OT - Donald Sterling comments

[WildCard]

waaaaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiitt a second.

 

what did sherman do? he spoke passionately, loudly, and angrily moments after vanquishing a rival in the most decisive and visible way possible. but because of where he comes from, the color of his skin, and how he talks, people saw this?

 

 

check yo bias, perfesser.

Google reverse image shows me you didn't even type in "thug" to get that. :P

Edited April 30, 2014 by WildCard

[MattPie]

I am really sick of hearing about this already, with hockey playoffs and basketball playoffs going on and the NFL draft just over a week away, all I keep hearing on sports is this drama about an 80 year old man saying something considered to be racist. Is what he said racist and is he a racist ? Sure seems like it, but I really don't care enough to make it a major issue all week long, get done with it already. There are serious racism issues (against all races) happening every day, but they don't have the making of a weekly reality show to garner as much attention as this has, so we don't hear about them.

 

I'm just the opposite, in the grand scheme of things, NBA and NHL playoffs are a drop in the bucket. Human decency is perhaps a bit more important for the long-term survival of the species.

 

Speak for yourself. My ancestors were poor tenant farmers in Ireland and Serbia up until the last century. They were barely above slaves for their landlords anyway, and never would have even had the thought to own another person. I understand a bunch of rich ###### 500 years ago figured out a way to get richer off the backs of others. I understand my ancestors who lived in poverty avoided a worse fate solely because of their race. I understand that there are consequences of that advantage, an advantage I enjoy to this day. But I'm not willing to blame the 99% of Europeans who lived in abject poverty from the Plague onward for the actions of the Rich.

 

Shipping slaves from England to Ireland was big business during the middle ages, but that's probably a little early (and from the sounds of it, not something your family partook in in).

 

This is how language works. Some words that used to be patently offensive, no longer are (I need an example, but don't have one at the ready -- maybe calling someone a Commie or a Red? A lunatic?). And other words that used to have no offensive connotation to them at all, suddenly are (e.g., thug).

 

Slattern would be a good one (I bet it's not even caught by the filter here). Or calling someone "yellow" at one point would be "fightin' words", but now you'd probably just get a chuckle and asked, "are you 80 or something?".

[Sabres Fan in NS]

What I think of when I hear the word "thug":

 

http://benkmoser.com...ploads/gsh2.png

 

Those dudes look like English football fans ... ,or hooligans ... ,or thugs.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

If you're using it without reference to race, creed, or color, then bully for you.

 

If you're using it to refer to people who are legitimately exhibiting thuggish behavior, even better.

 

The problem comes when people -- white people, really -- start using it to capture in a general way their distaste for elements of black American culture. And if you were unaware that that's been going on for a while, then perhaps you're on notice now.

 

So, when people used the term "thug," en masse, to refer to Sherman for his emotional outburst about Crabtree, they were, IMO, whether they intended to or not, drawing on race stereotypes and biases when they called him a thug.

 

People were speaking of Sherman's actions.....TOWARDS ANOTHER BLACK MAN!!!!!!

 

How in the F is that racist. A racist wouldn't give 2 sh!ts.

 

This world has gone mad.

[That Aud Smell]

Really don't see what the fuss is all about, certainly not worth being crucified over it.

 

Racism is inbedded in every person, the people that stand up there so high and mighty are just big hypocrites.

Not saying what he said is excusable, but im sure everyone has said something racist in his life, would be fun if it got recorded huh ?

 

People that say they aren't racist are the ones I trust the least, because i know they are lying, racism is just human nature.

 

you're hinting at something that's true, but it sounds like maybe you're taking it too far.

 

i cross paths with many african-americans in my life, for a variety of reasons. despite my very best efforts, i periodically and inevitably "step in something" in the course of ordinary interactions. example: there are 2 women i know who are roughly the same age and have mostly the same build, complexion, and hairstyle. i do not see them often - i see them from time to time, and generally not together. i don't have a reliable context where i see either of them. do i confuse the two of them, one for the other, even though i've known them both for years? i do. i hate it, but i do.

 

OTOH, there's a guy in my building who is, again, about my age, build, coloration, hair pattern, etc. (poor shmuck). one of our landlord's security guards is a middle-aged black guy. does he routinely confuse the two of us, one for the other, even though we've been walking past him for years? he does.

 

yo, das raycess.

[Marvelo]

Really don't see what the fuss is all about, certainly not worth being crucified over it.

 

Racism is inbedded in every person, the people that stand up there so high and mighty are just big hypocrites.

