The "trial" of Terry Pegula

[26CornerBlitz]

I knew it was only a matter of time before this---------> @TBNSully

My column on Terry Pegula: http://www.buffalonews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20130619/SPORTS/130618995/1004 …

[Claude_Verret]

I knew it was only a matter of time before this---------> @TBNSully

My column on Terry Pegula: http://www.buffalone...30618995/1004 …

 

Well that was a waste of one my free TBN articles before I have to clear my cache again.

[TrueBlueGED]

I'm not going to be a Pegula apologist, but I'll just say that were I in his shoes, I'd be just as involved as he is. However much that is has not been determined, but I appreciate him wanting to be hands on with the company he owns and the product he makes.

 

Is he a "meddler"? That's a rather negative perspective. But we know he's involved. I support that.

 

Without knowing exactly how involved Pegula is, it's difficult for me to fully support his involvement. However, if I owned the team, I know I'd personally be involved at least to the extent where I would want full information and would ask questions and require the GM to justify moves and explain how they fit his vision and made us a better team. I'd support that kind of involvement. If what we're looking at here is more along the lines of Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder, that's a different animal and not at all desirable to me. But that's just it...we don't know. And no amount of circumstantial evidence will change that.

 

I think there is a different angle in play here. Let's talk about Darcy. We know Darcy is capable of acquiring good players and generally drafts well. But he lacks a certain flair for identifying personality types and how they fit together as a team. If I'm Pegula perhaps I recognize that as long as I support Darcy in a way that will allow him to be a better GM, perhaps we could form a better club. I think Pegula has the vision that Darcy lacks, but that Terry thinks he can work with that better than anyone else.

 

Maybe Terry guiding the ship really IS better than leaving Darcy to his own devices?

 

I think this is pretty reasonable. I have no idea if it's accurate, but what the hell, I gotta cling to something to get me excited for the team until Regier is gone! ;)

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Did anyone listen to Pegula the other day? Have you been listening over the months?

 

He said he talks with Regier more than his wife....then said it was a fact. He says that all decisions are discussed and it is a flat management structure where everyone has a say. Regier has said that he needs to get clearence from ownership to do things. I think we have plenty of evidence on what is going on behind the scenes.

 

It's pretty concrete to me. When I worked for a couple of decent buyers in the racing industry...I was the agent and had full power. I understood what the budget was, and was left to go to work in acquiring prospects. Once acquired, I communicated with them on a regular basis as far as plans, updates, etc....but the decisions were mine. There would be rare instances where the $ was big enough to make sure they wanted to go through with it, or if an offer was made to us on a major racing prospect, the final decision was up to them as it was a balance of fun vs. $$.....but they knew their limits in evaluating talent and I was honored that they felt, "If you like them...that's good enough for me.". because I was trusted. I would be 90% in discussion with the trainers/barn/vets/farms/etc....and left to concentrate on that and form gameplans and evaluations. If the owners were always involved, it would be a nightmare.

 

Darcy has shown in the past he is willing to put up with ANYTHING. It's not a bad thing being in communication with a knowledgable owner and having their regular input....if they are an actual decision making asset. Otherwise....let the GM do his job, sit back, relax, and enjoy your toys.

[LastPommerFan]

My client would like to discuss a plea deal

[That Aud Smell]

I think there is a different angle in play here. Let's talk about Darcy. We know Darcy is capable of acquiring good players and generally drafts well. But he lacks a certain flair for identifying personality types and how they fit together as a team. If I'm Pegula perhaps I recognize that as long as I support Darcy in a way that will allow him to be a better GM, perhaps we could form a better club. I think Pegula has the vision that Darcy lacks, but that Terry thinks he can work with that better than anyone else. Maybe Terry guiding the ship really IS better than leaving Darcy to his own devices?

 

you know what d4rk? full marks here, man -- full marks. not because i believe what you say is true -- but because you're genuinely thinking outside the box. and, really, what you're saying isn't outlandish. it isn't. it's possible that terry is bringing something to the table in terms of the "i like the cut of that guy's jib." we'll see.

 

I have no idea if it's accurate, but what the hell, I gotta cling to something to get me excited for the team until Regier is gone!

