Worst team in Franchise History

[JJFIVEOH]

Please read my posts on that page.

 

I said exactly what would happen over the next 3 years by them not rebuilding then. The culture is STILL the same today, and they have half-heartedly, in slow motion started a rebuild. Now you are entrusting the SAME GM who it took 3 years to come to the realization of what I said 3 years ago....we wasted 3 offseasons of finding a true captain and leaders to show the kids how to play, and are 3 years behind the curve in the quantity of draft picks that could have been developing.

 

How anyone in the world wants to tell me that I am "negative", have a "narrative", or whatever.....your GM and team just wasted 3 years and got paid $5 million to just start the plan I advocated 3 years ago. But "what has he done wrong?"

 

There were others here who thought along the lines I did.

 

We are supposed to get excited about a GM who is 3 years behind the curve of a message board and we are even more of a laughingstock today?

 

JEESH!!!!

 

You win

[sicknfla]

 

 

I wasn't talking about 2011. I was talking about the end of last year when the 'tank and pray' strategy seemed to gain strength.

 

 

 

Huberdeau is above and beyond anything BFLO has under 25 at the moment. There was more energy out of that team last night against the Bruins than the Sabres have had all year. Goaltending is the only issue they have going forward unless Markstrom gets his head out of his ass.

 

Want to know the difference? They've had the patience to wait three years to build a solid team going forward. They didn't ask for a total rebuild and then cry about it 9 games into the first season.

 

Have you been to their arena during the last 3 years? For that matter have you ever been there. Different fanbase. Hockey is not a big deal in southern Florida.

[nfreeman]

Huberdeau is above and beyond anything BFLO has under 25 at the moment. There was more energy out of that team last night against the Bruins than the Sabres have had all year. Goaltending is the only issue they have going forward unless Markstrom gets his head out of his ass.

 

Want to know the difference? They've had the patience to wait three years to build a solid team going forward. They didn't ask for a total rebuild and then cry about it 9 games into the first season.

Can we go back to the end of last year and gauge what percentage of Sabres fans wanted to tank to get the best picks? Or does that not fit this week's narrative?

 

The salary cap point is completely irrelevant.

 

Actually Florida is doing it the right way. If you've watched them you would know.

 

Who is "they?" What is the "narrative of the week?" WTF are you talking about?

 

The cap point, in case you missed it, is that the Sabres are pretty close to the cap and still stink -- which is a good indicator of incompetence at the top. This remains true even if other teams are closer to the cap than the Sabres are.

 

And how in the world is Florida doing it the right way? After a 94-point year in 2011-2012, they were 15-33 last year (and dead last in the EC) and are 2-6 this year.

[JJFIVEOH]

Have you been to their arena during the last 3 years? For that matter have you ever been there. Different fanbase. Hockey is not a big deal in southern Florida.

 

Considering you were one of the people in support of tanking and rebuilding, how can you possibly question my viewpoint when you can't even stand by your own?

 

Who is "they?" What is the "narrative of the week?" WTF are you talking about?

 

The cap point, in case you missed it, is that the Sabres are pretty close to the cap and still stink -- which is a good indicator of incompetence at the top. This remains true even if other teams are closer to the cap than the Sabres are.

 

And how in the world is Florida doing it the right way? After a 94-point year in 2011-2012, they were 15-33 last year (and dead last in the EC) and are 2-6 this year.

 

They...... Management, fans, media....... It's not that difficult.

 

Unless you've paid attention to the Panthers rebuild, I can't help you. I'm not giving a complete summary.

 

As far as cap space, are you seriously going to hold that against the team when a large portion of that . Nevermind................ This shouldn't need an explanation.

[Kristian]

I don't know if there was a thread with a poll about tanking... but I would have said yes last year to tanking for more reasons than I care for.

 

Same here, with one slight change.

 

Tanking? I'm in, was for the past 3-4 seasons.

 

Tanking with Regier in charge of turning those high picks into hockey players, and a team? Now, who can I put this.....? How about : NO!!! ######!! WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:wallbash:

[That Aud Smell]

Huberdeau is above and beyond anything BFLO has under 25 at the moment. There was more energy out of that team last night against the Bruins than the Sabres have had all year. Goaltending is the only issue they have going forward unless Markstrom gets his head out of his ass.

 

You had me for all of this. I appreciated the feedback and insight. Truly. I just don't have enough free time to follow the Sabres all that closely, let alone another team. Absent this sort of information, if Florida were to end up in the conference's top 5 next year, I'd have been be all like "Whoa, hey - what's going on in Florida?"

 

They've had the patience to wait three years to build a solid team going forward. They didn't ask for a total rebuild and then cry about it 9 games into the first season.