Not saying what he said is excusable, but im sure everyone has said something racist in his life, would be fun if it got recorded huh ?

 

People that say they aren't racist are the ones I trust the least, because i know they are lying, racism is just human nature.

 

I agree. I can say thug league about any league, like the NBA or NFL that has a pretty high rate of criminals. I never heard of

Sherman and really don't care. He's irrelevant to me, I'm just speaking as a hockey fan who hates basketball.

Spare me your hysteria, PC police and rabid fact-checkers.

[That Aud Smell]

Google reverse image shows me you didn't even type in "thug" to get that. :P

 

fair deuce. here's another

 

 

 

People were speaking of Sherman's actions.....TOWARDS ANOTHER BLACK MAN!!!!!!

 

How in the F is that racist. A racist wouldn't give 2 sh!ts.

 

This world has gone mad.

 

Corrected that for you.

 

Are you suggesting that a racist needs to care about what a black guy is doing, or to whom he's doing it in order to take the time, or feel the need to make a racially disparaging remark about him? If so, I strongly disagree.

[shrader]

I know, right! We're down to like 150,000 words available for use. another 6-8 millennia of this PC BS and we'll be back to communicating with hand gestures and "ughs". Or, we could attempt to address the underlying hatred and bias that is causing these words to be co-opted into something new and unacceptable. Either way, really.

 

My statement was obvious hyperbole. My point is that it is ridiculous that you can use a word to describe one person, but you're suddenly a bigot if you use it for someone else. Sometimes a word is just a word and there's no evil intentions behind it. One moron's use of a word (or apparently in this case, several morons) does not mean every single use of that word is vile. We keep moving closer to a point where just about every word used in conversation will be put to the magnifying glass to see if there is a possible racial connotation to every single syllable. The race card is played far too often and it is losing its meaning because of it.

 

And yes, we do need to address that underlying hatred and bias, but let's be realistic here. That will never be eliminated. Whether it is bias towards race, sexual orientation, gender, anything else... it is always going to exist. We need to stop labeling everyone as intolerant and instead focus on the ones who truly are.

[Eleven]

OT-Game of Thugs.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

So, I remember that thread. But there is a distinct difference in being guilty by association and being guilty. Moreover, this is direct, proven guilt. The argument can be made that those against fracking shouldn't be supporting the Sabres. It could be argued that Pegula's influence on the environment from fracking is equally as damning as being involved in the mortgage securities debacle.

 

 

 

 

 

Direct proven guilt? The guy was getting extorted through a taping of a private conversation. He's guilty of being ignorant. He also has the highest ratio of African American players on his team in the league. Some making hundreds of millions of dollars....

 

Some say Pegula has a "loose" connection to the situation at Penn State. What if per chance there was a tape circulating out there, taped at a cocktail event without Pegula's knowledge. In it he is talking to someone high up in the Penn State food chain and discussing the upcoming indictment of Sandusky and what it means for the sports program. Pegula then says something like "So Jerry went a little too far with some of the kids....we need to make sure we keep these teams afloat. This thing needs to go away. I'll do whatever I can to make sure that arena gets built and the football team doesn't lose the coaching staff and recruits."

 

If that tape was made public, what should the NHL do about it? There was nothing illegal that Sterling did in that tape....just as there isn't anything Pegula would have done illegal in that scenario. This is some spooky stuff how fast and how far things got with the NBA.

 

 

 

 

 

fair deuce. here's another

 

 

 

 

 

Corrected that for you.

 

Are you suggesting that a racist needs to care about what a black guy is doing, or to whom he's doing it in order to take the time, or feel the need to make a racially disparaging remark about him? If so, I strongly disagree.

 

Yes....

 

Holy crap....can you imagine the reverse outcry if he said that about Wes Welker? There would be marches in the streets.....

[K-9]

Really don't see what the fuss is all about, certainly not worth being crucified over it.

 

Racism is inbedded in every person, the people that stand up there so high and mighty are just big hypocrites.

Not saying what he said is excusable, but im sure everyone has said something racist in his life, would be fun if it got recorded huh ?

 

People that say they aren't racist are the ones I trust the least, because i know they are lying, racism is just human nature.

 

Simply not true. Racism is a learned behavior. Not everyone gets those lessons.

 

Human nature is a lot of things.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[MattPie]

Simply not true. Racism is a learned behavior. Not everyone gets those lessons.

