Beyond Blue and Gold: Sabres.com series

[That Aud Smell]

I hear you, fellas, I hear you.

 

Liger, Pegula's statement at the draft table isn't circumstantial evidence -- it's direct evidence. You may not give that evidence much weight (like ThirtyEight), but it's direct evidence because it's a relevant statement that came from Pegula's mouth.***

 

For my own part, I was just surprised to see Pegula in the draft war room and then at the draft table chiming in on who to take (or at least why to take someone) at #16. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised. Maybe NHL (pro sports team)owners are commonly found in those situations, giving that sort of feedback and input. I'm just not sure.

 

***I also note with interest that my post was moved from the "Trial" thread and into this one. Whatever.

[LGR4GM]

Well Aud Smell I see your point I just don't think the evidence does show him directly involved in the decision making process. I guess I need to hear him say "I really like that guy" or in that war room scene hear him say "That guy looks really good" or anything along the lines of him injecting his opinion. In the Zadorov pick he is asked a question about how he wants the team to play. Both Regier and Pegula answer and Pegula indicates that he wants to go the route that makes them tougher to play against. If that is direct influence I guess I see it differently but I think and owner wanting a certain type of team (tough to play against) is much more different than directly saying get player X.

Edited July 31, 2013 by LGR4GM

[qwksndmonster]

Nothing about Pegula's involvement in the video seemed surprising or new. We know he likes being involved in the conversations, but not how much sway he has in hockey decisions. It'd be really interesting to hear a full couple minutes of hockey conversation from the brain trust.

Edited July 31, 2013 by qwksndmonster

[That Aud Smell]

If that is direct influence I guess I see it differently but I think and owner wanting a certain type of team (tough to play against) is much more different than directly saying get player X.

 

Ahh, yes -- see, we're back to talking about degrees of the charge of Meddling. Looking back at that thread, though, it looked like the consensus was that it's not "wrongful" conduct, really -- it's just that you can't be sure of how it's going to turn out.

[Stoner]

I hear you, fellas, I hear you.

 

Liger, Pegula's statement at the draft table isn't circumstantial evidence -- it's direct evidence. You may not give that evidence much weight (like ThirtyEight), but it's direct evidence because it's a relevant statement that came from Pegula's mouth.***

 

For my own part, I was just surprised to see Pegula in the draft war room and then at the draft table chiming in on who to take (or at least why to take someone) at #16. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised. Maybe NHL (pro sports team)owners are commonly found in those situations, giving that sort of feedback and input. I'm just not sure.

 

***I also note with interest that my post was moved from the "Trial" thread and into this one. Whatever.

 

There have been a lot of "whatever" moves lately. Hmmm, maybe the trial needs to proceed. That'll get the corporate overlords nervous.

 

Well Aud Smell I see your point I just don't think the evidence does show him directly involved in the decision making process. I guess I need to hear him say "I really like that guy" or in that war room scene hear him say "That guy looks really good" or anything along the lines of him injecting his opinion. In the Zadorov pick he is asked a question about how he wants the team to play. Both Regier and Pegula answer and Pegula indicates that he wants to go the route that makes them tougher to play against. If that is direct influence I guess I see it differently but I think and owner wanting a certain type of team (tough to play against) is much more different than directly saying get player X.

 

Don't you want your hockey guys making decisions about what kind of team you want in order to win a Cup? Seems like a no-brainer to me.

 

Let's all keep in mind these are only the moments the Sabres want us to see. How much more is being said behind the scenes?

 

Man, Kevin Devine is the ######. We should never let him leave.

 

Is my sarcasm meter broken?

[Stoner]

Am I hearing things? Devine was afraid Ristolainen was going to be picked before Seth Jones? I thought Devine came off as a tool for suggesting the Sabres work harder than other teams, who show up at the draft with their list and, what?, play Yahtzee to kill the time? Quite laughable.

[That Aud Smell]

It's obvious that Steve lives in the Avant on Huron at Delaware. At about the :25 sec mark that view is the same as mine when I stayed a the Embassy Suites last. Several Bills players live there too.

 

I'd say that must be the case. Would also explain why I see him in/around Delaware and Chippewa so often.

 

 

There have been a lot of "whatever" moves lately. Hmmm, maybe the trial needs to proceed. That'll get the corporate overlords nervous.

 

Seems that way a bit. I don't think the trial needs to proceed -- when I looked back at it, the upshot seemed to be that there was no doubt that Pegula was "meddling" in some substantial way, but that Meddling wasn't really a chargeable offense.

[Trettioåtta]

Am I hearing things? Devine was afraid Ristolainen was going to be picked before Seth Jones? I thought Devine came off as a tool for suggesting the Sabres work harder than other teams, who show up at the draft with their list and, what?, play Yahtzee to kill the time? Quite laughable.

