Jump to content

Trade speculation 2014-15


Hoss

Recommended Posts

Advanced statistics are fantastic. They're not really "advanced," it's just that hockey stats were basic for the longest time... No need to be asshats because I think this Myers vs Strachan stuff is silly no matter what advanced stats say about it right now.

 

Everybody on this team has struggled mightily. Their stats on the season will look bad eithe way. Strachan getting a few points in less games isn't enough to cause a debate over. Myers is the better player. By a long shot.

 

The debate about whether Myers is good or not is a good one. But what Strachan does isn't relevant to his play.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

God Bless You....

 

Just the fact that you felt the need to defend him to this point should be enough of an example that Myers is a bust compared to his reputation by some/many. SHould you ever have to compare a #8 fill-in defenseman to a $40 million "Norris Candidate"????

 

And there's the completion of the troll. It's nice to see one wrapped up all 30-minute-sitcom-style in a single reading. No, no one should have to defend Myers against silly comparisons but there's only one reason we're discussing it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Advanced statistics are fantastic. They're not really "advanced," it's just that hockey stats were basic for the longest time... No need to be asshats because I think this Myers vs Strachan stuff is silly no matter what advanced stats say about it right now.

 

Everybody on this team has struggled mightily. Their stats on the season will look bad eithe way. Strachan getting a few points in less games isn't enough to cause a debate over. Myers is the better player. By a long shot.

 

The debate about whether Myers is good or not is a good one. But what Strachan does isn't relevant to his play.

 

It is silly...which is the point......we have X. praising Lindy for Myers winning a Calder under him in his 1st of 6 seasons under Lindy.....then we have people praising advanced stats all the time, while the stats this year show Strachan is a much better value than Myers.....and we are further along in the season than Myers 1 Calder season was to his career.....SOMEONE has to be full of it.

 

Do I think you get more for a trade for Strachan....heck no. I just think too many here dance around golden calves.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

God Bless You....

 

Just the fact that you felt the need to defend him to this point should be enough of an example that Myers is a bust compared to his reputation by some/many. SHould you ever have to compare a #8 fill-in defenseman to a $40 million "Norris Candidate"????

 

 

 

I bet Myers starts on a flacid donkey, while Strachan's is already at mast. Just goes to show how much better Myers is......

 

Whatever. I want my donuts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And there's the completion of the troll. It's nice to see one wrapped up all 30-minute-sitcom-style in a single reading. No, no one should have to defend Myers against silly comparisons but there's only one reason we're discussing it.

 

See above.

 

If anyone thinks of anything i do as a "troll", you are always missing a key component. Be it a joke, or a reminder of the fact that the management hides a whole lot of stuff in the closet, or evaluating Tyler Myers. I'd rather waste my time on puppy videos on youtube.

 

Whatever. I want my donuts.

 

If that is true...I owe you donuts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Advanced statistics are fantastic. They're not really "advanced," it's just that hockey stats were basic for the longest time... No need to be asshats because I think this Myers vs Strachan stuff is silly no matter what advanced stats say about it right now.

 

Everybody on this team has struggled mightily. Their stats on the season will look bad eithe way. Strachan getting a few points in less games isn't enough to cause a debate over. Myers is the better player. By a long shot.

 

The debate about whether Myers is good or not is a good one. But what Strachan does isn't relevant to his play.

 

This we can agree on. Ratios and qualified ratios in my world hardly qualify as "advanced." Fenwick, Corsi, PDO, etc. are crude measures of puck possession given the underlying assumption that goals are random and thus having the puck more than the other guys leads to more shots, which leads to more goals. Easy. Showing a correlation between goals for/against and puck possession is useful but also fairly obvious, I think. The larger question is which guys do I need on my team and which guys don't I need on my team to improve these stats... so in this thread the question is should Myers stay or go? Do all the within-team comparisons you want with these marginally useful stats, but it is very difficult to accurately compare across teams because the relevant variables go well beyond shots, zone starts, and the things that are currently being measured. That's the problem as I see it. Since the error term is very large, a GM still has to rely mostly on what he sees with his eyes. My eyes tell me we can do better than Myers. ...and to be a jerk about it, I also think the "advanced stats" say so as well. ;)

 

As I see it, many are correctly pointing out that Myers is the best of what we currently have, which is probably true. But, I still don't think that means he is what this team needs in the long run. So, if we can flip him for a better fit, I'm in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is silly...which is the point......we have X. praising Lindy for Myers winning a Calder under him in his 1st of 6 seasons under Lindy.....then we have people praising advanced stats all the time, while the stats this year show Strachan is a much better value than Myers.....and we are further along in the season than Myers 1 Calder season was to his career.....SOMEONE has to be full of it.

 

Do I think you get more for a trade for Strachan....heck no. I just think too many here dance around golden calves.

:yawn:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is silly...which is the point......we have X. praising Lindy for Myers winning a Calder under him in his 1st of 6 seasons under Lindy...

 

Praise? Just a little balance. He did win the Calder. FWIW, I would trade the Lindy coached Myers for the Lindy coached NIchushkin. Whatever that means.

