LabattBlue Posted October 29, 2014 Author Report Posted October 29, 2014 Because of Pittsburgh and Ottawa. Explain?
Eleven Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Explain? Pittsburgh's coach admitted to tanking for Lemieux. Ottawa is widely suspected of having done the same thing to obtain Alexander Daigle. I think there's another Pittsburgh incident that I'm forgetting, too.
LabattBlue Posted October 29, 2014 Author Report Posted October 29, 2014 (edited) Pittsburgh's coach admitted to tanking for Lemieux. Ottawa is widely suspected of having done the same thing to obtain Alexander Daigle. I think there's another Pittsburgh incident that I'm forgetting, too. Was the coach manipulating the lineup in a way that decreased the chances of winning, did the coach order the players to "lay down", or did the GM just put together a crappy roster incapable of success ala this years Sabres? Edited October 29, 2014 by LabattBlue
Eleven Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Was the coach manipulating the lineup in a way that decreased the chances of winning, did the coach order the players to "lay down", or did the GM just put together a crappy roster incapable of success ala this years Sabres? I don't remember. It was a long time ago, and I was a kid for the Pittsburgh tank. But those two are the reasons there is a lottery.
Claude_Verret Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Was the coach manipulating the lineup in a way that decreased the chances of winning, did the coach order the players to "lay down", or did the GM just put together a crappy roster incapable of success ala this years Sabres? http://www.post-gazette.com/sports/penguins-questions/2009/12/17/Did-the-Pens-tank-the-83-84-season-to-get-Lemieux/stories/200912170417 The most striking was trading one of the Penguins' few significant talents, defenseman Randy Carlyle, to Winnipeg for absolutely nothing -- right away, at least. Oh, the Penguins got a pretty fair return in that deal -- a first-round draft choice that became Doug Bodger, along with defenseman Moe Mantha -- but Bodger wasn't drafted until a few months after the season and Mantha was a player-to-be-named, which means he wasn't officially identified as part of the trade until the Jets' season was over. Also, there was an instance when goalie Roberto Romano had the temerity to string together a couple of strong starts late in the season, at which point general manager Ed Johnston sent him to the Penguins' farm team in Baltimore and brought up goalie Vincent Tremblay because "we want to see what he can do." What the front office almost certainly realized was that the list of things that Tremblay could do -- or at least, that he could do well -- at that point in his career did not include stopping hockey pucks with any regularity.
LabattBlue Posted October 29, 2014 Author Report Posted October 29, 2014 So it's better to have a system where a team that just misses the playoffs could end up with McDavid?
SwampD Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 So it's better to have a system where a team that just misses the playoffs could end up with McDavid? Yes. There should be nothing in sports that rewards losing.
LabattBlue Posted October 29, 2014 Author Report Posted October 29, 2014 Yes. There should be nothing in sports that rewards losing. So they should just throw 30 balls in, and whichever one comes out first, draft firsts, even if it is the Stanley Cup champs? Is that what you want?
SwampD Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 So they should just throw 30 balls in, and whichever one comes out first, draft firsts, even if it is the Stanley Cup champs? Is that what you want? 14 balls, actually. I didn't say that the draft shouldn't be set up to help struggling teams get better. It should just not reward losing on purpose.
LabattBlue Posted October 29, 2014 Author Report Posted October 29, 2014 14 balls, actually. I didn't say that the draft shouldn't be set up to help struggling teams get better. It should just not reward losing on purpose. How do you define "losing on purpose"? Are you saying the players are throwing games? The coach is telling them not to try? TM tried to change up the team in the off-season, and they still suck. How is that "losing on purpose"?
SwampD Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 How do you define "losing on purpose"? Are you saying the players are throwing games? The coach is telling them not to try? TM tried to change up the team in the off-season, and they still suck. How is that "losing on purpose"? Um, really?
