Official 2015 NHL Draft Thread

[MattPie]

Rosters for the CHL Prospects Game in St.Catharines "

 

 

http://www.sportsnet...prospects-game/

 

People are taking this Carrion thing too seriously. Oh, *that* CHL.

Edited December 17, 2014 by MattPie

[Crusader1969]

sportsnet top 30 for December:

 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/sportsnets-top-30-nhl-draft-prospects-december-17-2014/

[LGR4GM]

hmm, interesting. I like that list. Seems really well thought out.

[z-man]

There are also just as many, actually many more, examples of teams that had top picks and didn't win crap. Just look at Colorado this year. A #1 and a #2 has them competing in the CHL.

Agree bigtime. Look at the cup winners the last couple years and you see cohesive teams with winning cultures, not a bunch of good players with two superstars.

[Drunkard]

Agree bigtime. Look at the cup winners the last couple years and you see cohesive teams with winning cultures, not a bunch of good players with two superstars.

 

It's pretty even but most of the teams that have won cups in the last 10 years have had multiple top 5 picks. While Detroit, Anaheim, and Boston won without top picks there's also Chicago, LA, Carolina, and Pittsburgh that relied on high picks to win the cup, whether they kept the high picks or traded them for other assets/players that helped them win.

 

Having a few studs on your team helps to create that winning culture and it's easier to obtain stud players by drafting high for a few years even if it can be done without top picks.

[Hoss]

 

 

It's pretty even but most of the teams that have won cups in the last 10 years have had multiple top 5 picks. While Detroit, Anaheim, and Boston won without top picks there's also Chicago, LA, Carolina, and Pittsburgh that relied on high picks to win the cup, whether they kept the high picks or traded them for other assets/players that helped them win.

 

Having a few studs on your team helps to create that winning culture and it's easier to obtain stud players by drafting high for a few years even if it can be done without top picks.

 

It's actually every single team except one (Detroit) has had at least two top five picks making significant contributions to their cup roster.

[dudacek]

 

 

It's actually every single team except one (Detroit) has had at least two top five picks making significant contributions to their cup roster.

 

So acquire Hall, team him with Reinhart and we're good?

[Hoss]

 

 

So acquire Hall, team him with Reinhart and we're good?

 

Sure! Gotta have two.

 

I'd be interested in a further "study" on this. What are the numbers on playoff teams? What percentage had two or more? What are the numbers throughout the NHL?

[TrueBlueGED]

Landing McEichle would be huge but I have reached the point that whatever happens happens. Top picks are great and teams like Pitt and Chicago are great examples of the importance. There are also just as many, actually many more, examples of teams that had top picks and didn't win crap. Just look at Colorado this year. A #1 and a #2 has them competing in the CHL.

 

Seeing as only one team wins the Cup and every year there's ~5 "top picks," this is actually exactly what you would expect to see.

[...]

 

 

Seeing as only one team wins the Cup and every year there's ~5 "top picks," this is actually exactly what you would expect to see.

 

Why couldn't it apply to Buffalo, then, if they were to land a McEichel? Just asking...

[sicknfla]

 

 

Seeing as only one team wins the Cup and every year there's ~5 "top picks," this is actually exactly what you would expect to see.

 

Not what i meant. Go back 30 years and take all the #1 and #2 picks. See how many have won Cups and how many haven't.

 

 

[LGR4GM]

It's actually every single team except one (Detroit) has had at least two top five picks making significant contributions to their cup roster.

Who were Boston's. Who were Carolina's.

 

Also I don't think it is 2 top five picks that matters. It's 2 top 5 talents. So for instance from the 2012 draft, what if Zemgus turns into the 2nd or 3rd best forward? What if from 2013 Risto and Nikita are the 2nd and 3rd best defenders taken? What if Sam Reinhart is the best forward taken from the 2014 draft? What if we traded for Vladamir Tarasenko (we can't and won't) but what if we did? He is currently a top 5 talent from his draft.

 

I think you need guys who are Top 5 talent for their draft year, not necessarily top 5 picks. Also some draft years go deeper than the top 5, like 2013 for instance and most likely 2015.

