Around the NHL - 2013-2014

[Rico7]

Chelios, Niedermyer, and Shanahan inducted into Hockey Hall of Fame.

 

The entire 2013 HHOF Class with no Andreychuk:

@TheFourthPeriod

Congrats to Chris Chelios, Scott Niedermayer, Brendan Shanahan, Geraldine Heaney and Fred Shero on being inducted into the HHOF.

 

Andreychuk hosed again. Not really sure if those elected are really worthy over him. This class seems pretty weak.

[LGR4GM]

What 4 guys? Myers, McNabb, McCabe, Ruhweedle, Pysyk? Last year salary $15 million for a dozen NHL points?

 

How about the Sabres top 4 last year?

 

Ehrhoff, Myers, Sekera, Weber..... 165 Games....49 Pts.....248 hits.....122 of which were Weber's

 

McDonaugh, Del Zotto, Girardi, Staal.......160 Games....65 Pts....335 Hits...

 

The Rangers top 4 are pretty evenly distributed as well. They all come in between .4-.5 pts per game and 2 hits per game give or take. With those 4 you can take up close to 80% of the ice time and not skip a beat. Plus they have Stralman who is an ok defender.

 

Suffering vs. Playoff runs. That's what we've seen, and that's what I expect to see in the near future.

Actually the future 4 I was thinking are... Myers 23, Ristolainen 18, Zadorov 18 and McCabe 19... I was thinking that if those 4 pan out in 3-4years we could have a solid physical defense that can score points.

[LaFontaineToMogilny]

Andreychuk hosed again. Not really sure if those elected are really worthy over him. This class seems pretty weak.

 

Can't argue with Chelios and Niedermyer going in on the first ballot, but it's stupid that Andreychuk is not in the Hall of Fame yet. I would also like to note that Alaxander Mogilny also should have been in the HoF a long time ago.

[Taro T]

Can't argue with Chelios and Niedermyer going in on the first ballot, but it's stupid that Andreychuk is not in the Hall of Fame yet. I would also like to note that Alaxander Mogilny also should have been in the HoF a long time ago.

I'm fine w/ the 3 male players that were selected this year. Don't pay close enough attention to the women's game to say whether Heaney should have gone in now or waited. Kind of torn on Shero getting in. Won the only 2 SC's that expansion teams won until the Isles broke through ending the Original 6's stranglehold on the SC, but did it via thuggery and 1 of the best goalies of his era. The league would have been headed, IMHO, to a dark place had he won 3 in a row. But he definitely was a successful coach. MAYBE if his teams weren't thugs he wouldn't have waited more than 2 decades longer than Bowman to get in.

 

As for Andreychuk, I expect he will eventually get in and I believe he belongs in the Sabres HoF, but I just don't believe that being a good player for a long time warrants HoF inclusion. Andy was never a SPECIAL player. Unless you count being the 1st player ever to play for 2 different teams in a year he broke 50 goals, which is actually a kind of special in a notorious way, again IMHO. He only broke 40 3 times and his skating left a LOT to be desired.

 

I fully expect Mogilny to end up in the HoF after a few more Russians get there.

[LaFontaineToMogilny]

I'm fine w/ the 3 male players that were selected this year. Don't pay close enough attention to the women's game to say whether Heaney should have gone in now or waited. Kind of torn on Shero getting in. Won the only 2 SC's that expansion teams won until the Isles broke through ending the Original 6's stranglehold on the SC, but did it via thuggery and 1 of the best goalies of his era. The league would have been headed, IMHO, to a dark place had he won 3 in a row. But he definitely was a successful coach. MAYBE if his teams weren't thugs he wouldn't have waited more than 2 decades longer than Bowman to get in.

 

As for Andreychuk, I expect he will eventually get in and I believe he belongs in the Sabres HoF, but I just don't believe that being a good player for a long time warrants HoF inclusion. Andy was never a SPECIAL player. Unless you count being the 1st player ever to play for 2 different teams in a year he broke 50 goals, which is actually a kind of special in a notorious way, again IMHO. He only broke 40 3 times and his skating left a LOT to be desired.

 

I fully expect Mogilny to end up in the HoF after a few more Russians get there.