 

Like Freeman, this is where I got confused. You used "they" there twice to refer, presumably, to two different collective nouns. Confused the hell out of me. Ambiguous antecedents, and such.

 

Who is "they?"

 

And how in the world is Florida doing it the right way? After a 94-point year in 2011-2012, they were 15-33 last year (and dead last in the EC) and are 2-6 this year.

 

That's what I was saying. Just looking at the #s, they seem -- not so good.

[nfreeman]

They...... Management, fans, media....... It's not that difficult.

 

Unless you've paid attention to the Panthers rebuild, I can't help you. I'm not giving a complete summary.

 

As far as cap space, are you seriously going to hold that against the team when a large portion of that . Nevermind................ This shouldn't need an explanation.

 

So...you have no logic or facts to support your position, and you're just going to rely on obnoxiousity?

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

Same here, with one slight change.

 

Tanking? I'm in, was for the past 3-4 seasons.

 

Tanking with Regier in charge of turning those high picks into hockey players, and a team? Now, who can I put this.....? How about : NO!!! ######!! WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:wallbash:

 

BINGO!

 

There had to be a solid dozen regulars begging for this 3 years+. The whole point was to gut the core, start from scratch, and most importantly, get a new GM in here. Even in that thread back in early 2011, I wasn't clamoring for Ruff to go. As long as we had a new chef and new ingredients, Ruff would have been "new" to them. Instead, all 3 facets remained the same and the clamoring and disgust just grew to a point where they all had to go.

 

Somehow Darcy is the one who will survive all this. Unbelievable.

 

The roster was salvageable back then with enough of a turnover and gutting. We'd be ready to roll now going forward. Now the stagnation has given us another 3 years of losing culture, and the guys that were young then either haven't moved forward (Myers, Ennis, Stafford)...or pretty much outright regressed.

 

It was such an easily avoidable situation.

[JJFIVEOH]

You had me for all of this. I appreciated the feedback and insight. Truly. I just don't have enough free time to follow the Sabres all that closely, let alone another team. Absent this sort of information, if Florida were to end up in the conference's top 5 next year, I'd have been be all like "Whoa, hey - what's going on in Florida?"

 

 

 

Like Freeman, this is where I got confused. You used "they" there twice to refer, presumably, to two different collective nouns. Confused the hell out of me. Ambiguous antecedents, and such.

 

 

 

That's what I was saying. Just looking at the #s, they seem -- not so good.

 

When Tallon was hired, he said he was wiping the slat clean. And I mean CLEAN. After the season, he talked to each player and asked them who wanted to be a part of it. Anybody else was getting shipped out. He made a ton of trades and loaded up with EIGHT 1st and 2nd round picks in two years. The following year they had three players on the opening day roster that were on the previous year. Tallon didn't want to rush the young guys into the lineup so he picked up a bunch of retreads to fill in the holes and try to entertain the fans in the meantime. Turns out, they gelled well enough to win the division. The team wasn't expecting that, and that roster certainly wasn't going to be the roster moving forward. It was strictly temporary.

 

Last year was supposed to be the bad year. It was supposed to be the year some of the kids made the transition in the NHL. Unfortuantely, some ended up getting here sooner than later because of some serious injury issues. But, it wasn't that bad of a situation because they got to see how far some of them had progressed. Some of the new kids need one more year, or at least a portion of this year. One or two more still need to make the transition from juniors, but the bulk of the new 'core' is already here or just about to crack the lineup. The difference between Tallon and Darcy is that Tallon filled the holes with seasoned vets that may or may not pan out. If they don't pan out, it's no big deal because they were signed for pennies. But they serve as role players for the young guys for a year or two. Versteeg is back and healthy, Weaver is turning out to be a killer D-man, Bjugstad is getting better day by day and Barkov looks like he belongs here. Huberdeau looks like a seasoned vet and is acting like a captain.

 

The Panthers lost last night, but they looked like 10X the teams the Sabres were (I was watching both games at the same time). One young guy they have a problem with is Markstrom. He has huge talent but hasn't matured yet. He has a terrible knack for letting in the majority of his goals in the first 5 minutes of a game. Tim Thomas is a band-aid. It wouldn't surprise me if Tallon makes a deal for a goaltender in the next month or two if Markstrom doesn't wake up. This team could easily be 4-4 with no where to go but up. They play like they care, if the Panthers and Sabres are supposed to be the two worst teams in the conference there is going to be about a 15 point difference between 15th and 16th.

 

So...you have no logic or facts to support your position, and you're just going to rely on obnoxiousity?

 

 

Tell me something, are you seriously going to tell us that cap space is an indicator of how good a team is supposed to be? You seem to be an intelligent person, I just can't see how you would actually subscribe to this theory. If you don't, then there really is no need for this discussion.