 

They took their Finnish scout up on stage - that is an understandable thought. I would imagine he would know how hard the other teams work on draft day, so could make an informed decision? I also don't think he was suggesting they work harder, but never stop having meetings and discussing the players. It is not unlikely that some teams, when the season has ended, create their list and stick by it as these guys won't play any more hockey or have any more tests to change their rankings

[That Aud Smell]

Am I hearing things? Devine was afraid Ristolainen was going to be picked before Seth Jones? I thought Devine came off as a tool for suggesting the Sabres work harder than other teams, who show up at the draft with their list and, what?, play Yahtzee to kill the time? Quite laughable.

 

Well, he thought the Predators had taken a cotton to Risto when he saw them send their *#!*#! Finnish scout up there. I think it was just a bit of anxiety in the moment.

 

I agree, though -- the idea that the Sabres might differ from other squads in that they keep after the process until the 11th hour is silly.

 

One thing would appear to be for sure: No one's out-drinking our head of scouting.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Am I hearing things? Devine was afraid Ristolainen was going to be picked before Seth Jones? I thought Devine came off as a tool for suggesting the Sabres work harder than other teams, who show up at the draft with their list and, what?, play Yahtzee to kill the time? Quite laughable.

 

What is a little goofy to me is that they had both defensemen rated so high when the team has a bigger need at forward. Devine was quoted as saying "If you told me we'd get them at 8 and 16 I'd be shocked."

 

So say Nashville took Ristolainen and shocked everyone....you are left with Jones, Lindholm, Monahan and Nurse on the board, as well as Nichushkin. That is hardly a list to panic over in my opinion.

 

Then they almost pulled the trigger on a trade with Dallas. They nixed it, paranoid that they wanted the same guy. Again though, you're sitting on Nichushkin or Horvat if that is the case. Hardly a depressing scenario given their forwards.

 

So here is the kicker to me that leaves me all sorts of confused. They were talking Zadarov at 12. When Darcy was talking about going to 20, he said "Now we're looking at going BACK 4." Which leads me to believe they were looking at moving up to 12 with Phoenix. They acted as if Zadarov was a no brainer.

 

It's just really confusing given the fact you have 6 spots to fill on the blueline and already are sitting on Myers, Ehrhoff, Pysyk, McNabb, McCabe, Weber, and then go resign Sulzer and make a trade for Tallinder. There was so much gritty forward depth in that draft that can score......just really the wrong direction in my opinion.

 

I've always liked Devine though. His passion is always there. I hope he's right.

[spndnchz]

[/size]

 

I'd say that must be the case. Would also explain why I see him in/around Delaware and Chippewa so often.

 

 

[/size]

 

Seems that way a bit. I don't think the trial needs to proceed -- when I looked back at it, the upshot seemed to be that there was no doubt that Pegula was "meddling" in some substantial way, but that Meddling wasn't really a chargeable offense.

 

You have some ultra power telescope so that u can c him from Nova Scotia?

[LaLaLaFontaine]

Very good new episode. I like the parts with the open communication at the draft table.

 

That Ristolainen was so clearly their number one surprised me.

[That Aud Smell]

You have some ultra power telescope so that u can c him from Nova Scotia?

 

Ha. Yes, for the purposes of this board, I very recently moved to Ecum Secum from Medicine Hat, and before that lived in Moose Jaw.

 

Amazing that I was able to accomplish all of that with a few keystrokes. Canada's full of fun names.

[darksabre]

Ha. Yes, for the purposes of this board, I very recently moved to Ecum Secum from Medicine Hat, and before that lived in Moose Jaw.

 

Amazing that I was able to accomplish all of that with a few keystrokes. Canada's full of fun names.

 

We all know you actually live in Sloan.

[dudacek]

Not sure they had Risto ahead of Jones.

Could be they were hoping Risto would be there for them at eight, whereas they had no hope Jones would be.

It is clear Risto was their guy though, and I believe that had they made that trade to Five with Carolina, they would have picked Risto, not Lindholm. It's also clear Devine very strongly likes both our guys.

 

Funny, we do all our hoping and projecting based on reports and consensus mocks and tend to forget the team's internal take may be much different, and for reasons we know nothing about.

May be that they had Risto as number four on their board and Zadorov at eight.

Maybe they hated Nicushkin and Horvat.

 

That video was great.

I'd love to get my hands on the teams board.

[That Aud Smell]

We all know you actually live in Sloan.

 

Close. I'm shacked up with my lady in the Hamlet of Ebenezer, dontchaknow.

 

(See? Canada doesn't have a monopoly on funny names for cities/towns/villages and such.)

[IKnowPhysics]

There's actually a lot of insight about the process from that vid, and you can extrapolate/speculate just a little to gather some interesting nuggets and/or put the bigger picture together.