 

Andreychuck is one of the top 30 point scorers and top 15 goal scorers of all time. Career Power Play goals leader, and played over 1600 games. That's good enough for me.

 

Mogilny, what can I say, should have been the first from his line (Bure, Fedorov, Mogilny) to go into the Hall, but alas. The time will come. As far as I know there are only one player who has been inducted into the Hall of Fame as a Sabre. When Mogilny and Andreychuk finally gets their day it will be 4. Also, how come #39 is not retired in Buffalo yet?

[Taro T]

Andreychuck is one of the top 30 point scorers and top 15 goal scorers of all time. Career Power Play goals leader, and played over 1600 games. That's good enough for me.

 

Mogilny, what can I say, should have been the first from his line (Bure, Fedorov, Mogilny) to go into the Hall, but alas. The time will come. As far as I know there are only one player who has been inducted into the Hall of Fame as a Sabre. When Mogilny and Andreychuk finally gets their day it will be 4. Also, how come #39 is not retired in Buffalo yet?

 

Never selected to 1st or 2nd AS teams; only played in 2 AS games. If not for captaining TB to the SC, I don't expect that he'd ever get in. As it is, he's going to wait a few more years. And, as stated before, I wouldn't put him in the NHL HoF. That should be reserved for great players, not those that were good for a long time. I've got no issues with him being in the Sabres HoF.

[26CornerBlitz]

‏@adater

Nathan MacKinnon, No. 1 NHL pick, signs 3-year deal with Avalanche http://www.denverpost.com/avalanche/ci_23628582/nathan-mackinnon-no-1-nhl-pick-signs-3 …

 

via @denverpost

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

Well if you are going to compare the Rangers blueline to the steaming loaf of poo the Sabres took last year they will look top 5.

 

But as for top pairings? McDonough-Girardi?

 

I think that is a decent second pair, but I am not too impressed with that as a top pair. They seemed pretty adequate because they stayed at home to protect the house and played very boring, high percentage hockey.

 

Their best defender was Lundquist IMO.

 

We'll see what happens with Vigneault.

 

That's the point X...you have 4 defenders who are #2-#3....they can move the puck, play d, hang in there on the physical side, work the power play....and each of them is a +1 at one of those attributes.

 

And if the Sabres D is doo-doo....they are bringing back the same 4 at $15 million, swapping Tallinder for Sekera. What is the Rangers cap hit on their D?

[carpandean]

And if the Sabres D is doo-doo....they are bringing back the same 4 at $15 million, swapping Tallinder for Sekera. What is the Rangers cap hit on their D?

 

I think you are missing his point. He's admitting that the Sabres' D was and likely will be overpriced doo-doo, so using them to measure the Rangers' D is a poor choice of measuring stick. Compare them to a real defense - which, again, the Sabres don't have - and he feels that you find them less impressive.

 

Oh, and side note: using the Rangers' hit statistics is always misleading. Whoever counts hits at MSG clearly wants to prove to someone that they are working hard.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

I think you are missing his point. He's admitting that the Sabres' D was and likely will be overpriced doo-doo, so using them to measure the Rangers' D is a poor choice of measuring stick. Compare them to a real defense - which, again, the Sabres don't have - and he feels that you find them less impressive.

 

Oh, and side note: using the Rangers' hit statistics is always misleading. Whoever counts hits at MSG clearly wants to prove to someone that they are working hard.

 

We shall see....I have an open wager with TrueBlue on the Rangers winning the cup the next 2 years. I got a bit nervous when Torts left, but AV may actually be better for their D-men. Offense....not so sure.

 

And on the hit front....discount the totals 15% if that is the case. Del Zotto is the least physical of the 4 and I would have traded Myers for him 2 years ago.

 

 

Actually the future 4 I was thinking are... Myers 23, Ristolainen 18, Zadorov 18 and McCabe 19... I was thinking that if those 4 pan out in 3-4years we could have a solid physical defense that can score points.

 

We COULD have a lot of stuff over the years. My advice would be to try and find common currency. What would it have taken in the draft to land each of the Ranger defensemen? What could you have gotten for Myers or McCabe? My guess is that NY is at least 2 1st round draft picks better when you put it together. Pretty much what Vanek and Miller are worth at this point.....

