Hoss Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 So do we think that Fasching will be the McCabe type? Next year is his junior year which is often the last year the top hockey guys play. He is viewed as a guy with an NHL body and style already. Could step into the lineup at the end of next season after his season is over. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 So do we think that Fasching will be the McCabe type? Next year is his junior year which is often the last year the top hockey guys play. He is viewed as a guy with an NHL body and style already. Could step into the lineup at the end of next season after his season is over. IF he does leave College, he should be sent to Rochester for an entire year with no possibility of call up. We have to stop rushing these guys and start understanding that a full year of AHL hockey is helpful to development. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 (edited) IF he does leave College, he should be sent to Rochester for an entire year with no possibility of call up. We have to stop rushing these guys and start understanding that a full year of AHL hockey is helpful to development. It's not "rushing." Plenty of guys have jumped right from college to the pros. We should handle each guy on a case-by-case basis. Outside of Grigorenko, who have we rushed? Nobody. Ristolainen could've played all last season here, but he didn't. Same with Pysyk. Reinhart likely goes back after nine games. Zadorov hasn't been rushed. This whole "rushing prospects" thing seems to have become a myth here. It was Grigorenko, and that's it. If Hudson Fasching demands that he plays in the NHL right away after junior year like McCabe did or returns for another season of college then give him the end of next season if he appears ready for a short stint up (this is assuming that we aren't competing for a playoff spot then). Edited October 14, 2014 by Tankalicious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 It's not "rushing." Plenty of guys have jumped right from college to the pros. We should handle each guy on a case-by-case basic. Outside of Grigorenko, who have we rushed? Nobody. Ristolainen could've played all last season here, but he didn't. Same with Pysyk. Reinhart likely goes back after nine games. Zadorov hasn't been rushed. This whole "rushing prospects" thing seems to have become a myth here. It was Grigorenko, and that's it. If Hudson Fasching demands that he plays in the NHL right away after junior year like McCabe did or returns for another season of college then give him the end of next season if he appears ready for a short stint up (this is assuming that we aren't competing for a playoff spot then). good post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Ya I agree the only way he starts in Buffalo is if he demands it similar to McCabe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 (edited) It's not "rushing." Plenty of guys have jumped right from college to the pros. We should handle each guy on a case-by-case basis. Outside of Grigorenko, who have we rushed? Nobody. Ristolainen could've played all last season here, but he didn't. Same with Pysyk. Reinhart likely goes back after nine games. Zadorov hasn't been rushed. This whole "rushing prospects" thing seems to have become a myth here. It was Grigorenko, and that's it. If Hudson Fasching demands that he plays in the NHL right away after junior year like McCabe did or returns for another season of college then give him the end of next season if he appears ready for a short stint up (this is assuming that we aren't competing for a playoff spot then). You know what the Detroit Red Wings do? Every single player is required to play at least 1 year in the AHL for the team. Anthony Mantha was the first player in over a decade to come close to breaking that rule. So yes, we are rushing prospects because Grigorenko (20), Reinhart (19), Zadorov (19), and Fasching (19) all would benefit from a full season in the AHL. Jake McCabe would benefit from the same thing. 20yr old kids shouldn't make up a chunk of your roster unless they are able to play at that level and we as fans need to stop accepting this notion that a 18-20yr old who looks good on the Sabres is good in the NHL. Be prepared to suck this year and next because it will be that long before the majority of our high draft picks reach the level to compete for a real NHL roster spot and not the talentless Sabres roster spot they were all but guaranteed. This is about a potential roster with 6 players 21yrs or younger on it. That is rediculous and will just hurt their ability to develop properly. So no qwksnd that isn't a good post because it assumes that because they are a highly touted prospect they must be ready by no later than age 21 which is preposterous. good post Edited October 14, 2014 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Darnell Nurse playing his first NHL game tonight for Oilers. He was picked one spot ahead of Risto so I'm interested in seeing what kind of player he becomes. Sorry I wasn't sure what thread to put this in but for those interested and have centre ice, thought I'd throw it out there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Liger, most of our prospects will indeed spend a year in the AHL. None of the prospects you mentioned are being rushed. Tank simply stated that you take it player by