[TrueBlueGED]

Why couldn't it apply to Buffalo, then, if they were to land a McEichel? Just asking...

 

It can. Nobody has said McEichel guarantees a Cup. I really wish that strawman would die and stay dead.

 

Not what i meant. Go back 30 years and take all the #1 and #2 picks. See how many have won Cups and how many haven't.

 

I see no reason to do this. Nobody has said drafting #1 guarantees a Cup. But by all means, I hope the anti-tank crowd continues to push this fallacy.

[Samson's Flow]

Who were Boston's. Who were Carolina's.

 

Also I don't think it is 2 top five picks that matters. It's 2 top 5 talents. So for instance from the 2012 draft, what if Zemgus turns into the 2nd or 3rd best forward? What if from 2013 Risto and Nikita are the 2nd and 3rd best defenders taken? What if Sam Reinhart is the best forward taken from the 2014 draft? What if we traded for Vladamir Tarasenko (we can't and won't) but what if we did? He is currently a top 5 talent from his draft.

 

I think you need guys who are Top 5 talent for their draft year, not necessarily top 5 picks. Also some draft years go deeper than the top 5, like 2013 for instance and most likely 2015.

Agreed. I don't think there would be much argument that Datsyuk isn't a top 5 talent from his draft (maybe even the top talent), despite the draft poistion being way late. That has certainly helped Detroit win the cup, but everyone keeps pointing to them as the "you don't need top picks" case.

 

For argument sake though, it is much easier to use a non-subjective metric like actual draft position to determine predictive success. It will be tough to get a consensus here on who the top 5 talents were in each draft.

[sicknfla]

 

 

It can. Nobody has said McEichel guarantees a Cup. I really wish that strawman would die and stay dead.

 

 

 

I see no reason to do this. Nobody has said drafting #1 guarantees a Cup. But by all means, I hope the anti-tank crowd continues to push this fallacy.

 

I don't think that is the thinking around here. Its more if we get McEichle we have a CHANCE at a Cup(s) and if we don't get McEichle we are destined for countless more years if mediocrity.

 

As much as I want McEichle I still have confidence in who we have already drafted and who will draft this June.

 

I think we all can agree that either way doesn't guarantee crap.

Edited December 18, 2014 by sicknfla

[shrader]

Who were Boston's. Who were Carolina's.

 

Seguin, Horton

Staal, Wesley, Tverdovsky (didn't play much)... Stillman (6th overall, so close), BrindAmour (9th overall)

Edited December 18, 2014 by shrader

[shrader]

Ha, it's that time of year where a canadian major junior team creates a rumor that a high ranked college player is going to jump ship to Canada. There's a minor thing floating around out there that Eichel will jump to the Q after the world juniors. It's like clockwork with these people. They churn out these fake rumors on such a predictable basis.

[LGR4GM]

Seguin, Horton

Staal, Wesley, Tverdovsky (didn't play much)... Stillman (6th overall, so close), BrindAmour (9th overall)

So I would say Stillman and Brind'Amour were major contributors. Seguin was not. Horton I suppose did contribute. Idk if you think that their are 5 players we are talking about every draft that's 25 guys every 5 years and most of these guys have 10 year careers. I just think this top 5 pick thing is arbitrary. What we are really discussing is top 5 talent and yes picking higher ups your chances but there are players outside the top 5 who are major contributors.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

Ha, it's that time of year where a canadian major junior team creates a rumor that a high ranked college player is going to jump ship to Canada. There's a minor thing floating around out there that Eichel will jump to the Q after the world juniors. It's like clockwork with these people. They churn out these fake rumors on such a predictable basis.

 

He's coming to Halifax. Book it.

 

GO MOOSEHEADS!!

[Stoner]

It can. Nobody has said McEichel guarantees a Cup. I really wish that strawman would die and stay dead.

 

I see no reason to do this. Nobody has said drafting #1 guarantees a Cup. But by all means, I hope the anti-tank crowd continues to push this fallacy.

 

But you think tanking is the best strategy for winning a Cup. So I would think you would want to look back so many years and see what strategy eventual Cup winners employed.

[MattPie]

He's coming to Halifax. Book it.

