players so that they will not be able to compete and secure a last place finish, a quality well run organisation would/should show him the door.......

 

I want a GM that doesn't need to pick 1st (or second) overall or have to find a saviour in some young kid in order to build a contending team. A good GM can use all resources to build a winner and doesn't have to win a lottery in order to build his winning team.

 

This is a good point. I still want one of the big two. We need a superstar up front. Yes we had good players up front in franchise history but this team hasn't has star power up front since the 90's! I'm talking LaFontaine and Mogilny. Yes we had two great players up front but the rest of the team wasn't good enough. I believe with all the picks, prospects and what we currently have combined with one of the top two in the draft this year we could have the makings of something special. People talk about Detriot but the still have all stars mixed with a lot of above average talent.

[LGR4GM]

True, but we should remember that some draft picks are washouts, and some are decent but don't live up to their draft position, and that none of them can be counted on until we actually see it at the NHL level -- which we sho-nuff didn't see from Reinhart this year.

We haven't seen it from McDavid or Eichel either.

 

If Reinhart is a bust it doesn't bode well for Murray. I don't think Reinhart is even close to a bust.

[JujuFish]

To agree with many of the above posters, I'm not convinced Murray's plan was to finish last.

 

Having said that, the Sabres are still 27th of 30 teams in points percentage, so if they keep up their current season pace, they'll still have a 9.5% chance to get McDavid.

[LGR4GM]

I still don't believe this team won't regress towards the mean as the year progresses.

[X. Benedict]

Things are shifting though. With the p-word cropping up now and the Sabres one of the hottest teams in the league, and opponents likely to start taking them more seriously and playing their starting goalies, the pressure will build. Can they handle it?

 

P word?

 

Whoa. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Even Columbus just won 6 in a row, this is the NHL and all rosters have talent. Buffalo included.

 

My catholic math sez:

 

Buffalo would have to win 32 out of 52 games just to get to 90 points and would most likely miss the playoffs still.

 

 

None of this is impossible, just very improbable.

 

 

The only team I really believe that Buffalo is better than in the East is Carolina.

And I'm usually the optimistic guy.

Edited December 14, 2014 by X. Benedict

[sicknfla]

Sabres have played 30 games. 18 home and 12 away. For the most part they have been pretty injury free. I can't see them maintaining this pace. Road losses will mount and by March 1 we will be right in the thick of it. Edmonton, Carolina, and Arizona will still be there. The others will pull away.

 

The WORST we pick is 4.

[bob_sauve28]

P word?

 

Whoa. Let's not get ahead of ourselves. Even Columbus just won 6 in a row, this is the NHL and all rosters have talent. Buffalo included.

 

My catholic math sez:

 

Buffalo would have to win 32 out of 52 games just to get to 90 points and would most likely miss the playoffs still.

 

 

None of this is impossible, just very improbable.

 

 

The only team I really believe that Buffalo is better than in the East is Carolina.

And I'm usually the optimistic guy.

Ugh!! The math! :wallbash:

 

I didn't do the math! Ugly reality :cry:

 

Thanks for the much needed splash of cold water :angel:

[JJFIVEOH]

If Murray rips apart this roster and starts dumping players so that they will not be able to compete and secure a last place finish, a quality well run organisation would/should show him the door.......

 

I want a GM that doesn't need to pick 1st (or second) overall or have to find a saviour in some young kid in order to build a contending team. A good GM can use all resources to build a winner and doesn't have to win a lottery in order to build his winning team.

 

Good post.

 

Good post. I agree especially with the bolded.

 

Also, I really don't think Stafford will be retained, but it's not impossible, and I don't think Myers is going anywhere.

 

 

You're probably right, he might not be around next year. I just think there's a better chance now that he stays than say 6 months ago. Seems to me he's turned into more of a Nolan type player. Of course it could just be the contract year thing.

[qwksndmonster]

I hate to do this but...

"They won because of Maulkin, Stahl, Fluery AND Crosby"

 

Crosby 1st overall

Staal 2nd overall

Malkin 2nd overall

Fluery 1st overall

 

I agree with your point but the Penguins are the antithesis of a tank and win franchise.

 

Oh and Jack Eichel is good, really really good.

That Staal wasn't the 2nd overall Staal.

 

We haven't seen it from McDavid or Eichel either.

 

If Reinhart is a bust it doesn't bode well for Murray. I don't think Reinhart is even close to a bust.

I agree with you.

 

That would be fantastic.

 

 

 

True, but we should remember that some draft picks are washouts, and some are decent but don't live up to their draft position, and that none of them can be counted on until we actually see it at the NHL level -- which we sho-nuff didn't see from Reinhart this year.

The Sabres actually winning a playoff series this year is so so so so so far from reality, and yet you smack Liger's PP for counting on Reinhart to become a good player?

Edited December 14, 2014 by qwksndmonster

[LGR4GM]

That Staal wasn't the 2nd overall Staal.

Jordan Staal was drafted 2nd overall by the Pittsburgh Penguins in the 2006 NHL entry draft. Eric was also drafted 2nd overall.

[LGR4GM]

The Sabres actually winning a playoff series this year is so so so so so far from reality, and yet you smack Liger's PP for counting on Reinhart to become a good player?

People think that 18yr old Reinhart will be 20yr old Reinhart will be 24yr old Reinhart. The kid is just far to intelligent for that. You could see it as the few games he played went on. He was slowly coming up to speed.

 

Imagine what would have happened in 2006 if the Penguins had drafted Jonathan Toews at #2 instead of Jordan Staal...

[qwksndmonster]

Jordan Staal was drafted 2nd overall by the Pittsburgh Penguins in the 2006 NHL entry draft. Eric was also drafted 2nd overall.

Woah. So many #2 Staals.

[Stoner]

Woah. So many #2 Staals.

 

I've never wanted Clip Smith to come back to life more.

[LGR4GM]

Marc Staal was 12th overall.

 

The point being... lets make a list the 2nd overall player taken in every draft starting with 2003.

2003: Eric Staal

2004: Evgeni Malkin

2005: Bobby Ryan

2006: Jordan Staal (Jonathan Toews was 3rd)

2007: James Van Riemsdyk

2008: Drew Doughty (2nd forward taken was Nikita Filatov at 6th)

2009: Victor Hedman (2nd forward was Matt Duchene at 3rd)

2010: Tyler Seguin

2011: Gabriel Landeskog

2012: Ryan Murray (2nd forward was Galchenyuk at 3rd)

2013: Aleksander Barkov

2014: Sam Reinhart

 

If Sam Reinhart is a bust, Tim Murray should probably be fired because honestly, looking back over a decade, drafting 2nd overall has netted a 1st line player in every draft with the exception of Jordan Staal and Barkov (to early to call it on Barkov). The defenders listed are all currently or in the process of (Murray) being top pairing guys for their teams. Very rare for the first forward taken to not be a top line guy. If Reinhart fails it is on Tim Murray.

Edited December 14, 2014 by LGR4GM

[kas23]

This may actually work out well for GMTM's plan. It's no secret he wants to move players, but he'll only do so at steep prices. This winning streak is driving up the value of the Sabres assets. And he'd be a fool not to take advantage of this.

[X. Benedict]

Woah. So many #2 Staals.

 

I usually choose the middle one on the least trafficked theory.

[3putt]

 

 

I usually choose the middle one on the least trafficked theory.

Brilliant!