GEORGIA FAN Posted October 31, 2014 Author Report Posted October 31, 2014 The number was retired out of respect, because he died while a member of the team. I'm not sure when we crossed the line between respect and idolatry, but I do see some of what you're seeing. This has nothing to do with respect, it's about the numbers you put up and what you do for the community. Quote
Eleven Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 This has nothing to do with respect, it's about the numbers you put up and what you do for the community. I'm quite certain the Sabres are not the only team in pro sports history to retire a number when an active player dies, regardless of what his numbers were or what he did for the community. It's a legit reason to retire a number even if the player is no good. Andre Benoit dies tomorrow? No Sabre should wear 61 ever again. Quote
spndnchz Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 It's on the site of the Aud. That's pretty cool too. Quote
GEORGIA FAN Posted October 31, 2014 Author Report Posted October 31, 2014 I'm quite certain the Sabres are not the only team in pro sports history to retire a number when an active player dies, regardless of what his numbers were or what he did for the community. It's a legit reason to retire a number even if the player is no good. Andre Benoit dies tomorrow? No Sabre should wear 61 ever again. Well I guess everybody entitled to their own opinion. Quote
Eleven Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 Well I guess everybody entitled to their own opinion. I agree with you on a lot of the rest of the stuff, though. Buffalo has about as much claim to Horton as Ottawa has to Dominik Hasek. Yeah, he brought some credibility and helped bring up some of the younger guys, but that's about it. Quote
PromoTheRobot Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 I watched him play and he was a key part of the Sabres. I have no problem with putting up a statue and a museum display at HC. In fact it's pretty cool. You get all the travel hockey players and their parents coming to Harborcenter who never knew Tim Horton was a hockey player and a Sabre. If you are going to have a Tim Horton's at Harborcenter, why not make it the coolest Tim Horton's anywhere? I agree with you on a lot of the rest of the stuff, though. Buffalo has about as much claim to Horton as Ottawa has to Dominik Hasek. Yeah, he brought some credibility and helped bring up some of the younger guys, but that's about it. Then a TH's in Toronto could have built it, but they didn't. Quote
That Aud Smell Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 I can't say I've ever idolized the guy. Nor do I know any Sabres fan who does. The number was retired out of respect, because he died while a member of the team. Quite right. I'm not sure what else could or should have been done. A HOF player died while playing for your franchise -- that number just gets mothballed. Whether it should've been raised to the rafters? Another issue. But I'm fine with it. It's more of an historical waymarker than anything. To the larger point: The donut and coffee shop empire that bears his name, and its prominence in the new Harborcenter, is making for a bit of "yeah, um, that's -- what?" from me as well. But, whatever. The process of making money is sometimes (well, almost always) a little unseemly. So there are people down there at the foot of Washington Street looking to capitalize as much as they can on the brand of a deceased hockey player. Have at it, I say. I know what's what and who's who. Quote
Marvelo Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 This He played two season with Buffalo. His numbers don't jump out at you in those two years. It was later revealed that his blood alcohol level was twice the legal limit at the time of the accident. I don't know of any charities or fundraiser he did in the Buffalo area. He also started his Coffee Shop in Canada and not here in Buffalo. But for some unknown reason, people in the area and the Sabres Organization retires his jersey and recently put up a statue of him at the Harbor Center. No offense but I have seen other Sabres players in this organization do a lot more then Tim Horton. I'm not trying to be mean about this. I just want someone to explain to me why this man is Idolized in Buffalo so much? Thought provoking post, thanks. You have to watch who you put statues up for...what's next, Hasek? Quote
Hoss Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 That's what retiring a number means, no? Well there's a difference between retiring and honoring numbers. They didn't want it honored, but they wanted it taken out of rotation for players to use. Quote
nfreeman Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 He played two season with Buffalo. His numbers don't jump out at you in those two years. It was later revealed that his blood alcohol level was twice the legal limit at the time of the accident. I don't know of any charities or fundraiser he did in the Buffalo area. He also started his Coffee Shop in Canada and not here in Buffalo. But for some unknown reason, people in the area and the Sabres Organization retires his jersey and recently put up a statue of him at the Harbor Center. No offense but I have seen other Sabres players in this organization do a lot more then Tim Horton. I'm not trying to be mean about this. I just want someone to explain to me why this man is Idolized in Buffalo so much? Was there even such a thing as a legal BAC in 1972? In the same vein, I would surely believe his banner serves as a reminder to players that even great players fall hard if they make the wrong life choices. The reminder literally hangs over their heads. This would be great, but I doubt any of these kids puts 2 and 2 together on this. Quote