 

Human nature is a lot of things.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Well, there is a certain inbuilt fear of people who don't look like you (or your family, really, since before mirrors you wouldn't know what you looked like). One of those natural selection things, I'd guess. But realistically after around age 5 in our society it's a learned behavior.

[That Aud Smell]

One moron's use of a word (or apparently in this case, several morons) does not mean every single use of that word is vile.

 

Sorry, man.

 

EDITED: Sorry, man - again. Here's how I tweaked what you said: One moron's use of a word (or apparently in this case, several hundred thousand morons) does not mean tend to make every single use of that word is vile part of the same cultural usage.

 

What if per chance there was a tape circulating out there, taped at a cocktail event without Pegula's knowledge. In it he is talking to someone high up in the Penn State food chain and discussing the upcoming indictment of Sandusky and what it means for the sports program. Pegula then says something like "So Jerry went a little too far with some of the kids....we need to make sure we keep these teams afloat. This thing needs to go away. I'll do whatever I can to make sure that arena gets built and the football team doesn't lose the coaching staff and recruits."

 

If that tape was made public, what should the NHL do about it?

 

If they want to protect their brand? They'd better force him to sell the franchise PDQ.

 

Are you suggesting that a racist needs to care about what a black guy is doing, or to whom he's doing it in order to take the time, or feel the need to make a racially disparaging remark about him? If so, I strongly disagree.

Yes....

 

I can't let this go. So, if a racist cop out of Spike Lee's central casting rolls by a group of jive-talking homeboys, and cares not a wit for any of them, but sees one gesticulating and verbally dressing down another in the group, and says derisively, "Yup. Typical fu*kin' thug ..." that's -- that's what? Maybe we're talking past each other, but I do think you're missing my point.

Edited April 30, 2014 by That Aud Smell

[shrader]

Sorry, man.

 

Can you please not completely bastardize my posts like that? I'd much rather not have it appear that I posted something which I never actually said. That practice of modifying someone's post and still leaving it as a quote has always bugged me.

 

But anyway, the basic point looks like since many other people misuse a word, I'm not supposed to use it at all? I can't accept that. Sometimes a spade is a spade (and according to a quick google search, me using that phrase is in fact racist). Richard Sherman acted like an ass, but somehow the discussion morphed into how everyone is racist. It's funny how that works out.

[Iron Crotch]

Simply not true. Racism is a learned behavior. Not everyone gets those lessons.

 

Human nature is a lot of things.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Actually there is a ton of research on this topic, much of it using response latencies to measure non-conscious attitudes of implicit racism. The findings are pretty strong that there is a level of implicit racism in most/all folks. Basically we non-consciously prefer those who are most like ourselves. Explicit racism is a whole other category. We can consciously over-ride these non-conscious attitudes. With the exception of guys like Sterling, most of us do a pretty good job of this. ;)

[LastPommerFan]

My statement was obvious hyperbole. My point is that it is ridiculous that you can use a word to describe one person, but you're suddenly a bigot if you use it for someone else. Sometimes a word is just a word and there's no evil intentions behind it. One moron's use of a word (or apparently in this case, several morons) does not mean every single use of that word is vile. We keep moving closer to a point where just about every word used in conversation will be put to the magnifying glass to see if there is a possible racial connotation to every single syllable. The race card is played far too often and it is losing its meaning because of it.

 

And yes, we do need to address that underlying hatred and bias, but let's be realistic here. That will never be eliminated. Whether it is bias towards race, sexual orientation, gender, anything else... it is always going to exist. We need to stop labeling everyone as intolerant and instead focus on the ones who truly are.

 

yeah, I caught the hyperbole (and responded in kind, i think)

 

I do think the race card is played too much. I think it's all about class. I think it has everything to do with poverty. and I think the 13th Amendment had very little impact on the Wealthiest Americans' ability to effectively own people.

[IKnowPhysics]

Can you please not completely bastardize my posts like that? I'd much rather not have it appear that I posted something which I never actually said. That practice of modifying someone's post and still leaving it as a quote has always bugged me.

 

When I see quotes with strike outs and bold text, I tend to think that it isn't the quoted's original words, but the words of the poster.

 

Is that racist?

[shrader]

Actually there is a ton of research on this topic, much of it using response latencies to measure non-conscious attitudes of implicit racism. The findings are pretty strong that there is a level of implicit racism in most/all folks. Basically we non-consciously prefer those who are most like ourselves. Explicit racism is a whole other category. We can consciously over-ride these non-conscious attitudes. With the exception of guys like Sterling, most of us do a pretty good job of this. ;)

 

At least I now know why I hate all of you. I've always wondered why.