[Hoss]

Andreychuk hosed again. Not really sure if those elected are really worthy over him. This class seems pretty weak.

 

Who deserves it more: Andreychuk or Mogilny? Andreychuk lasted longer in the league, but Mogilny was more than a point per game player. Had nearly as many playoff points in 40 less games. Mogilny had two 100 point seasons and a 76 goal season. Nearly five more points per season.

[Andrew Amerk]

 

 

Andreychuk hosed again. Not really sure if those elected are really worthy over him. This class seems pretty weak.

 

Pat Burns hosed again.

[X. Benedict]

I think you are missing his point. He's admitting that the Sabres' D was and likely will be overpriced doo-doo, so using them to measure the Rangers' D is a poor choice of measuring stick. Compare them to a real defense - which, again, the Sabres don't have - and he feels that you find them less impressive.

 

Oh, and side note: using the Rangers' hit statistics is always misleading. Whoever counts hits at MSG clearly wants to prove to someone that they are working hard.

 

Counting hits is a bit subjective. For the Rangers I suspect it is a little misleading. Often Hit totals tell you that you didn't have the puck much.

I don't see the Ranger blueline as physically dominant at all. They hit clean all right, but I watched a fair bit of the Rangers, can't say I remember anyone of those D coming close to a major. I doubt any of them took a roughing minor either. If that D was playing in Buffalo - I guarantee 50% posters would be calling them soft.

 

Watching them I thought Chris Butler might have been perfect for what Torts was asking them to do. (no that isn't a dig at anyone, I really believed it).

 

As for Buffalo, the Sabres lead the league in shots against by the length of the NY thruway.

(not all the D's fault - the Sabres couldn't win a faceoff in their own zone and had nothing close to a checking line)

Buffalo's goal-tending was very good. Too good in fact.....there is no way that team should have finished as high as 22.

 

Anyway Alan Vingneault has some choices to make.......collapse back and ride Lundquist like Torts did, (hey it got them to the playoffs, but alienated the team), or open things up and play the first-forward in style with puck support from the D that Vingneault likes to play. I'm not convinced the Rangers D as it is can play that game yet.

 

It'll be interesting to watch. More interesting anyway, NY Rangers played some boring hockey last year.

 

All my opinions of course.

 

BTW ....the kid I'm much more impressed with is Adam Larsson in NJ.

The kid is just a treat to watch. I'd rather have him going forward than any Ranger D man.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Considering the way the Sabres played under Rolston, get ready for boring hockey here. Some of the same players were a lot tougher to play against in my opinion, and there was an attitude shift.

 

I don't find it boring though. If the guys buy into it, it gives you a shot to get to the playoffs, and that type of battle is what can get you along once there. I still say the simplest little goof is what doomed the Rangers last year. Mike Rupp. When you don't have that guy on the bomb squad capable of diffusing a lockerroom in any situation, it's tough.

 

And I'm not saying the Rangers D are all-world....I'm saying from 1-4, off the top of my head, Chicago is the only team that I would jump at over them.

[SwampD]

Counting hits is a bit subjective. For the Rangers I suspect it is a little misleading. Often Hit totals tell you that you didn't have the puck much.

I don't see the Ranger blueline as physically dominant at all. They hit clean all right, but I watched a fair bit of the Rangers, can't say I remember anyone of those D coming close to a major. I doubt any of them took a roughing minor either. If that D was playing in Buffalo - I guarantee 50% posters would be calling them soft.

 

Watching them I thought Chris Butler might have been perfect for what Torts was asking them to do. (no that isn't a dig at anyone, I really believed it).

 

As for Buffalo, the Sabres lead the league in shots against by the length of the NY thruway.

(not all the D's fault - the Sabres couldn't win a faceoff in their own zone and had nothing close to a checking line)

Buffalo's goal-tending was very good. Too good in fact.....there is no way that team should have finished as high as 22.

