Mark Pysyk

[SwampD]

Bah I say, bah! Give me more flow to the game and ice-long rushes, not a greater probability for a butt goal.

Get CI and watch some other games. There is plenty of flow to games where one of the teams is not the Sabres.

[TrueBlueGED]

You can only let players and equipment grow for so long, allowing them to fill up more net, until you try to balance that out with bigger nets. Shooters are so incredibly accurate today, but it doesn't matter when they have next to nothing to shoot at. Give them a bigger target and scoring will increase... and not just fluke goals either.

I'm not saying nets shouldn't be increased in size, but if that's the penultimate solution that gets implemented, then I think the league has failed.

[LGR4GM]

I'm not saying nets shouldn't be increased in size, but if that's the penultimate solution that gets implemented, then I think the league has failed.

Agreed. It would be nice if the league cracked down on the interference that occurs on almost every single offensive zone entry. 

[TrueBlueGED]

Get CI and watch some other games. There is plenty of flow to games where one of the teams is not the Sabres.

There's more flow, but I wouldn't say there's plenty. Some games are great, but I think it's too hit or miss even when both teams are good. Give me post-lockout hockey back (and no it's not just that the Sabres were good then...i find the Kings play a very boring brand of hockey, even if they're great).

[nfreeman]

Bah I say, bah! Give me more flow to the game and ice-long rushes, not a greater probability for a butt goal.

Get CI and watch some other games. There is plenty of flow to games where one of the teams is not the Sabres.

I'm not saying nets shouldn't be increased in size, but if that's the penultimate solution that gets implemented, then I think the league has failed.

There's more flow, but I wouldn't say there's plenty. Some games are great, but I think it's too hit or miss even when both teams are good. Give me post-lockout hockey back (and no it's not just that the Sabres were good then...i find the Kings play a very boring brand of hockey, even if they're great).

 

I'm with TBPhD on this (except for the misuse of the word "penultimate," of course).  Scoring is well down league-wide, not just in Buffalo.  And while I agree with Shrader that the goalie pads are way too big, I think it comes down to having 4 or 5 defenders jamming up the net-front area whenever the offensive team is able to maintain possession and work the cycle.  It's just too hard to get a shot through.

 

It would be a major change (and is thus, unfortunately, pretty unlikely IMHO), but I think some kind of illegal defense/restricted area will be needed.

 

I'll also point out that IMHO this is Bettman's biggest failure as commish.  Each of the other major sports has been able to tweak its rules to increase offense and scoring, and to adjust to the defensive adjustments that invariably occur -- the NHL is the only one that continues to allow defense to suffocate offense.

[Trettioåtta]

I'm with TBPhD on this (except for the misuse of the word "penultimate," of course).  Scoring is well down league-wide, not just in Buffalo.  And while I agree with Shrader that the goalie pads are way too big, I think it comes down to having 4 or 5 defenders jamming up the net-front area whenever the offensive team is able to maintain possession and work the cycle.  It's just too hard to get a shot through.

 

It would be a major change (and is thus, unfortunately, pretty unlikely IMHO), but I think some kind of illegal defense/restricted area will be needed.

 

I'll also point out that IMHO this is Bettman's biggest failure as commish.  Each of the other major sports has been able to tweak its rules to increase offense and scoring, and to adjust to the defensive adjustments that invariably occur -- the NHL is the only one that continues to allow defense to suffocate offense.

 

I would way rather bigger goals or smaller goalie equipment (or even larger ice!) than bubble hockey. It's one thing to restrict the movement of the goalie, it is a whole new ball game to start screwing with where forwards can defend etc.

[dudacek]

I've always been curious to see what a game would be like with today's NHL players playing the rules from 100 years ago: a rover, goalies can't drop to their knees, no forward pass...

 

More stick handling, more hits, rugby on ice.

Edited February 25, 2015 by Djuda Chekhov

[Samson's Flow]

I've always been curious to see what a game would be like with NHL players playing the rules from 100 years ago: a rover, goalies can't drop to their knees, no forward pass...

My brain can't even comprehend how hockey would be played like that. Especially the 'no forward pass' rule. How is that possibly enforced?

[qwksndmonster]

What's a rover?

[Samson's Flow]

What's a rover?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rover_(ice_hockey)

 

Apparently he was the seventh man on the ice that had no formal position and just floated around. Not sure how that's different from the rest of the forwards.

[dudacek]

Rover was often the best skater and stick handler. When I hear it described, I always think about Phil Housley.

 

The defencemen we called point and cover point. Did that mean they had different roles and one guy hung back all the time?

Edited February 25, 2015 by Djuda Chekhov

[darksabre]

I'm with TBPhD on this (except for the misuse of the word "penultimate," of course). Scoring is well down league-wide, not just in Buffalo. And while I agree with Shrader that the goalie pads are way too big, I think it comes down to having 4 or 5 defenders jamming up the net-front area whenever the offensive team is able to maintain possession and work the cycle. It's just too hard to get a shot through.

 

It would be a major change (and is thus, unfortunately, pretty unlikely IMHO), but I think some kind of illegal defense/restricted area will be needed.