 

i'm with you, blue.

 

My client would like to discuss a plea deal

 

a good prosecutor won't offer anything less than what the indisputable proof will show. IMO, i think you're looking at a 3rd degree violation, with the idea that your client can avoid the risk of a conviction on 2nd degree (i just don't think 1st degree is in the cards).

 

in terms of sentencing, though, d4rk's 11th-hour petition would have me thinking that a suspended sentence is in order -- i.e., let's see what the new-fangled plan yields.

 

a separate question: what period of time is appropriate to suspend the sentence?

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

You guys have 10 days before the client does something stupid and crosses state lines to New Jersey while out on bail......

[Stoner]

Did anyone listen to Pegula the other day? Have you been listening over the months?

 

He said he talks with Regier more than his wife....then said it was a fact. He says that all decisions are discussed and it is a flat management structure where everyone has a say. Regier has said that he needs to get clearence from ownership to do things. I think we have plenty of evidence on what is going on behind the scenes.

 

It's pretty concrete to me. When I worked for a couple of decent buyers in the racing industry...I was the agent and had full power. I understood what the budget was, and was left to go to work in acquiring prospects. Once acquired, I communicated with them on a regular basis as far as plans, updates, etc....but the decisions were mine. There would be rare instances where the $ was big enough to make sure they wanted to go through with it, or if an offer was made to us on a major racing prospect, the final decision was up to them as it was a balance of fun vs. $$.....but they knew their limits in evaluating talent and I was honored that they felt, "If you like them...that's good enough for me.". because I was trusted. I would be 90% in discussion with the trainers/barn/vets/farms/etc....and left to concentrate on that and form gameplans and evaluations. If the owners were always involved, it would be a nightmare.

 

Darcy has shown in the past he is willing to put up with ANYTHING. It's not a bad thing being in communication with a knowledgable owner and having their regular input....if they are an actual decision making asset. Otherwise....let the GM do his job, sit back, relax, and enjoy your toys.

 

Right? Seriously? Some folks just don't want to listen to the words, brazenly almost, coming out of their mouths. They're answering the question. They don't seem to care who knows.

 

Terry's not going to sit back. He read that book Cliff gave him and decided his "second half" was going to entail "running" a professional sports team. Terry lied on day one. The Buffalo Sabres' reason for existence isn't to win the Stanley, it's to glorify Terry while doing so.

[etiennep99]

Why all the hate on Terry Pegula? Just two years ago he was the Sabres saviour. We might not have a team right

now if not for him. I'm getting sick of all of these negative stories....Yeah, I, myself, made fun of him a little

in a post above, but I wasn't trying to be mean spirited. I was making the point that he didn't sound that awake

during the interview. I'm getting the impression that Terry is a bit of an idea man, but he relies very heavily on

his subordinates to pull them together with panache. It's only natural for him to rely heavily on Darcy Regier.

I'd still like to know how he made his billions in natural gas. Maybe it was dumb luck. But, I'm willing to give

TP more time. What choice do we have?

 

I know that most of you want him to fire Darcy Regier, and you're showering your hate on Pegula because of it. But,

he's the owner; it's HIS party. The fans can vote with their wallets. [As I've said elsewhere, I'm too poor to

follow the Sabres except for free on the radio. I feel the pain because tickets and TV service are way too expensive,

and the NHL doesn't allow Internet broadcasts in the home market; I'd consider buying NHL Centre Ice if I could

watch the Sabres.]

[MattPie]

Why all the hate on Terry Pegula?

 

With Ruff gone, they had to hate on someone.

[Stoner]

Why all the hate on Terry Pegula? Just two years ago he was the Sabres saviour. We might not have a team right

now if not for him. I'm getting sick of all of these negative stories....Yeah, I, myself, made fun of him a little

in a post above, but I wasn't trying to be mean spirited. I was making the point that he didn't sound that awake

during the interview. I'm getting the impression that Terry is a bit of an idea man, but he relies very heavily on

his subordinates to pull them together with panache. It's only natural for him to rely heavily on Darcy Regier.

I'd still like to know how he made his billions in natural gas. Maybe it was dumb luck. But, I'm willing to give

TP more time. What choice do we have?