 

Anyway Alan Vingneault has some choices to make.......collapse back and ride Lundquist like Torts did, (hey it got them to the playoffs, but alienated the team), or open things up and play the first-forward in style with puck support from the D that Vingneault likes to play. I'm not convinced the Rangers D as it is can play that game yet.

 

It'll be interesting to watch. More interesting anyway, NY Rangers played some boring hockey last year.

 

All my opinions of course.

 

BTW ....the kid I'm much more impressed with is Adam Larsson in NJ.

The kid is just a treat to watch. I'd rather have him going forward than any Ranger D man.

Wow, is this ever true. I'll add that not only was is boring, but a lot of it was downright awful. They couldn't connect a pass, there was no semblance of an organized breakout, most of their games were just a disheveled mess at center ice, relying on Lundquist, and then waiting for Nash or Calahan to score on a singular effort.

[carpandean]

I don't find it boring though. If the guys buy into it, it gives you a shot to get to the playoffs, and that type of battle is what can get you along once there.

 

Unfortunately, all that it did last year was cost us a top-5 pick. His record was not significantly better than Ruff's. The big difference was that he pushed more games to SO's, where they performed pretty well. I don't feel like going back and finding my post with the breakdown, but they had a ridiculously low number of regulation (or even OT, if remember correctly) wins. Basically, it was a recipe for getting points in the regular season and not much else. Good for that same 8-10 (in conference) finish that they've been getting recently, which I consider to be the absolute worst season that a team can have.

[LaFontaineToMogilny]

Who deserves it more: Andreychuk or Mogilny? Andreychuk lasted longer in the league, but Mogilny was more than a point per game player. Had nearly as many playoff points in 40 less games. Mogilny had two 100 point seasons and a 76 goal season. Nearly five more points per season.

 

They both should be in the Hall of Fame already, but Mogilny over Andreychuk for me. Especially considering the circumstances in how he came to North America and the consequences for hockey world wide.

[TrueBlueGED]

Unfortunately, all that it did last year was cost us a top-5 pick. His record was not significantly better than Ruff's. The big difference was that he pushed more games to SO's, where they performed pretty well. I don't feel like going back and finding my post with the breakdown, but they had a ridiculously low number of regulation (or even OT, if remember correctly) wins. Basically, it was a recipe for getting points in the regular season and not much else. Good for that same 8-10 (in conference) finish that they've been getting recently, which I consider to be the absolute worst season that a team can have.

 

Spot on.

[26CornerBlitz]

‏@KatieStrangESPN

#NYR Hagelin agrees to two-year deal http://m.espn.go.com/general/story?storyId=9466331&city=newyork&src=desktop …

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

Unfortunately, all that it did last year was cost us a top-5 pick. His record was not significantly better than Ruff's. The big difference was that he pushed more games to SO's, where they performed pretty well. I don't feel like going back and finding my post with the breakdown, but they had a ridiculously low number of regulation (or even OT, if remember correctly) wins. Basically, it was a recipe for getting points in the regular season and not much else. Good for that same 8-10 (in conference) finish that they've been getting recently, which I consider to be the absolute worst season that a team can have.

 

That's the way the NHL is set up unfortunately....and the Sabres played better under Rolston while being partially gutted and having to field 30% of an AHL team. That's why I liked the Rangers. They actually have the talent to pull it off. Unfortunately for Torts, they got sick of sacrificing for 2 years.

 

I can't blame Rolston for playing boring. He did a good job in maximizing results.

 

And I know you are WAAAAYYYYY too sharp to say "His record was not significantly better than Ruff's"

 

Rolston put up 35 points in 31 games

 

Lindy put up 13 points in 17 games.

 

That's 47% more points!!!!!!! That's 93 points over a full season vs. 63 for Ruff.

 

Rolston is just smart enough to exploit the NHL system.

[carpandean]

And I know you are WAAAAYYYYY too sharp to say "His record was not significantly better than Ruff's"

 

Rolston put up 35 points in 31 games

 

Lindy put up 13 points in 17 games.

 

That's 47% more points!!!!!!! That's 93 points over a full season vs. 63 for Ruff.

 

Rolston is just smart enough to exploit the NHL system.

