Official 2014 NHL Draft thread

[LGR4GM]

Or defencemen

#oilerstankingforekblad

Unlike the Sabres the Oilers need defensemen.

 

Would be an incredible hull. Now sure if we could pull it off, but who knows. We have the assets to move up.

I personally do not believe Darcy Regier could pull it off. He can trade current players for stuff as evident from the Hodgson trade to the Moulson trade but I am not sure if he has the nuts to pull off a huge draft trade. That trade would be moving from 16-20th up to 4-7th.

[Derrico]

Another goal and assist for dal colle tonight. For the record I won't keep posting all of his stats. Just wanted to say I watched a bunch of the game today and he's a big kid who can score. Problem is he is projected to go anywhere from 3 to 10 right now and I have a feeling it will be closer to 3 to 5 by the draft. Since we're destined for pick one or two I'm not sure we would take him over Reinhart or ekblad and he will likely be too high to trade up for. We shall see

[Robviously]

Another goal and assist for dal colle tonight. For the record I won't keep posting all of his stats. Just wanted to say I watched a bunch of the game today and he's a big kid who can score. Problem is he is projected to go anywhere from 3 to 10 right now and I have a feeling it will be closer to 3 to 5 by the draft. Since we're destined for pick one or two I'm not sure we would take him over Reinhart or ekblad and he will likely be too high to trade up for. We shall see

I think the key takeaway is that we should have a couple options if we're drafting in the top 3 (which, let's face it, we have to hope we are come June).

 

Last year there were 7 great prospects at the top of the draft. We were drafting 8th. (Technically one of those 7 made it to us but he was sketchy enough that we played it safe with Risto.)

 

The Sabres need top line forwards. It looks like there are a few at the top of the draft in 2014. I hope we get the best one.

[Hoss]

I used to think that Darcy and his assistants are good at drafting. Boy was I wrong. Go back to 1997. Three all-stars out of 149 players.

 

http://www.hockeydb....dr00005054.html

 

I really hope he's not around come next draft.

Edited November 4, 2013 by DStebb

[Derrico]

 

I think the key takeaway is that we should have a couple options if we're drafting in the top 3 (which, let's face it, we have to hope we are come June).

 

Last year there were 7 great prospects at the top of the draft. We were drafting 8th. (Technically one of those 7 made it to us but he was sketchy enough that we played it safe with Risto.)

 

The Sabres need top line forwards. It looks like there are a few at the top of the draft in 2014. I hope we get the best one.

 

Ya we should certainly have some options. Does there appear to be a Crosby or mcdavid? No. However I think we will get a guy certainly having top line potential who will hopefully have a long career in buffalo.

[Robviously]

I used to think that Darcy and his assistants are good at drafting. Boy was I wrong. Go back to 1997. Three all-stars out of 149 players.

 

http://www.hockeydb....dr00005054.html

 

I really hope he's not around come next draft.

Up until last year, he had one draft pick in the top ten during that entire stretch (Vanek at no.5 overall in 2003). Last summer we got to no.8 overall for Risto.

 

How many all-stars come from the 2nd half of the first round or later?

 

Also, the scouting department has changed around a bunch since 1997. And Pegula has expanded our scouting staff since he bought the team.

[LGR4GM]

http://fansided.com/2013/10/20/2014-nhl-draft-prospect-profile-scouting-report-getting-to-know-sam-reinhart-kootenay-ice/

 

Reinhart is the guy we want. Trade up, down, sideways or tank the entire damn season but he is our guy. Gritty, hard working, leader, hates to lose... I want him and drafting another defensman won't cut it anymore.. Sam Reinhart is the guy after watching some video and hearing him speak I have no doubt.

[Robviously]

Ya we should certainly have some options. Does there appear to be a Crosby or mcdavid? No. However I think we will get a guy certainly having top line potential who will hopefully have a long career in buffalo.

I'm not ready to have a meltdown because there's no Crosby in this draft. You don't need someone that special to win the Cup. You need talent, but you don't need a once in a generation guy like Crosby.

 

Let's find some first-liners and keep building.

[Hoss]

Up until last year, he had one draft pick in the top ten during that entire stretch (Vanek at no.5 overall in 2003). Last summer we got to no.8 overall for Risto.

 

How many all-stars come from the 2nd half of the first round or later?