 

I'll also point out that IMHO this is Bettman's biggest failure as commish. Each of the other major sports has been able to tweak its rules to increase offense and scoring, and to adjust to the defensive adjustments that invariably occur -- the NHL is the only one that continues to allow defense to suffocate offense.

The restricted zone idea is interesting until you realize that pulling players out of that zone makes it easier for the goalie to see and stop the puck. That traffic is important to messing with a goalie.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

What's a rover?

 

*I'm A Rover*

 

 

:flirt:

[bcsaberks]

As fond as I am of the term ganked, the Sabres didn't overtly do anything wrong. He wasn't even the Amerks highest scoring defenseman.

 

That being said, he should be super pissed and motivated to prove himself. I just hope it doesn't screw up the draft position.

 

 

He was held back to mature.  Look at the Red Wings organization; that do that all the time.  Their "young" talent is typically mid-20s.  Teemu Pulkkinen is just getting his first look at the bigs and he's 23. If Pysyk had been with their system, he'd just be getting his first look.

We as a fan base want every good prospect rushed to the big club but holding all but the best back until they are (more than) ready for the NHL level is pretty standard practice. Just because an AHL player is better than an NHL player does not mean we should insert him on the big team.

Ok, yeah, he wasn't great in AHL this year but still he was ready, they said he was ready last year, then he gets injured and Zadorov has weird KHL stuff, and the Tank, and Pysyk (if it's 2 way?) is boned out of some serious money.  Just saying, I'm a GMTM fan all day long, but if I'm a 1st or 2nd rounder I think I want to get drafted by an org that I'm likely to move up with quickly so I can get paid.  The Detroit example, meh, I think that sucks for the player. Maybe you can make the case that they are more likely to succeed, etc.  Maybe.  Yeah, if I'm Pysyk I think I'm kinda pissed.  And then compare that to boy wonder who can't get out of bed on time, or Mezaros who can't get the puck of the zone. +3 and a goal. Let's see if he keeps it up.  I'm a big fan of his game.

[Doohicksie]

I think you don't understand how the whole hockey business works.  You may not like it, but that's the way the system works.  You say it sucks to be in the Detroit system since they take longer to come up, but they tend to have great success in terms of being a perennial Cup contender and occasional winner.  The very fact that they hold some talent back contributes to that success; when they have an injury they can bring up a Jakub Kindl or Teemu Pulkkinen and not have any drop off. No one owes those guys anything but I bet if you asked they'd prefer to have a shot at being on a Cup contender at the end of the season (than be on a CHL contender for the whole season).

 

Doing the same for Pysyk, McCabe, Grigo, etc., is the best thing for them and for the team. If you're in professional sports, you're not entitled to major league money just because you think you deserve it. You have to earn it *and* the major league team needs to fit you into their team. And even then, as long as you-re on a two-way contract you might get sent down. No one owes you anything.

 

And comparing to those who are already up on the big club is not productive. Keep your head down and work on your own game. The rest is just a distraction from the ultimate goal. Show you're worth it and you'll earn your chance. Don't begrudge others their success.

My brain can't even comprehend how hockey would be played like that. Especially the 'no forward pass' rule. How is that possibly enforced?

I believe it was no forward passing in the offensive zone. I would imagine it would be enforced like off-sides; when it happened the whistle would blow and the faceoff come outside the zone.

Edited February 25, 2015 by Neuvirths Perchatka

[dudacek]

The blueline was actually brought in to legitimize the forward pass. All of a sudden you could do it in inside the newly created zone.

[Samson's Flow]

I believe it was no forward passing in the offensive zone. I would imagine it would be enforced like off-sides; when it happened the whistle would blow and the faceoff come outside the zone.

 

 

The blueline was actually brought in to legitimize the forward pass. All of a sudden you could do it in inside the newly created zone.

I still don't get it... :unsure:

Edited February 25, 2015 by Tchaikovsky по Boyes

[TrueBlueGED]

I'm with TBPhD on this (except for the misuse of the word "penultimate," of course).  Scoring is well down league-wide, not just in Buffalo.  And while I agree with Shrader that the goalie pads are way too big, I think it comes down to having 4 or 5 defenders jamming up the net-front area whenever the offensive team is able to maintain possession and work the cycle.  It's just too hard to get a shot through.

 

It would be a major change (and is thus, unfortunately, pretty unlikely IMHO), but I think some kind of illegal defense/restricted area will be needed.

 

I'll also point out that IMHO this is Bettman's biggest failure as commish.  Each of the other major sports has been able to tweak its rules to increase offense and scoring, and to adjust to the defensive adjustments that invariably occur -- the NHL is the only one that continues to allow defense to suffocate offense.

 

You use innit how you want, and I'll use penultimate how I want! I'd use hating mornings as an excuse, but my brain generally works by the time I made that post, so I'll just go sit in a corner and feel shame.

The restricted zone idea is interesting until you realize that pulling players out of that zone makes it easier for the goalie to see and stop the puck. That traffic is important to messing with a goalie.