IKnowPhysics Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 This would be great, but I doubt any of these kids puts 2 and 2 together on this. I want to believe that it would be part of the orientation by the front office and/or coaching staffs when new players arrive. Quote
Norcal Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 I was just talking about this subject with my gf when I saw the statue unvail. I thought many of the same thoughts as the op but like alot of people said I think that his death while an active player had the biggest impact on his hockey legacy and the decision to bury his # with him. I respect his legacy even though he won several cups with a current rival, they weren't yet. As for the donut shops, his family hasn't owned them since he died in 1974. Quote
LastPommerFan Posted October 31, 2014 Report Posted October 31, 2014 Death Sells. Almost as good as sex. Quote
Hoss Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 Death Sells. Almost as good as sex. And donuts. Quote
bunomatic Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 The coffee sukcs and the donuts are highly overrated. The new dark roast isn't bad. Voodoo donuts over in Portland are much better. Besides nothing that Tim Hortons (the donut and coffee empire) has evolved into had anything to do with Tim Horton anyways. Quote
Eleven Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 I don't drink coffee. I rarely eat donuts, and when I do, they're not TH. Can we just all agree that it's really cool that this little part of Canada has landed here? Can we just celebrate that Buffalo is getting great stuff lately (not just TPeg, but a lot of others) and not complain for once? FOR ###### ONCE? Quote
darksabre Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 I don't drink coffee. I rarely eat donuts, and when I do, they're not TH. Can we just all agree that it's really cool that this little part of Canada has landed here? Can we just celebrate that Buffalo is getting great stuff lately (not just TPeg, but a lot of others) and not complain for once? FOR ###### ONCE? I like that we continue to get all of Canada's stuff. We're more Canada than Canada. The Stanley Cup is next right? Quote
Stoner Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 I don't drink coffee. I rarely eat donuts, and when I do, they're not TH. Can we just all agree that it's really cool that this little part of Canada has landed here? Can we just celebrate that Buffalo is getting great stuff lately (not just TPeg, but a lot of others) and not complain for once? FOR ###### ONCE? Who's complaining? You're the only one, AngryCostumedEleven. The OP asked a good, honest, intellectual question. No complaints about Tim Horton's being in Buffalo followed. Quote
tom webster Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 (edited) Well there's a difference between retiring and honoring numbers. They didn't want it honored, but they wanted it taken out of rotation for players to use. The Bills have more then a few numbers out of circulation but only one retired(12). I understand the difference and have been told the Rip story before. However, saying that the Knox's didn't want the number honored implies that there was some stigma associated with how Horton died and there wasn't. It was a different time. Unfortunately, it just wasn't considered a big deal. If we decided to retroactively change how certain revered players are remembered, there would be about 10 players in the four major hall of fames combined. Edited November 1, 2014 by tom webster Quote
X. Benedict Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 I always liked the donuts at Stan Makita's. Quote
TheFunPolice Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 What exactly do the fun police do? Not much... we don't even get donuts! Quote
Eleven Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 What exactly do the fun police do? They live inside of my head. Quote
Hoss Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 The Bills have more then a few numbers out of circulation but only one retired(12). I understand the difference and have been told the Rip story before. However, saying that the Knox's didn't want the number honored implies that there was some stigma associated with how Horton died and there wasn't. It was a different time. Unfortunately, it just wasn't considered a big deal. If we decided to retroactively change how certain revered players are remembered, there would be about 10 players in the four major hall of fames combined. I have heard quite a few stories about the superstitious Knox brother. I would say that I would like to hear them from somebody close to them, but half of the stories have come directly from Paul Wieland who was, ya know, employed by them and dealt with them often. Quote
LastPommerFan Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 I don't drink coffee. I rarely eat donuts, and when I do, they're not TH. Can we just all agree that it's really cool that this little part of Canada has landed here? Can we just celebrate that Buffalo is getting great stuff lately (not just TPeg, but a lot of others) and not complain for once? FOR ###### ONCE? Technically he landed in Canada. Quote
Stoner Posted November 1, 2014 Report Posted November 1, 2014 Technically he landed in Canada. Turrible. Quote
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