 

Also, the scouting department has changed around a bunch since 1997. And Pegula has expanded our scouting staff since he bought the team.

 

A lot. All Stars come from all over the draft. It's his job to find them. I was just noting that in general, though.

 

But either way there are WAY too many big misses for him.

 

First two round misses: Novotny, Schiestel, Persson, Zagrapan, Gogulla, Funk, Fabry, Novotny, Kryukov, Dicaire, Heisten, Bartovic, Milley, Kristek.

 

Hits: Roy, Pominville, Vanek.

 

Still not sure: Myers, Ennis, Enroth and anybody drafted in the last four years.

 

The rest are guys that wouldn't be considered failures or successes.

Edited November 4, 2013 by DStebb

[Lanny]

I used to think that Darcy and his assistants are good at drafting. Boy was I wrong. Go back to 1997. Three all-stars out of 149 players.

 

http://www.hockeydb....dr00005054.html

 

I really hope he's not around come next draft.

not that it changes the analysis bu I count 4: Campbell, Pominville, Miller & Vanek

[Hoss]

not that it changes the analysis bu I count 4: Campbell, Pominville, Miller & Vanek

 

I was quoting something I saw elsewhere, but you're correct. The place I found 3/149 must've been older than Pommers first and only appearance.

[Derrico]

 

I'm not ready to have a meltdown because there's no Crosby in this draft. You don't need someone that special to win the Cup. You need talent, but you don't need a once in a generation guy like Crosby.

 

Let's find some first-liners and keep building.

 

Completely agree.

[Robviously]

A lot. All Stars come from all over the draft. It's his job to find them. I was just noting that in general, though.

 

But either way there are WAY too many big misses for him.

The draft is insanely hard to gauge after the first few picks. This isn't the NFL.

 

I don't like a lot of Regier's picks either (Kryukov over Orpik in 2000) but the Sabres have been pretty good at finding talent in the later rounds. Look at some of the other teams' draft histories for comparison.

[Hoss]

Every team finds good players in the late rounds. Not taking anything away from Regier in that respect, but it's not uncommon.

[LGR4GM]

The draft is insanely hard to gauge after the first few picks. This isn't the NFL.

 

I don't like a lot of Regier's picks either (Kryukov over Orpik in 2000) but the Sabres have been pretty good at finding talent in the later rounds. Look at some of the other teams' draft histories for comparison.

Some drafts can be yes. It appears to me that even after seeing how the Sabres interview and draft guys NOW, that before a lot of it was based off of videos and short talks with players at the combine. It many of these instances the Sabres look to try and capture lightning in a bottle as opposed to getting someone good. They seemed to draft several boom or bust type players before the 2012 draft and only now have been getting 1 sure thing and 1 maybe with the 2 picks they have.

 

My issue with this strategy isn't that they are employing it but that they lack vision in their employment of it. Last year they went the safe route with Ristolainen which is fine but they had the opportunity to move up and take someone better. The reason they didnt was because of this head in the sand mentality we see all to often. Ristolainen was their guy and as long as they could get him so be it. They lacked the vision to say what if we did move up? Who would be available and better than Ristolainen that we could draft? Again it was Risto will be there at 8 no worries. I am still astounded they past on Monahan but that is a different conversation.

 

This year let us say that we draft 2nd. That is a good guess at this point. Now the Sabres are looking at the top 3 guys who will probably be Ekblad, Reinhart, Draisaitl. Now let us say they Sabres take Sam Reinhart. That is a good safe pick and an excellent choice. Now we have another 1st rounder say pick#17. The 5th place team really wanted a Defender, let us say that was Edmonton but the guy they wanted (Ekblad) is gone. They are willing to trade down. Vision says you give them your 17th and your 32nd to start and see how far that moves the chains. The reason? We can't keep playing everything safe. We need to take top of the draft talent and sacrifice a guy in the 2nd who statistically will not play in the NHL is a great way to go. Lets say that 17th, 32nd is not enough to move all the way up. That is when you take a look into your prospect pool for a decent young AHL defender.

 

The point and problem with Darcy is he makes trades where he wins because he gets more. Sometimes it is about losing a trade in the short term to win it in the long term. You trade 17, 32 and ahl guy and draft Dal Colle. Dal Colle becomes a solid top 6 guy. Even if 1 or 2 of those other picks or players pans out it doesn't matter because you got what YOU needed. DR lacks vision.