 

I know that most of you want him to fire Darcy Regier, and you're showering your hate on Pegula because of it. But,

he's the owner; it's HIS party. The fans can vote with their wallets. [As I've said elsewhere, I'm too poor to

follow the Sabres except for free on the radio. I feel the pain because tickets and TV service are way too expensive,

and the NHL doesn't allow Internet broadcasts in the home market; I'd consider buying NHL Centre Ice if I could

watch the Sabres.]

 

It's not really about Regier. If he had fired Regier, he'd still be meddling in the new GM's business. That's was meddlers do.

 

The bold is what people said about Rigas and Golisano, too. Funny, there's always someone willing to step up and buy the Sabres.

[Claude_Verret]

It seems like a lot of folks don't or haven't worked in an interdisciplinary work environment and/or haven't been married for a long time. Most weeks I talk to my boss or colleagues twice as much as I do with my wife.

[Stoner]

It seems like a lot of folks don't or haven't worked in an interdisciplinary work environment and/or haven't been married for a long time. Most weeks I talk to my boss or colleagues twice as much as I do with my wife.

 

The comparisons to work and home life fall flat here. This is a franchise in a unique, cut-throat business trying to win a championship. It's not ###### Sesame Street.

[TrueBlueGED]

The comparisons to work and home life fall flat here. This is a franchise in a unique, cut-throat business trying to win a championship. It's not ###### Sesame Street.

 

Are you somehow insinuating that other businesses aren't cutthroat? They might even be more so since there's significantly fewer barriers to entry than owning an NHL team. In the real world new competition can spring up and drive you out of business at any time...in the NHL you'll rarely get a new competitor, and it's close to impossible to go out of business.

[Claude_Verret]

The comparisons to work and home life fall flat here. This is a franchise in a unique, cut-throat business trying to win a championship. It's not ###### Sesame Street.

 

You're right, it's not. So then why would you expect the guy at the very top to be uninvolved?

[spndnchz]

You're right, it's not. So then why would you expect the guy at the very top to be uninvolved?

 

He doesn't expect him to be uninvolved, he wants him to be uninvolved.

[X. Benedict]

The comparisons to work and home life fall flat here. This is a franchise in a unique, cut-throat business trying to win a championship. It's not ###### Sesame Street.

 

Which owner do you really think are making more hockey decisions - Snyder, Leonis, Wang, Lemieux, Leopold, Katz, Pegula, Jacobs?

 

I submit that it is the prosecutions burden of proof to show that Pegula is more activist than ANY other owner in the league.

 

The Area 51 t-shirt is selling briskly today, BTW.

[Stoner]

Which owner do you really think are making more hockey decisions - Snyder, Leonis, Wang, Lemieux, Leopold, Katz, Pegula, Jacobs?

 

I submit that it is the prosecutions burden of proof to show that Pegula is more activist than ANY other owner in the league.

 

The Area 51 t-shirt is selling briskly today, BTW.

 

That's Judge Smell's bailiwick. I've already ask for all charges to be dropped and admitted being bought out by Pegula (my cubicle will be next to Kilgore's). Not much more I can do.

 

You bring up a fair point. Does Jacobs make hockey decisions? I've been trying to find out more about his ownership style, with not much luck so far.

[dudacek]

Pegula's crime is getting Sabre nation more excited than it had been in years, then failing to quickly deliver on his promises.

[That Aud Smell]

I submit that it is the prosecutions burden of proof to show that Pegula is more activist than ANY other owner in the league.

 

Interesting. But it sounds like you have more of a constitutional challenge to the statute itself -- i.e., that the charge of meddling in and of itself gives rise to a denial of substantive due process. And stuff.

 

Defendants aren't tried relative to the conduct of other people -- they're tried relative to a prescribed set of standards governing their conduct. If what you're saying is that meddling, as defined, is a widespread offense and that criminalizing it is out of step with current norms, then you're saying that it's a law that should be stricken from the books.

 

Which could be the case. I dunno.

 

 

You bring up a fair point. Does Jacobs make hockey decisions? I've been trying to find out more about his ownership style, with not much luck so far.