 

No, I do think that his record (at least, how it really matters) wasn't significantly better, and only looked that way because of the stupid point system in the NHL that has nothing to do with the post season. Good for him that he exploited that system, but as I said, it's a recipe for the worst possible finish. In other words, it was bad for the Sabres in the long run. If they had kept up Lindy's pace, they would have drafted in the top 5, if not top 3. Some players did perform better, but as others have pointed out, the best predictive statistics (puck possession) for success show that as a team, they weren't much better.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

No, I do think that his record (at least, how it really matters) wasn't significantly better, and only looked that way because of the stupid point system in the NHL that has nothing to do with the post season. Good for him that he exploited that system, but as I said, it's a recipe for the worst possible finish. In other words, it was bad for the Sabres in the long run. If they had kept up Lindy's pace, they would have drafted in the top 5, if not top 3. Some players did perform better, but as others have pointed out, the best predictive statistics (puck possession) for success show that as a team, they weren't much better.

 

Wow!

 

That's fine to say you'd prefer the Sabres to have tanked for long term draft prospects, but to fluff off such a huge difference in results is pretty goofy.

 

If you can get a game to a shootout in the regular season....you can get it to overtime in the post season.

 

And good luck winning the puck possession battle with the roster you have. I think Rolston did a fine job and has given the kids the best chance at success. The guys with attitude were allowed to flow more and given more opportunity, and he wasn't afraid to make bold statements like benching vets and franchise favorites.

 

Your argument is pretty much saying the Bills under Coach Ruff were just as good at 6-10 as the Bills under Coach Rolston at 9-7 because coach Rolston played a bend but don't break zone defense and won games 17-14 instead of losing them 31-24. And this after losing 4 quality vets from the first 40% of the season Ruff coached.

 

Sometimes you just have to give a guy credit for exploiting a system. The Rangers were one of the top 4 teams last year and top 8 this year, standing in the playoffs. I want wins. Not pretty boys.

 

 

[Eleven]

Wow!

 

That's fine to say you'd prefer the Sabres to have tanked for long term draft prospects, but to fluff off such a huge difference in results is pretty goofy.

 

If you can get a game to a shootout in the regular season....you can get it to overtime in the post season.

 

And good luck winning the puck possession battle with the roster you have. I think Rolston did a fine job and has given the kids the best chance at success. The guys with attitude were allowed to flow more and given more opportunity, and he wasn't afraid to make bold statements like benching vets and franchise favorites.

 

Your argument is pretty much saying the Bills under Coach Ruff were just as good at 6-10 as the Bills under Coach Rolston at 9-7 because coach Rolston played a bend but don't break zone defense and won games 17-14 instead of losing them 31-24. And this after losing 4 quality vets from the first 40% of the season Ruff coached.

 

Sometimes you just have to give a guy credit for exploiting a system. The Rangers were one of the top 4 teams last year and top 8 this year, standing in the playoffs. I want wins. Not pretty boys.

 

Rolston LOST the games 17-14. In overtime, instead of regular time, though. I think that's his point.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

Rolston LOST the games 17-14. In overtime, instead of regular time, though. I think that's his point.

 

He crushed the points system. He was only 1 game under DeLuca .500, and just get me there......you get me to overtime in the post season, and it isn't going to a shootout. How many shootout losses did he have versus OT w/L? I need to look that up. But given the roster and results.....anyone trying to discredit the job Rolston did is giving him the shaft.

 

We will see if longterm his style holds up. And I agree...I would have rather tanked, gotten a top 5 pick, and had Torts or AV come in and coach. Given our lot in life however, I like Rolston and give him tons of credit.

[TrueBlueGED]

He crushed the points system. He was only 1 game under DeLuca .500, and just get me there......you get me to overtime in the post season, and it isn't going to a shootout. How many shootout losses did he have versus OT w/L? I need to look that up. But given the roster and results.....anyone trying to discredit the job Rolston did is giving him the shaft.

 

We will see if longterm his style holds up. And I agree...I would have rather tanked, gotten a top 5 pick, and had Torts or AV come in and coach. Given our lot in life however, I like Rolston and give him tons of credit.

 

Or, we know that being dead last in possession isn't a recipe for sustained success. Dead. Last.