[LGR4GM]

Edit: I should add that in 2012 when they traded up to get Girgensons that showed vision... I just doubt it is something Darcy can or would sustain.

[Trettioåtta]

Every team finds good players in the late rounds. Not taking anything away from Regier in that respect, but it's not uncommon.

 

How does 3/149 compare to other teams?

 

Not to mention, there is more to a draft than finding the all star players. You also need to find the supporting cast. Moreover, now the all star teams are voted for that really skews who gets in. I remember when Crosby was 3rd in the racings and he hadn't played a game that entire year

[Hoss]

 

 

How does 3/149 compare to other teams?

 

Not to mention, there is more to a draft than finding the all star players. You also need to find the supporting cast. Moreover, now the all star teams are voted for that really skews who gets in. I remember when Crosby was 3rd in the racings and he hadn't played a game that entire year

 

That's why it's not my main argument.

[dudacek]

I really think using their second-rounders to move up is definitely part of the plan.

They did it with Girgensons and had something on the table with Columbus to get Domi.

 

As many have said: they are going to have trouble finding room to give contracts to all those high picks.

[Derrico]

I don't know LGR. Just because a trade doesn't take place does not mean it was not explored. I would have to think a GM and or anyone in management is looking at all scenarios and not just crossing their arms and taking the 'safe' pick. In one breath you're saying they have been taking one safe pick and one high risk/reward and then you are saying what, they're not making enough risk/reward moves? As you said, they went with the risky pick of Grigs and then had the balls/vision whatever you want to call it and moved up to take their other guy; Girgs. As for this past draft, I think the scouting staff and Devine in particular really wanted Risto as their guy. I (and you and most ppl) wanted them to make that Sekera trade and pick up Lindholm but obviously Risto was who they wanted and thought he'd be there at 8 thus not wasting assets.

 

As for Dal Colle, as badly as I want him on this team, it's going to take a heck of a lot to move up from 17 or 18 to 4 or 5 (where he'll go) and I doubt a second rounder will be nearly enough to move you up that far in the first. A team like Edmonton who wants a D may slide a few spots if there are obvious forward picks at say pick 4 or 5 but they're not going to move down to 17. Say we have the #5 pick this draft and there are two D prospects sitting in the next projected spots, would you take a second rounder and ahl guy to move down to 17 or 18?

[BuffaloSoldier2010]

I don't know LGR. Just because a trade doesn't take place does not mean it was not explored. I would have to think a GM and or anyone in management is looking at all scenarios and not just crossing their arms and taking the 'safe' pick. In one breath you're saying they have been taking one safe pick and one high risk/reward and then you are saying what, they're not making enough risk/reward moves? As you said, they went with the risky pick of Grigs and then had the balls/vision whatever you want to call it and moved up to take their other guy; Girgs. As for this past draft, I think the scouting staff and Devine in particular really wanted Risto as their guy. I (and you and most ppl) wanted them to make that Sekera trade and pick up Lindholm but obviously Risto was who they wanted and thought he'd be there at 8 thus not wasting assets.

 

As for Dal Colle, as badly as I want him on this team, it's going to take a heck of a lot to move up from 17 or 18 to 4 or 5 (where he'll go) and I doubt a second rounder will be nearly enough to move you up that far in the first. A team like Edmonton who wants a D may slide a few spots if there are obvious forward picks at say pick 4 or 5 but they're not going to move down to 17. Say we have the #5 pick this draft and there are two D prospects sitting in the next projected spots, would you take a second rounder and ahl guy to move down to 17 or 18?

 

So running with the hypothetical scenario, EDM needs D, and we have it in spades, do you keep your late first and offer up ristolainen for that pick and see where it gets you? Is snagging two high caliber forwards that important THIS YEAR?

Edited November 4, 2013 by BuffaloSoldier2010

[Derrico]

So running with the hypothetical scenario, EDM needs D, and we have it in spades, do you keep your late first and offer up ristolainen for that pick and see where it gets you? Is snagging two high caliber forwards that important THIS YEAR?

 

Interesting question. I say no. Pysyk, Risto and Zadarov (possibly McCabe) are going to be the cornerstones of this D once our rebuild is over. I wouldn't want to move any of them.