player. All prospects are made differently. Some of them can make the jump, but most require seasoning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Liger, most of our prospects will indeed spend a year in the AHL. None of the prospects you mentioned are being rushed. Tank simply stated that you take it player by player. All prospects are made differently. Some of them can make the jump, but most require seasoning. Zadorov is being rushed. Ristolainen is on the edge of being rushed. Grigorenko should stay exactly where he is. Fasching should he leave after his junior year, should go the AHL for an entire season. McCabe could use a full AHL season. As far as player by player, exceptions make the jump. Girgensons can play in the NHL at 20 because he's an exception. He also had a full AHL season interestingly. We need to stop expecting 20yr olds to contribute to an NHL team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Zadorov is being rushed. Ristolainen is on the edge of being rushed. Grigorenko should stay exactly where he is. Fasching should he leave after his junior year, should go the AHL for an entire season. McCabe could use a full AHL season. As far as player by player, exceptions make the jump. Girgensons can play in the NHL at 20 because he's an exception. He also had a full AHL season interestingly. We need to stop expecting 20yr olds to contribute to an NHL team. I think you're overreacting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjd1001 Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Zadorov is being rushed. Ristolainen is on the edge of being rushed. Grigorenko should stay exactly where he is. Fasching should he leave after his junior year, should go the AHL for an entire season. McCabe could use a full AHL season. As far as player by player, exceptions make the jump. Girgensons can play in the NHL at 20 because he's an exception. He also had a full AHL season interestingly. We need to stop expecting 20yr olds to contribute to an NHL team. I agree with you totally. Although I do not think Zadarov is being rushed. What I hope is to see him play through 9 games then go back to Junior....get some time with the Amerks at the end of this year, and then give him a SHOT to make the team next year. Best case scenario for him is he plays well enough to possibly make the team next year but gets sent to Rocheter for at least a couple months...then 'works' his way into the lineup. As for the others, I agree. Next one up should be Larson, give Grigorenko at least a half season in Rochester, and a full season wouldn't be bad for him. As for Renhart, I don't think you want him in Junior this year AND next year, but if I could get away with it, I would have him in Junior, this year, Next year, then the following year spend at least part of a Season with Rochester......of course with the caveat that he can play with the Sabres earlier if he forces your hand. Prove he is one of the top 6 forwards on the team. Until he can do that, it is Juniors or Roch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 There's being patient with prospects and then there's holding them down because you're paranoid. Reinhart two more seasons in Junior plus a large pointion of a third season in Rochester? Insanity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjd1001 Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 There's being patient with prospects and then there's holding them down because you're paranoid. Reinhart two more seasons in Junior plus a large pointion of a third season in Rochester? Insanity. I said if he isn't ready, then that is the path. He's 18 now, why would it be insanity for a top prospect who is NOT a Sydney Crosby/Alex Ovechkin/Stamkos guy coming out of the draft....to expect them to contribute to your top 2 lines when he is 20 years old? Everything we have heard about him is that he projects to be a star but not a superstar...so I don't get how giving the kid seasoning until he is 20...if he needs it....how is that insanity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Just quick clarification, Sam Reinhart would only need to spend this season in juniors. Due to when his birthday falls he could play next year in Rochester, unless I have my math wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Just quick clarification, Sam Reinhart would only need to spend this season in juniors. Due to when his birthday falls he could play next year in Rochester, unless I have my math wrong. No, you're right. He would play in Rochester next season if needed because he would have compelted four junior seasons, too. I said if he isn't ready, then that is the path. He's 18 now, why would it be insanity for a top prospect who is NOT a Sydney Crosby/Alex Ovechkin/Stamkos guy coming out of the draft....to expect them to contribute to your top 2 lines when he is 20 years old? Everything we have heard about him is that he projects to be a star but not a superstar...so I don't get how giving the kid seasoning until he is 20...if he needs it....how is that insanity? If anybody in hockey thought he needed three more seasons of development before playing in the NHL he wouldn't have been the second pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Of course, the fact Detroit's picks have usually been outside the top 20 and their roster has been a little tougher to crack might have something to do