 

Trading:

 

8th overall to Dallas for 10th overall + _____

- Upon decline, Dallas, drafted Nichushkin at 10th. Devine may have been correct that they would have picked Ristolainen, because they later didn't want to (or maybe were unable to) move up to 9th to take Nichushkin. It's also possible that Dallas was afraid that Buffalo would take Nichushkin, but you'd think they'd maybe try to move up to 9th as well (maybe they did try, unknown).

- It's unknown what Dallas offered with the 10th round pick. It's possible, but unlikely, that they offered the 29th overall pick. Could've been the 40th overall or 54th overall. 3rd round pick was 69th.

 

16th overall to San Jose for 20th overall + 49th overall + _____

- Upon decline, San Jose still wanted to move up to grab a defenseman, and did so by trading 20th overall and 58th overall to Detroit in order to grab Mirco Mueller at 18th overall. That tells me that either had Mueller (unlikely), or some forward (I don't think so, but who knows), at 16th overall, or they saw an opportunity to grab Zadorov as their D pick.

 

"Jimmy wanted to know if we were in or out on this deal."

- Only two GMs are named Jim in the NHL, and both are sometimes referred to as Jimmy: Jim Nill (DAL) and Jim Rutherford (CAR). While this line could've been referring to the Dallas offer, it just as easily could've been referring to the trade offer from Carolina for 5th overall to Buffalo for 8th overall and Andrej Sekera. It's speculated elsewhere that Carolina was targeting Sekera from the get go, and Buffalo (later, in the 2nd round) chose to go with the deal they made, Sekera for McBain and 38th overall (JT Compher), when they saw Compher slip down.

 

Picking:

 

Ristolainen. Devine said they'd been watching Ristolainen for two years and had idenitified him as "their guy" and the player most capable of playing in the league right now (this probably isn't comparing him with the top three guys, but guys in the 4th+ overall range), and in this context, he'd had butterflies in his stomach in the days leading up to the draft.

- Seth Jones indisputably would not have slipped to 8th overall, but if the Predators pick Ristolainen for some reason, maybe Buffalo would have had to scramble just a little to figure out who "their other guy" is.

- It's also within the realm of possibility that given the #5 pick, we still would have picked Ristolainen, but because we expected him to be available at #8, we didn't execute Carolina's initial offer of 5th overall for 8th overall and Sekera. Maybe if Nashville takes Ristolainen, we take that trade with Carolina to get Seth Jones at 5th overall.

- As above, it's possible that Ristolainen was desired by Dallas, prompting a trade offer to move back to 10th.

 

Zadorov. They idenitifed Zadorov as a player they wanted that was slipping, at least before the 14th pick. Regier identified him as the player available he thought would have the best NHL career, and chose to take him instead of a forward. Devine referred to as the player that you select if you "want to get tougher to play against." When he was available at 16th, it was "a no brainer." Devine said he would've been shocked to hear that we got both of these guys at 8 and 16.

- Haha, it's pretty clear that we didn't give ###### about Wennberg and Pulock.

Edited August 1, 2013 by IKnowPhysics

[That Aud Smell]

not sure it posted - most recent one is in re development camp. these videos are the best thing going in terms of being a sabres fan.

 

http://video.sabres.nhl.com/videocenter/console?catid=1394&id=442651&cmpid=embed-share-video&utm_source=buffer&utm_campaign=Buffer&utm_content=buffer29b30&utm_medium=twitter

[dudacek]

Our coach wears pukka shells?

[LGR4GM]

Am I the only one who found it interesting that Grigorenko was not discussed in that video?

 

Girgensons compete is top of the line. I think he could be a very good #2 center some day and I think he will be an animal in the NHL. I also really liked seeing how in depth the go with these guys. The skating and stick holding stuff as well as the obvious positional things. That skating coach sounded like she knew what she was talking about.

 

Best thing going for the Sabres right now... of course if they can produce awesome videos like this than it means they can produce awesome 3rd jerseys and an awesome team right?

[That Aud Smell]

Am I the only one who found it interesting that Grigorenko was not discussed in that video?

 

No you are not. He showed up in a few frames, but that piece was all about Pysyk and Girgensons.

 

That said, I'm not sure how much stock to place in it. Girgensons' story is a more compelling one to tell at this point: Maniac hard worker whose game is steadily on the rise. What would they have said about Grigorenko?

[chileanseabass]

I hope they do one of these for the Traverse City Tournament.

[LGR4GM]

http://video.sabres...._source=Twitter

 

This one is 10minutes and it is good! Baptiste is going to be a guy to watch... hes got something, a quality about him I really like.

Edited October 2, 2013 by LGR4GM

[wjag]

http://video.sabres...._source=Twitter

 

This one is 10minutes and it is good! Baptiste is going to be a guy to watch... hes got something, a quality about him I really like.

 

Darcy looks like a priest in that video.

[LaLaLaFontaine]

Another fantastic video!

 

Love it.