 

The more I hear about Ekblad the more I think he will be ranked #1 by seasons end. That could be a great thing if we select second; giving us the best forward prospect as ranked by our scouts. I know it's a long way out but the question is what do you do if Sam R goes first? I've read a few reports saying this kid could be a legit top end Dman. The whole BPA versus team need would then come into play. I know, we're a long way away from knowing the final rankings and projections. Interesting discussion in a season filled with anger and disappointment.

[LGR4GM]

So running with the hypothetical scenario, EDM needs D, and we have it in spades, do you keep your late first and offer up ristolainen for that pick and see where it gets you? Is snagging two high caliber forwards that important THIS YEAR?

No I would not trade Ristolainen to move up to 4/5th in this draft. It is important to snag 2 high caliber forwards however the Sabres would not move Risto and part of the reason I want us to go after 2 forwards is because of the promising young defenders in the system which inlcude Pysyk, Risto, Zadorov and hopefully Jake McCabe.

 

Interesting question. I say no. Pysyk, Risto and Zadarov (possibly McCabe) are going to be the cornerstones of this D once our rebuild is over. I wouldn't want to move any of them.

 

The more I hear about Ekblad the more I think he will be ranked #1 by seasons end. That could be a great thing if we select second; giving us the best forward prospect as ranked by our scouts. I know it's a long way out but the question is what do you do if Sam R goes first? I've read a few reports saying this kid could be a legit top end Dman. The whole BPA versus team need would then come into play. I know, we're a long way away from knowing the final rankings and projections. Interesting discussion in a season filled with anger and disappointment.

If we go 2nd and Reinhart gets taking first... hmmmm it would depend on where other forwards are ranked and how they look. Remember Jones was ranked 1st or tied with MacKinnon and he fell to 4th. Personally I would have to see the drop off btw the forward and the defender but if you chose to go Forward and the guy is gone at #2 than trade back a little if needed.

[BuffaloSoldier2010]

No I would not trade Ristolainen to move up to 4/5th in this draft. It is important to snag 2 high caliber forwards however the Sabres would not move Risto and part of the reason I want us to go after 2 forwards is because of the promising young defenders in the system which inlcude Pysyk, Risto, Zadorov and hopefully Jake McCabe.

I'm in this boat as well. In my opinion darcy and friends DO have some vision. That's why we have so many D men. traditionally they take longer to develop. But for the sake of the argument, i think edmonton would certainly like an opportunnity at a player like rasmus after a year in the NHL in this scenario. it could land you that second elite scorer, so the question becomes do you want an incredibly solid Defense or a more extensive / deep / dynamic top 6?

 

In my opinion we already have pieces in place to top out a top six if we go through the next couple seasons near the bottom and draft intelligently. Armia, Grigorenko, Hodgson, Foligno, Reinhart? Mcdavid? if everything falls in place who knows, we could be sitting pretty, but that doesnt leave a whole lot of room for error. it all comes down to what you want the team to look like.

[LGR4GM]

I'm in this boat as well. In my opinion darcy and friends DO have some vision. That's why we have so many D men. traditionally they take longer to develop. But for the sake of the argument, i think edmonton would certainly like an opportunnity at a player like rasmus after a year in the NHL in this scenario. it could land you that second elite scorer, so the question becomes do you want an incredibly solid Defense or a more extensive / deep / dynamic top 6?

 

In my opinion we already have pieces in place to top out a top six if we go through the next couple seasons near the bottom and draft intelligently. Armia, Grigorenko, Hodgson, Foligno, Reinhart? Mcdavid? if everything falls in place who knows, we could be sitting pretty, but that doesnt leave a whole lot of room for error. it all comes down to what you want the team to look like.

I am not counting on McDavid next year as at best we have a 25% chance of drafting him. That being said I noticed in the ISS October rankings 1 player who I am very interested in has moved up the list. Anton Karlsson. He is climbing boards all over and I think may end up a top 5 guy come June. For me he is just outside the 3 guys I referred to in previous posts but Depending on what i can watch of his game this next month he may edge up.

 

2 important things to remember on Karlsson: 1) He was born in August of 96 meaning he is one of the youngest players in the this draft. The cutoff I believe is September 15th 1996 so he is young and good. 2) He plays in the Swedish J20 SuperElite and has 9g 7a for 16pts in 16gp. The kid is playing really well considering he is 17 and I would love to see him in a Sabres jersey. Also he plays a solid 2way game.