[That Aud Smell]

Tallon didn't want to rush the young guys into the lineup so he picked up a bunch of retreads to fill in the holes and try to entertain the fans in the meantime. Turns out, they gelled well enough to win the division. The team wasn't expecting that, and that roster certainly wasn't going to be the roster moving forward. It was strictly temporary.

 

Um. Yes, please. (Btw, is Campbell one of those re-treads? Or was he shipped out?)

 

if the Panthers and Sabres are supposed to be the two worst teams in the conference there is going to be about a 15 point difference between 15th and 16th.

 

There is logic to this: Don't take the fact that the Panthers are the 3rd or 2nd worst team in the Conference as any indication that the Sabres (presumably the worst) are proximate to them in terms of building a winner.

[JJFIVEOH]

 

 

Um. Yes, please. (Btw, is Campbell one of those re-treads? Or was he shipped out?)

 

There is logic to this: Don't take the fact that the Panthers are the 3rd or 2nd worst team in the Conference as any indication that the Sabres (presumably the worst) are proximate to them in terms of building a winner.

 

With Tallon's ties to Chicago, it was a mutual deal to help the Hawks with cap issues by shipping Campbell to Florida. Not to mention Tallon is big on Campbell.

[inkman]

What's really, really ###### frustrating is that a heroic run led by Porter, Flynn and Ruhwedal (ok so maybe others were chipping in) is what is kept this team from starting the rebuild 6 months ago. If rumors are true, they could have landed (or possibly will) MacKinnin, Yakapov and O'Reilly. I mean talk about a rebuild. They have the assets. All they needed to do was lose out last year but trading away their captain and two most veteran defenseman made them better. Grrrr....

[TrueBlueGED]

Well, I agree that difference-makers at forward don't become available that often, but I think there are a couple of them that do make it to UFA or get traded each year -- e.g. Nash, Gaborik, Parise, Kovy, Kessel, James Neal, Mike Richards and Jeff Carter have all moved within the past few years.

 

Most importantly, I think if you have a good team that isn't a cup contender and lacks elite offensive talent, but still has good coaching, goaltending, defense, system, toughness, forechecking and backchecking, you can, if you GM it correctly, jump in opportunistically when those difference-makers become available and be attractive enough to those players that they will sign with you or waive NTCs. So you have a culture of winning that nourishes your homegrown talent and hopefully cultivates them into becoming really good players while at the same time attracting outside players.

 

Or you can ride the elevator into the basement like the Sabres are doing and hope for the very slim chance that a player you draft will be not only a great player but the kind of leader that inspires his teammates -- who have been marinating in a poop-stew of loserdom for their entire careers -- to raise their games. So if you get Toews (and you also get Kane and Keith and Seabrook), or if you get Crosby (and you also get Malkin and Staal) -- yes, it can work. But it hardly ever does.

 

Nash: NMC, Sabres not on the list.

Gaborik: NMC, but waived it for Columbus, so maybe? Would we have been willing to part with our 1st round pick last year in the deal?

Parise: Wanted to play at home, no shot. Even said if it wasn't Minnesota, he was staying in NJ.

Kovy: Possible missed opportunity.

Kessel: Would Boston have expected the Sabres to be bad enough to take their 1sts for Kessel? Well Buffalo was 10 points above Toronto in the standings that year, so I'm not convinced. But maybe.

Neal: First, I think he's a 20-goal 50-point guy if he isn't on Malkin's wing. That aside, did we have a Goligoski-like piece to trade for him?

Richards: Moved for Simmonds and Schenn and a 2nd. We didn't have a prospect of Schenn's caliber (he was a 5th overall pick, after all ;) ) and I'm pretty sure we didn't have an emerging power forward like Simmonds to send back.

Carter: Voracek and a 1st (became Couturier at #8) and 3rd. LA acquired him for Jack Johnson (#3 overall!!!!) and a 1st. We sure didn't have a Voracek-like prospect to be the centerpiece, and we were a playoff team, meaning our 1st was much less valuable than Columbus'. The second move, did we have a Johnson-like player to deal?

 

What I'm getting at is of the big name offensive players moved, we only had a realistic shot at a couple of them IMO.

 

As far as how different teams can win the Cup, I think high end offense is absolutely necessary. LA is the only team since the dead-puck era Devils to win the Cup without being in the top-10 in the league in scoring. I believe a stingy defense and quality two-way play can keep a team competitive and win a playoff round here or there, but to have a good chance at winning the whole thing you want to have a high end offense.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Nash: NMC, Sabres not on the list.

Gaborik: NMC, but waived it for Columbus, so maybe? Would we have been willing to part with our 1st round pick last year in the deal?