Claude_Verret Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 That's why TM is a genius, with all the moves he made there is no way he can be accused of losing on purpose, even though he really is. The Sabres were going to be a bad team this year no matter what was done during the offseason, GMTM knew it all along. This is what happens when you strip a team down to the bare bones, and it's not a surprise that fans are frustrated with this reality because it's an approach that's never been tried before in Buffalo. The putrid decay of the carrion is a breath of fresh air to me.
Eleven Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 That's why TM is a genius, with all the moves he made there is no way he can be accused of losing on purpose, even though he really is. The Sabres were going to be a bad team this year no matter what was done during the offseason, GMTM knew it all along. This is what happens when you strip a team down to the bare bones, and it's not a surprise that fans are frustrated with this reality because it's an approach that's never been tried before in Buffalo. The putrid decay of the carrion is a breath of fresh air to me. I hate this. I don't even feel like going to Sunday's game. And tix aren't cheap.
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 I get a kick out of posts like this. I really do. I remember when I was young,… and had hope,… and was really stupid. ;) This assumes that not only are all these guys going to end up as NHL players, but really good NHL players, good enough to lift the Sabres to the top of the league. I just don't see it. And it might only look average when we get there. Go Tank. The Sabres took the #2 Pick and the #1 forward in the draft, who 2 years ago...was being whispered about in the same likes as McDavid. So far, Cody McCormick looks like 5x the player. The whole idea of bringing Nolan in was trying to short-circuit the pussified, losing culture. It hasn't worked. This team is probably 3 years away from even sniffing the playoffs, and 5-6 from being a top 8 team if things go well. Am I wrong to hope Ebola makes it's way to Phoenix?
shrader Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 The Sabres took the #2 Pick and the #1 forward in the draft, who 2 years ago...was being whispered about in the same likes as McDavid. Are you talking about Reinhart? A lot of the time he wasn't even projected to go #1 overall, let alone be considered to be at the same level as McDavid. Nylander was getting as much talk as Reinhart last year. McDavid has been on the map since he was at least 13 years old (scary, I know). To suggest that he ever had even a remotely similar amount of hype is absurd.
Eleven Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Are you talking about Reinhart? A lot of the time he wasn't even projected to go #1 overall, let alone be considered to be at the same level as McDavid. Nylander was getting as much talk as Reinhart last year. McDavid has been on the map since he was at least 13 years old (scary, I know). To suggest that he ever had even a remotely similar amount of hype is absurd. Yeah, it's not even close.
Crusader1969 Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Sounds right. I think the time line is something like this: 2015: still bad, but not dreadful, and fun to watch some of the kids. 2016: fringe playoff team 2017: solid playoff team, possibly a contender depending on development and acquisitions Id like to Add 2018 to 2018-2028 perennial Cup contenders.
qwksndmonster Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Um, really? What was Murray supposed to do? Thanks to Darcy, we were already in the thick of things. Were we supposed to sign as many free agents as possible and trade our future away until we were back on the treadmill of mediocrity? The Sabres took the #2 Pick and the #1 forward in the draft, who 2 years ago...was being whispered about in the same likes as McDavid. So far, Cody McCormick looks like 5x the player. The whole idea of bringing Nolan in was trying to short-circuit the pussified, losing culture. It hasn't worked. This team is probably 3 years away from even sniffing the playoffs, and 5-6 from being a top 8 team if things go well. Am I wrong to hope Ebola makes it's way to Phoenix? Reinhart, who isn't ready yet... isn't ready. Ok. Nolan is trying to change the culture, something that doesn't happen overnight, okay. I just don't get what all the outrage is about. Are you guys pissed because we aren't good yet? Are you just still sick of watching bad hockey? Because we're all watching the same team. I guess this is just how some people vent.