 

GO MOOSEHEADS!!

 

I don't think EICHEL! has the same import as the past few candidates you've been shouting about.

[Hoss]

 

Who were Boston's. Who were Carolina's.

 

Also I don't think it is 2 top five picks that matters. It's 2 top 5 talents. So for instance from the 2012 draft, what if Zemgus turns into the 2nd or 3rd best forward? What if from 2013 Risto and Nikita are the 2nd and 3rd best defenders taken? What if Sam Reinhart is the best forward taken from the 2014 draft? What if we traded for Vladamir Tarasenko (we can't and won't) but what if we did? He is currently a top 5 talent from his draft.

 

I think you need guys who are Top 5 talent for their draft year, not necessarily top 5 picks. Also some draft years go deeper than the top 5, like 2013 for instance and most likely 2015.

 

Boston's were Seguin, Horton and to a lesser extent Blake Wheeler.

Carolina's were Staal, Aaron Ward, Oleg Tverdovski, Glen Wesley, Andrew Ladd.

[shrader]

He's coming to Halifax. Book it.

 

GO MOOSEHEADS!!

 

St. John has his draft rights.

 

Boston's were Seguin, Horton and to a lesser extent Blake Wheeler.

Carolina's were Staal, Aaron Ward, Oleg Tverdovski, Glen Wesley, Andrew Ladd.

 

Wheeler was traded midseason though, so he doesn't count.

 

And wow, I didn't even think to look at Ward and Ladd when I searched over their roster.

[Crusader1969]

Just read the Leo Roth article in Rochester paper and now my blood is boiling.

 

Why are those who are Tank supporters thought of as bad fans? he says now "loyal" fans can cheer the Sabres turnaround?

why am I a disloyal Sabres fan (a fan for 40 years no less) because I believe the best way to improve the odds of the Sabres winning a cup is by sitting through 4 more months of losing hockey? There is no way I am cheering after the Sabres get totally outplayed and by some miracle pull out 2 points by winning the NHL coin flip dressed up as a shoot-out.

we argue about needing X amount of top 5 picks in the lineup needed to win the cup. the bottom line there are multiple ways of building a Stanley Cup winner but lets be honest -adding a McDavid or Eichel to the already impressive prospect pool improves the odds! Does anyone disagree??.

How are tank supporters bad fans because we want to enjoy something the Sabres haven't had since the 90's when Mogilny and Lafointaine tore the league up - a true elite forward??

 

he then points out the chances of the Sabres landing McDavid by finishing last. How many times do people haver to be hit over the head with this?? - its not about our odds of McDavid - Its about guaranteeing Eichel. Anyone who doesn't know about Eichel when they post, tweet or write articles - I then have to seriously question how much of a loyal fan that person is.

 

Rant over

[darksabre]

Just read the Leo Roth article in Rochester paper and now my blood is boiling.

 

Why are those who are Tank supporters thought of as bad fans? he says now "loyal" fans can cheer the Sabres turnaround?

why am I a disloyal Sabres fan (a fan for 40 years no less) because I believe the best way to improve the odds of the Sabres winning a cup is by sitting through 4 more months of losing hockey? There is no way I am cheering after the Sabres get totally outplayed and by some miracle pull out 2 points by winning the NHL coin flip dressed up as a shoot-out.

we argue about needing X amount of top 5 picks in the lineup needed to win the cup. the bottom line there are multiple ways of building a Stanley Cup winner but lets be honest -adding a McDavid or Eichel to the already impressive prospect pool improves the odds! Does anyone disagree??.

How are tank supporters bad fans because we want to enjoy something the Sabres haven't had since the 90's when Mogilny and Lafointaine tore the league up - a true elite forward??

 

he then points out the chances of the Sabres landing McDavid by finishing last. How many times do people haver to be hit over the head with this?? - its not about our odds of McDavid - Its about guaranteeing Eichel. Anyone who doesn't know about Eichel when they post, tweet or write articles - I then have to seriously question how much of a loyal fan that person is.

 

Rant over

 

You play. To win. The game.

 

The tank is dishonest. I find support of the concept to be unforgivable and weak. It's the sports equivalent of being a suicide bomber.