 

When I see quotes with strike outs and bold text, I tend to think that it isn't the quoted's original words, but the words of the poster.

 

Is that racist?

 

Yes, yes it is. That bold text is darker than the rest.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

I can't let this go. So, if a racist cop out of Spike Lee's central casting rolls by a group of jive-talking homeboys, and cares not a wit for any of them, but sees one gesticulating and verbally dressing down another in the group, and says derisively, "Yup. Typical fu*kin' thug ..." that's -- that's what? Maybe we're talking past each other, but I do think you're missing my point.

 

No...a racist wouldn't care because Sherman was talking down to and insulting Crabtree....another black man. By calling out Sherman, people are saying his actions are unbecoming of an intelligent human being who is supposed to be a professional and show respect for his opponent, the game itself, and the situation. He was selfish, angry, demeaning, and was using verbal intimidation. Hence.....thug. By calling out Sherman, you are therefore protecting and empathizing for Crabtree. A racist wouldn't give 2 iodas.

 

That's the problem. There are actual people out there who look down on a certain race, class, gender....whatever. With all the "outrage" these days....the majority of people that have common sense and would like to discuss or call out certain actions now get lumped in with a-holes. This leads good hearted people to adopt Swamp's view of ..."I just hate everybody"....because there is so much PC bullcrap these days....it's easier just to shut up and stay to yourself.

 

The world used to be fun. People could tell the difference, or allowed a difference between jokes/stereotypes, and actual demeaning activity. Sherman was a thug...he was involved in demeaning activity.

 

Heck...have you heard Snoop-Dog's response to this Clippers story? He throws out terms like Cracker and White Devil. You know what....I don't care because it's funny and the guy deserves any flack he gets.

 

 

[IKnowPhysics]

Yes, yes it is. No, no it's not.

 

Oh, ok. Good.

[That Aud Smell]

But anyway, the basic point looks like since many other people misuse a word, I'm not supposed to use it at all? I can't accept that.

 

I think the idea is that you ought to deploy it with some care, given what it's become.

 

Sometimes a spade is a spade (and according to a quick google search, me using that phrase is in fact racist).

 

No joke. I was once in a stuffy Manhattan conference room with close to 20 execs, experts, accountants, and attorneys trying to close a deal -- and that phrase got spit out at the COO of the acquiring entity, who was black. Sh!t got very real at that moment.

 

Richard Sherman acted like an ass, but somehow the discussion morphed into how everyone is racist. It's funny how that works out.

 

Now there's a fine race-neutral word. How about clown? Idiot? Buffoon? Blowhard? Jacka$s? Dipsh!t? Diva? Those all work, too.

 

Thug? Meh, no.

 

The findings are pretty strong that there is a level of implicit racism in most/all folks. Basically we non-consciously prefer those who are most like ourselves.

 

Beliedat.

 

When I see quotes with strike outs and bold text, I tend to think that it isn't the quoted's original words, but the words of the poster.

 

Is that racist?

 

perfect.

[LastPommerFan]

 

Now there's a fine race-neutral word. How about clown? Idiot? Buffoon? Blowhard? Jacka$s? Dipsh!t? Diva? Those all work, too.

 

 

Why you gotta be a sexist?

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

I think the idea is that you ought to deploy it with some care, given what it's become.

 

 

Now there's a fine race-neutral word. How about clown? Diva?

 

Nope....I hear Diva....I thing either Ella Fitzgerald, Aretha Franklin.....or overpaid, egomaniac, black wide receivers.....

 

See how that works? It's true though.

[That Aud Smell]

No...a racist wouldn't care because Sherman was talking down to and insulting Crabtree....another black man.

 

That's just so wrong. A (white) racist doesn't limit his attention to or commentary on the conduct of black guys to situations where the black guys are acting against or talking about white people. That's nonsense.

 

A (white) racist in this case would almost certainly become activated by Sherman's antics because they were, in the mind of someone who's painting with the broad brush of racial stereotypes, the antics that are exemplary of the behaviors in which guys who look like that engage.

 

What a weird predicate.

Edited April 30, 2014 by That Aud Smell

[Eleven]

Nope....I hear Diva....I thing either Ella Fitzgerald, Aretha Franklin.....or overpaid, egomaniac, black wide receivers.....

 

See how that works? It's true though.

 

And I think of opera singers.