In your world it seems talking about TRADING a player - which ultimately gets him off the team - is a festival of praise.

 

Have you been boozing or something? Not getting this at all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think a major reason the Sabres are so bad these last two years is that it's not that each player is bad, it's that their teammate next to them is either not better than them or even worse.

 

I play hockey and admit, I can be pretty bad. But when I have teammates who can skate, shoot, pass the puck, I become better. The Sabres have nobody with any skills that stand out, nobody who makes their teammates better.

 

So they can't work together because none of them make any of them any better.

 

Get it?

Edited by 716
Link to comment
Share on other sites

As talented as he is, I'm not sure I'm ready to have 3 Russian born players being the core of the Sabres for years to come. Call it stereotypical of Russian players, but they are risks to defect and many of them play consistently lackadaisical games

As many know, I'm as xenophobic as they come but that sounds nuts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As talented as he is, I'm not sure I'm ready to have 3 Russian born players being the core of the Sabres for years to come. Call it stereotypical of Russian players, but they are risks to defect and many of them play consistently lackadaisical games

As many know, I'm as xenophobic as they come but that sounds nuts.

I don't know. I kinda want my lackadaisical players to be American.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As talented as he is, I'm not sure I'm ready to have 3 Russian born players being the core of the Sabres for years to come. Call it stereotypical of Russian players, but they are risks to defect and many of them play consistently lackadaisical games

The already-in-the-organization core, IMO, is Girgensons, Ristolainen, and Reinhart. Zadorov is no.4 and Nichushkin would be no.5, following by Grigorenko. Plus a top-3 pick in 2015 immediately becomes the top guy in our core.

 

I also think the "Russian factor" is significantly mitigated when you're talking about guys that came here as teenagers to play even before they were drafted (or in Nichushkin's case, right after). When you hear Grigorenko speak now, his accent is pretty mild. Compare that to Afinogenov who didn't show up in North American until he was ~20 and didn't speak English for a long time.

 

And, of course, at the end of the day, you just want the most talented team.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not sure if this was posted, Darren Dreger feels Red Wings continue to have the most interest

 

Darren Dreger was on TSN 1040 Tuesday morning.

On if the Sabres will be patient enough with Tyler Myers that could still be a part of the McDavid or Eichel era in Buffalo:

“I think that... Buffalo would consider trading Tyler Myers. The Detroit Red Wings have probably been the most persistent and consistent in showing interest in Myers. They heavily scouted him last year. They continue to heavily scout him now. The asking price has always been too high. Most recently, I believe, it was Dylan Larkin, a prospect for the Red Wings, and maybe Jakub Kindl would need to be thrown into that mix as well. And it’s a bit too much of a gamble.

“But hey, I can appreciate what Tim Murray is doing. Tyler Myers might be a good fit in the rebuild. He’s young enough. He’s got size. He’s a right-shot D-man. There’s a lot of positives in Tyler Myers’ game. You don’t know that he’s topped out yet at his best. Some believe that there’s enough flaw that you don’t want to overpay to acquire him, but I don’t know that Buffalo sees it that way. So unless somebody does overpay to get him, then why wouldn’t you hold onto him and see if he is a part of the fix.”

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The already-in-the-organization core, IMO, is Girgensons, Ristolainen, and Reinhart. Zadorov is no.4 and Nichushkin would be no.5, following by Grigorenko. Plus a top-3 pick in 2015 immediately becomes the top guy in our core.

 

Nichushkin has the potential of being the best of all of those. Just ask Benn or Jagr- http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2013/12/20/jaromir-jagr-cant-help-but-rave-about-stars-rookie-nichushkin/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As many know, I'm as xenophobic as they come but that sounds nuts.

Not sure it's really xenophobic. Rasmus, Zemgus, Neuvirth, Lemieux....all prospects I like and aren't worried at all about their work ethic. Zadorov comes in overweight and looks terrible durring prospect tournaments, and then he talks about going to the KHL instead of juniors. Grigo floats and already had attitude issues last year about his demotion.

 

We all watched how the best Russian players in the world get together last winter and refused to put effort in anywhere but the offensive zone. (besides Datsyuk) I like Zadorov, and think Grigs can still make it, but they and their countrymen have shown what I stated above. It's not that they're the only ones prone to it, Armia had many of the same problems Grigs does, but it isn't as prevalant among the big name players.

 

I also think the "Russian factor" is significantly mitigated when you're talking about guys that came here as teenagers to play even before they were drafted (or in Nichushkin's case, right after). When you hear Grigorenko speak now, his accent is pretty mild. Compare that to Afinogenov who didn't show up in North American until he was ~20 and didn't speak English for a long time.

 

And, of course, at the end of the day, you just want the most talented team.

Agreed with the bold, but talent can only take you so far.

 

As for the teenage part, I hope you're right. Switching cultures like that is by no means easy, but hopefully they can find a 2nd home over here and like it enough to stay.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This topic is OLD. A NEW topic should be started unless there is a VERY SPECIFIC REASON to revive this one.

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
×
×
  • Create New...