Drunkard Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 I hate this. I don't even feel like going to Sunday's game. And tix aren't cheap. I feel for the season ticket holders because I can't imagine dropping that much coin to watch this train wreck. This is the first year I haven't gotten Center Ice since I signed up for Directv like 8 years ago. Now I just stream the games on an illegal feed and still find myself reading this board or surfing the web rather than fully paying attention to the game. That being said you probably should've dropped your season tickets back when Darcy first brought up the idea of suffering. I know there's a waiting list and all but it's been a bad season (maybe 2 if you count the lockout shortened one) already, and there will probably be one or two more before this team is remotely competitive. I would think you'd move back up the list pretty quickly, and even if it takes a few years the amount of money you would have saved would afford you to be able to pick up plenty of marked up tickets on stubhub once the team is more competitive and you'd still come out ahead financially.
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Are you talking about Reinhart? A lot of the time he wasn't even projected to go #1 overall, let alone be considered to be at the same level as McDavid. Nylander was getting as much talk as Reinhart last year. McDavid has been on the map since he was at least 13 years old (scary, I know). To suggest that he ever had even a remotely similar amount of hype is absurd. Bologna 2 years ago we had "Shart for Reinhart" as sayings here. He was the unquestioned #1
Weave Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 I feel for the season ticket holders because I can't imagine dropping that much coin to watch this train wreck. This is the first year I haven't gotten Center Ice since I signed up for Directv like 8 years ago. Now I just stream the games on an illegal feed and still find myself reading this board or surfing the web rather than fully paying attention to the game. That being said you probably should've dropped your season tickets back when Darcy first brought up the idea of suffering. I know there's a waiting list and all but it's been a bad season (maybe 2 if you count the lockout shortened one) already, and there will probably be one or two more before this team is remotely competitive. I would think you'd move back up the list pretty quickly, and even if it takes a few years the amount of money you would have saved would afford you to be able to pick up plenty of marked up tickets on stubhub once the team is more competitive and you'd still come out ahead financially. I hate this as much as he does and I haven't spent a dime this year. This team is not why I watch sports. There is nothing about this team that is about why folks watch sports.
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 What was Murray supposed to do? Thanks to Darcy, we were already in the thick of things. Were we supposed to sign as many free agents as possible and trade our future away until we were back on the treadmill of mediocrity? Reinhart, who isn't ready yet... isn't ready. Ok. Nolan is trying to change the culture, something that doesn't happen overnight, okay. I just don't get what all the outrage is about. Are you guys pissed because we aren't good yet? Are you just still sick of watching bad hockey? Because we're all watching the same team. I guess this is just how some people vent. I'm not pissed. I couldn't care less at this point. I was pissed 7 and 6 and 5 and 4 and 3 and 2 years ago.....but I was just being negative and wearing a tinfoil hat as to where things were and where they could possibly go. I'm disappointed Nolan didn't wake anyone up. It's over.
shrader Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Bologna 2 years ago we had "Shart for Reinhart" as sayings here. He was the unquestioned #1 Unquestioned #1 does not mean he's at the level of McDavid. Anyway, go back and look at rankings as early as last year's draft and you'll see a toss up between Nylander and Reinhart for 1st overall. You'll probably also see the draft described as a weaker crop overall.
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 Unquestioned #1 does not mean he's at the level of McDavid. Anyway, go back and look at rankings as early as last year's draft and you'll see a toss up between Nylander and Reinhart for 1st overall. You'll probably also see the draft described as a weaker crop overall. 2 years ago Reinhart was the unquestioned #1 Now...people are saying Eichel is as good as McDavid. Bottom line, you have the #1 forward on your team from a draft class and he looks like a zero in the NHL so far. Even when he had a 2-1 and open ice, he showed zero skill, then yipped a pass over the head of Ennis.
SabresBillsFan Posted October 29, 2014 Report Posted October 29, 2014 How is it possible that the most successful of the 4 professional leagues does not have a draft lottery? Somebody explain why the NHL has to have a lottery? Because Bettman came from the NBA which also has a lottery(Bettman hire in 93, lottery implemented in 95)? So what if a team tanks for one year, two year, or even more? This is my point exactly? Not a fan of the lottery at all.
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