 

I haven't read Bill Simmons in years (he was a trailblazer of the blog-drive media--now he's as mainstream as they get), but I recall with specificity his distaste for Jeremy Jacobs.

 

Have a look at this piece (from 2002):

 

http://espn.go.com/page2/s/simmons/011026.html

 

The arrogance of the Bruins front office stunned even their most passionate supporters. We had always seethed about miserly general manager Harry Sinden, the type of GM who would have refused to pay for all three Hanson Brothers if he were running the Charlestown Chiefs. Only recently, after Sinden moved upstairs and handed the GM reins to Mike O'Connell, did our collective anger shift to Jeremy Jacobs, the longtime Bruins owner who stays out of the limelight but refuses to open his considerable checkbook.

Edited June 20, 2013 by That Aud Smell

[darksabre]

The comparisons to work and home life fall flat here. This is a franchise in a unique, cut-throat business trying to win a championship. It's not ###### Sesame Street.

 

If the comparisons fall flat then why does your entire argument revolve around a quote about how much Pegula speaks with his wife? Seems to me your theory falls flat as well.

 

Without knowing exactly how involved Pegula is, it's difficult for me to fully support his involvement. However, if I owned the team, I know I'd personally be involved at least to the extent where I would want full information and would ask questions and require the GM to justify moves and explain how they fit his vision and made us a better team. I'd support that kind of involvement. If what we're looking at here is more along the lines of Jerry Jones or Dan Snyder, that's a different animal and not at all desirable to me. But that's just it...we don't know. And no amount of circumstantial evidence will change that.

 

 

 

I think this is pretty reasonable. I have no idea if it's accurate, but what the hell, I gotta cling to something to get me excited for the team until Regier is gone! ;)

you know what d4rk? full marks here, man -- full marks. not because i believe what you say is true -- but because you're genuinely thinking outside the box. and, really, what you're saying isn't outlandish. it isn't. it's possible that terry is bringing something to the table in terms of the "i like the cut of that guy's jib." we'll see.

 

 

 

i'm with you, blue.

 

 

 

a good prosecutor won't offer anything less than what the indisputable proof will show. IMO, i think you're looking at a 3rd degree violation, with the idea that your client can avoid the risk of a conviction on 2nd degree (i just don't think 1st degree is in the cards).

 

in terms of sentencing, though, d4rk's 11th-hour petition would have me thinking that a suspended sentence is in order -- i.e., let's see what the new-fangled plan yields.

 

a separate question: what period of time is appropriate to suspend the sentence?

 

I appreciate both of your kind words. All I'm trying to do is prove that it's possible to take the same facts and create a completely different narrative all by changing perspective of that narrative.

 

I can take everything we've seen so far about Pegula portrayed as a negative and make it a positive. If I can do that, then there is no case against him at all.

[Stoner]

If the comparisons fall flat then why does your entire argument revolve around a quote about how much Pegula speaks with his wife? Seems to me your theory falls flat as well.

 

My entire argument? The wifey tidbit wouldn't even be brought in at trial. There's too much other damning evidence.

[darksabre]

My entire argument? The wifey tidbit wouldn't even be brought in at trial. There's too much other damning evidence.

 

Your damning evidence is someone else's proof of innocence. This whole thing is a massive farce.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

This is a sports franchise where thousands of players need to be evaluated in a multitude of leagues on a consistant basis. Decisive opinions need to be formed on a certain % of these players in order for the franchise to acquire, and maintain an NHL team and a feeder pipeline. This isn't a C++ project, or deciding how many cases of paper need to be ordered. The owner, had Zero experience in a talent evaluation role or sports ownership prior to purchasing the Sabres. His public display of knowledge has been less than inspiring so far. To hear from all the team executives over the past few months that there is a flat, decision making process, is more than a bit alarming.

 

I'm just interested to see what happens going into the draft and FA. After that, I feel a lot like Jerry Sullivan.........it doesn't even matter anymore. There is no reason to raise alarm anymore. The building is smoldering.

[Sabres Fan in NS]

My entire argument? The wifey tidbit wouldn't even be brought in at trial. There's too much other damning evidence.

 

Not to mention the fact that that little tidbit of info came to light long after this trial started.