 

Well, you could semi-restrict it with respect to the number of players allowed there. Still allow for some traffic, but maybe create enough net-front space to allow for some skill there rather than weird bounces.

 

I think the heart of the issue is neutral zone play and zone entries. As far as I'm concerned, lining 4 guys up on the blue line to force a dump in should be a penalty. There has to be some way to reduce the congestion and free up the middle of the ice to allow for some more back and forth action--I simply refuse to believe that nothing can be done.

[Doohicksie]

I think the heart of the issue is neutral zone play and zone entries. As far as I'm concerned, lining 4 guys up on the blue line to force a dump in should be a penalty. There has to be some way to reduce the congestion and free up the middle of the ice to allow for some more back and forth action--I simply refuse to believe that nothing can be done.

I can think of several things. First of all, VIGOROUSLY enforce interference of defenders against forwards at the blue line. Allow that a player in control of the puck may precede the puck into the offensive zone (i.e. you can drag it in behind you). Third, reduce the size of the trapezoid such that there is a zone 1 foot wide along the boards where the goalie can't play the puck (i.e., move the edge of the trapezoid furthest from the goal line toward the goal line by a foot). The result would be that a goalie couldn't stop a puck that is rimmed around the boards.

[MattPie]

No forward pass: think rugby (or those last second multi-lateral plays in football).

[dudacek]

I still don't get it... :unsure:

You ever watch rugby? They carry the ball forward until stopped by contact, then try to flip it to a guy coming from behind.

That's what it used be like.

 

Then they put in the blue lines and said you can pass it forward now but not over the opposition blueline into the offensive zone.

[bcsaberks]

I think you don't understand how the whole hockey business works.  You may not like it, but that's the way the system works.  You say it sucks to be in the Detroit system since they take longer to come up, but they tend to have great success in terms of being a perennial Cup contender and occasional winner.  The very fact that they hold some talent back contributes to that success; when they have an injury they can bring up a Jakub Kindl or Teemu Pulkkinen and not have any drop off. No one owes those guys anything but I bet if you asked they'd prefer to have a shot at being on a Cup contender at the end of the season (than be on a CHL contender for the whole season).

 

Doing the same for Pysyk, McCabe, Grigo, etc., is the best thing for them and for the team. If you're in professional sports, you're not entitled to major league money just because you think you deserve it. You have to earn it *and* the major league team needs to fit you into their team. And even then, as long as you-re on a two-way contract you might get sent down. No one owes you anything.

 

And comparing to those who are already up on the big club is not productive. Keep your head down and work on your own game. The rest is just a distraction from the ultimate goal. Show you're worth it and you'll earn your chance. Don't begrudge others their success.

 

I believe it was no forward passing in the offensive zone. I would imagine it would be enforced like off-sides; when it happened the whistle would blow and the faceoff come outside the zone.

Ask any player aged 19-23, "3 million bucks, and no playoffs, or $500k and a 15% chance at winning the cup"  100% of players take $3 million bucks.  F what's best for the team.  Take care of #1, you got 10 - 15 years to cash in.  You are suggesting being OK with just chilling in the A despite having mad game?  "better for the team man!  they might win the cup!"  No way.  

 

And I'm not saying anything is owed.  F that noise.  And I also understand it's not that simple.  Still I think Pysyk might of missed out on some spending cash this year, and I think the tank is part of the reason.   Then consider he's an RFA this year.  Again, if he keeps the production up....where's PASabre?  This is trial material!   :P

[Samson's Flow]

You ever watch rugby? They carry the ball forward until stopped by contact, then try to flip it to a guy coming from behind.

That's what it used be like.

 

Then they put in the blue lines and said you can pass it forward now but not over the opposition blueline into the offensive zone.

I watch rugby pretty regularly. In my first post it wasn't so much that I didn't understand it, it's more I can't even begin to fathom how that would look. The modern NHL is 180* different from a "rugby-style" game. No outlet passes from the defense, no goal hanging, etc.

 

I suppose you would see a lot more "weave" plays and drop passes.

[nfreeman]

Well, you could semi-restrict it with respect to the number of players allowed there. Still allow for some traffic, but maybe create enough net-front space to allow for some skill there rather than weird bounces.

 

I think the heart of the issue is neutral zone play and zone entries. As far as I'm concerned, lining 4 guys up on the blue line to force a dump in should be a penalty. There has to be some way to reduce the congestion and free up the middle of the ice to allow for some more back and forth action--I simply refuse to believe that nothing can be done.

 

While I would rather focus on the net-front area than the neutral zone, I like your idea too, and more importantly, your attitude is right on.

[Samson's Flow]

While I would rather focus on the net-front area than the neutral zone, I like your idea too, and more importantly, your attitude is right on.

I just worry creating forbidden zones on the ice will a) reduce the flow/skating in the game and b) clutter up the ice with markings making the playing surface resemble a European League jersey covered in ads.

 

Hockey isn't like other sports in that it is played on ice and doesn't lend itself well to stopping and starting/quick change of direction. forbidden zones are easier in basketball/lacrosse/etc. because the players are on foot.