with this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mjd1001 Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Just quick clarification, Sam Reinhart would only need to spend this season in juniors. Due to when his birthday falls he could play next year in Rochester, unless I have my math wrong. Actually, that is the best case scenario then. Juniors this year....hopefully some time at the end of the season with Rochester this year.....then next year a full offseason and full camp with Buffalo, and maybe the start of the season with Rochester. If he plays great there, he can then be a full time member of the Sabres in 13-14 months from now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Of course, the fact Detroit's picks have usually been outside the top 20 and their roster has been a little tougher to crack might have something to do with this. Naw. They're just smart. They probably could've sent down Datsyuk and let Mantha get some ice time last year, but they wanted to wait. Actually, that is the best case scenario then. Juniors this year....hopefully some time at the end of the season with Rochester this year.....then next year a full offseason and full camp with Buffalo, and maybe the start of the season with Rochester. If he plays great there, he can then be a full time member of the Sabres in 13-14 months from now. I'm glad he has your permission to follow that timeframe. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 (edited) Naw. They're just smart. They probably could've sent down Datsyuk and let Mantha get some ice time last year, but they wanted to wait. Actually it is Detroit policy to have their prospects finish juniors, sign their entry level deals and then report to the AHL affiliate for at least 1 full season. But hey if you want to use stupid hyperbole like sending Datsyuk down go for it. Edited October 14, 2014 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Actually it is Detroit policy to have their prospects finish juniors, sign their entry level deals and then report to the AHL affiliate for at least 1 full season. But hey if you want to use stupid hyperbole like sending Datsyuk down go for it. It's not actually a "policy." They like to stick to it, but obviously the fact that Mantha was going to make the team before his injury shows that they dont have a rule in place. The fact that they have been drafting in the 20s for a long time, as somebody pointed out earlier, is exactly why they're able to do that so often. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted October 14, 2014 Report Share Posted October 14, 2014 Actually it is Detroit policy to have their prospects finish juniors, sign their entry level deals and then report to the AHL affiliate for at least 1 full season. But hey if you want to use stupid hyperbole like sending Datsyuk down go for it. And we will see as Datsyuk and Zetterberg fade away just how brilliant Detroit is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3putt Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 You know what the Detroit Red Wings do? Every single player is required to play at least 1 year in the AHL for the team. Anthony Mantha was the first player in over a decade to come close to breaking that rule. So yes, we are rushing prospects because Grigorenko (20), Reinhart (19), Zadorov (19), and Fasching (19) all would benefit from a full season in the AHL. Jake McCabe would benefit from the same thing. 20yr old kids shouldn't make up a chunk of your roster unless they are able to play at that level and we as fans need to stop accepting this notion that a 18-20yr old who looks good on the Sabres is good in the NHL. Be prepared to suck this year and next because it will be that long before the majority of our high draft picks reach the level to compete for a real NHL roster spot and not the talentless Sabres roster spot they were all but guaranteed. This is about a potential roster with 6 players 21yrs or younger on it. That is rediculous and will just hurt their ability to develop properly. So no qwksnd that isn't a good post because it assumes that because they are a highly touted prospect they must be ready by no later than age 21 which is preposterous. It was a fantastic post. McKinnon spent no time in the minors either did Crosby or Kane. You assume a broadbrush approah assures success when it doesn't. Each case is unique. Friends who know the family said he might leave this year because they need the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 It was a fantastic post. McKinnon spent no time in the minors either did Crosby or Kane. You assume a broadbrush approah assures success when it doesn't. Each case is unique. Friends who know the family said he might leave this year because they need the money. Fasching? Hmm. That'd be interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny DangerFace Posted October 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Anyone concerned with ullmark's struggles? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted October 15, 2014 Report Share Posted October 15, 2014 Anyone concerned with ullmark's struggles? I never actually thought he'd be an NHL starter, so I'm pretty indifferent. Makarov is the only guy I see with legitimate starting potential right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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