Parise: Wanted to play at home, no shot. Even said if it wasn't Minnesota, he was staying in NJ.

Kovy: Possible missed opportunity.

Kessel: Would Boston have expected the Sabres to be bad enough to take their 1sts for Kessel? Well Buffalo was 10 points above Toronto in the standings that year, so I'm not convinced. But maybe.

Neal: First, I think he's a 20-goal 50-point guy if he isn't on Malkin's wing. That aside, did we have a Goligoski-like piece to trade for him?

Richards: Moved for Simmonds and Schenn and a 2nd. We didn't have a prospect of Schenn's caliber (he was a 5th overall pick, after all ;) ) and I'm pretty sure we didn't have an emerging power forward like Simmonds to send back.

Carter: Voracek and a 1st (became Couturier at #8) and 3rd. LA acquired him for Jack Johnson (#3 overall!!!!) and a 1st. We sure didn't have a Voracek-like prospect to be the centerpiece, and we were a playoff team, meaning our 1st was much less valuable than Columbus'. The second move, did we have a Johnson-like player to deal?

 

What I'm getting at is of the big name offensive players moved, we only had a realistic shot at a couple of them IMO.

 

As far as how different teams can win the Cup, I think high end offense is absolutely necessary. LA is the only team since the dead-puck era Devils to win the Cup without being in the top-10 in the league in scoring. I believe a stingy defense and quality two-way play can keep a team competitive and win a playoff round here or there, but to have a good chance at winning the whole thing you want to have a high end offense.

Hockey Heaven!!!

[Jsixspd]

Keep looking Saturday. My guess is at worst you can get in for $18. Lower level for $35.

 

In every game except the opener, you could get in for $12. Club seats $29 and lower $24 for majority.

 

If this gets disgustingly bad, I may pull off a Drane Campaign at the arena. I'd pay $20 a game in the clubs just for the train wreck.

 

How the heck you get seats that cheap? I checked the Sabres website this AM, and the nosebleed seats were still $53

[inkman]

How the heck you get seats that cheap? I checked the Sabres website this AM, and the nosebleed seats were still $53

Stub hub?

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Stub hub?

 

Yes....the Sabres site actually links stubhub under their tickets tab. So in essence they are competing with themselves.

[inkman]

 

 

Yes....the Sabres site actually links stubhub under their tickets tab. So in essence they are competing with themselves.

Yep 36 tickets at $23 a pop available right now.

[Robviously]

Here, something to actually feel good about:

Buffalo Sabres ‏@BuffaloSabres1m

.@zemgus94 @mpysyk03 Mikhail Grigorenko @zadorov61 stopped by @HeritageCenters tonight. #CommunityAssist pic.twitter.com/DJzmfLaZhJ

[Wyldnwoody44]

I'm fairly young still in terms of following the sabres.... I can remember about 20 years of hockey from childhood til now, and I can honestly say this is the absolute worst team I've seen ever.... I don't have the care or time to look up stats to see if mathematically we will be the worst. And at some point this negativity will even out somewhat, but I cannot remember a team duller, lifeless, heartless and just awful as I'm seeing this year... We have no game plan, no grit, no scoring, worst passing in the league, no PP and no excitement to be seen anywhere. Even the coach is an automaton just like our GM. I wonder how long before fans start making half empty buildings appear?

[Jsixspd]

Yep 36 tickets at $23 a pop available right now.

 

Thanks, guys! I've NEVER been to a Sabres game - watched a gazillion on TV and listened to many on the radio. I should get my ass down there.

[darksabre]

Here, something to actually feel good about:

Buffalo Sabres ‏@BuffaloSabres1m

.@zemgus94 @mpysyk03 Mikhail Grigorenko @zadorov61 stopped by @HeritageCenters tonight. #CommunityAssist pic.twitter.com/DJzmfLaZhJ

 

Don't get PA started. He hates this stuff.

[sicknfla]

 

 

Considering you were one of the people in support of tanking and rebuilding, how can you possibly question my viewpoint when you can't even stand by your own?

 

 

 

They...... Management, fans, media....... It's not that difficult.

 

Unless you've paid attention to the Panthers rebuild, I can't help you. I'm not giving a complete summary.

 

As far as cap space, are you seriously going to hold that against the team when a large portion of that . Nevermind................ This shouldn't need an explanation.

 

Do you even read the posts or do you just start typing away your next argument? If you thoroughly read my posts and then applied a little intelligence you would know how I stand.

 

Instead you choose to type your adolescent little comments.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

Don't get PA started. He hates this stuff.

 

But I love Petey's manboobs in that concord grape cardigan........

[spndnchz]

Good stuff guys. Well, except for manboobs lol.