Soccer (Football) ~ Everything About The Beautiful Game

[That Aud Smell]

What on earth is going on with the USMNT? Cripes. No frickin' way we should get drubbed like that by Costa Rica. They're a good team, of course - but the U.S. has plenty of quality and no way they should be run off the field like they were.

 

I'm nervous about the change to come, though. I've heard talk that some of the older guard in USA Soccer (Arenas?) would roll back the reliance on foreign-born naturalized citizens. That would not be a good move, imo.

[Hank]

What on earth is going on with the USMNT? Cripes. No frickin' way we should get drubbed like that by Costa Rica. They're a good team, of course - but the U.S. has plenty of quality and no way they should be run off the field like they were.

 

I'm nervous about the change to come, though. I've heard talk that some of the older guard in USA Soccer (Arenas?) would roll back the reliance on foreign-born naturalized citizens. That would not be a good move, imo.

 

 

It's one loss. Klinsmann's a good coach.  They will be fine.

[That Aud Smell]

It's one loss. Klinsmann's a good coach.  They will be fine.

 

Disagree with all three statements:

 

It's two losses in this round of qualification.

 

I'm really less and less sure re Klinsmann.

 

And they are not fine right now - far from it.

[Hank]

Disagree with all three statements:

 

It's two losses in this round of qualification.

 

I'm really less and less sure re Klinsmann.

 

And they are not fine right now - far from it.

 

A loss at Costa Rica is not unexpected.  The extent of the loss is surprising, but 2-1 or 4-0, they count the same in the standings.  Top three teams advance? It'll be okay.

[That Aud Smell]

A loss at Costa Rica is not unexpected.  The extent of the loss is surprising, but 2-1 or 4-0, they count the same in the standings.  Top three teams advance? It'll be okay.

 

Not so. Overall goal differential is a critical tiebreaker in soccer standings.

[Eleven]

It's two losses and goal differential is important, as Aud Smell says.

[That Aud Smell]

I'm only now getting oriented to the slate of games that remains.

 

Do we play each team twice under this new format? Looks like that's the case. Also appears that the final games -- in, what is this, "The Hexagon"? -- will occur in the early autumn of 2017.

 

So, they have opportunities to surpass the likes of Panama, Honduras, and Trinidad and Tobago. And well they feckin should. But those teams are not going to be easy outs. The team is a mess right now.

[Eleven]

I'm only now getting oriented to the slate of games that remains.

 

Do we play each team twice under this new format? Looks like that's the case. Also appears that the final games -- in, what is this, "The Hexagon"? -- will occur in the early autumn of 2017.

 

So, they have opportunities to surpass the likes of Panama, Honduras, and Trinidad and Tobago. And well they feckin should. But those teams are not going to be easy outs. The team is a mess right now.

 

I don't think Honduras is an easy out, T&T gave Mexico problems last round, and I think Panama tied Mexico last night.

 

The USA is in dead last.

[Hank]

It was always supposed to be Mexico, Costa Rica and the USA.  Losing to Mexico is not unexpected.  Losing IN Costa Rica was not expected.  It's pretty much playing out the way it was expected to, it's too early to press the panic button.

[Samson's Flow]

It was always supposed to be Mexico, Costa Rica and the USA.  Losing to Mexico is not unexpected.  Losing IN Costa Rica was not expected.  It's pretty much playing out the way it was expected to, it's too early to press the panic button.

this is exactly the time to press the panic button. Team USA has looked worse and worse with arguably better talent and depth than in past years. If you make the change now, you have nearly 3 months to develop a new system and evaluate the roster with a new coach.

[Eleven]

this is exactly the time to press the panic button. Team USA has looked worse and worse with arguably better talent and depth than in past years. If you make the change now, you have nearly 3 months to develop a new system and evaluate the roster with a new coach.

 

I don't even think it's pressing a panic button.  Klinsmann has not impressed as a coach.

[That Aud Smell]

It was always supposed to be Mexico, Costa Rica and the USA.  Losing to Mexico is not unexpected.  Losing IN Costa Rica was not expected.  It's pretty much playing out the way it was expected to, it's too early to press the panic button.

 

I do not imagine that the qualifiers will be a product of which countries were supposed to advance. The USA is going to have to earn this, and it will not be easy. And they don't much look up to the task right now.

 

And I don't disagree that a loss to Mexico is not of great concern, in and of itself. No shame in losing to a quality team. The thing that concerned me about that game was how utterly lost and befuddled the US team looked until, apparently at the insistence of the center mids, Klinsmann modified the 3-5-2 (?) formation to something more familiar and more suited to the personnel.

 

I didn't see the Costa Rica game, but the reviews were absolutely abysmal. Some of the USWNT members were tweeting to the effect that the team looked as though it had given up.

 

So, while the results may not be totally unforeseen, the quality of their play is of great concern.

 

It probably is too early to hit the panic button, as you say. But I'm keeping it nearby.

 

Moreover, even if this sort of team were to qualify, I would not expect them to do anything in the tournament. 

[Hank]

The US has thrived under Klinsman.  They made it out of the group of death in the WC when few thought they would.  We have outstanding young talent.  The Costa Rica loss is not surprising, people are over reacting based on the score IMO.  It'll work out.

 

I guess we'll agree to disagree.

I do not imagine that the qualifiers will be a product of which countries were supposed to advance. The USA is going to have to earn this, and it will not be easy. And they don't much look up to the task right now.

 

And I don't disagree that a loss to Mexico is not of great concern, in and of itself. No shame in losing to a quality team. The thing that concerned me about that game was how utterly lost and befuddled the US team looked until, apparently at the insistence of the center mids, Klinsmann modified the 3-5-2 (?) formation to something more familiar and more suited to the personnel.

 

I didn't see the Costa Rica game, but the reviews were absolutely abysmal. Some of the USWNT members were tweeting to the effect that the team looked as though it had given up.

 

So, while the results may not be totally unforeseen, the quality of their play is of great concern.

 

It probably is too early to hit the panic button, as you say. But I'm keeping it nearby.

 

Moreover, even if this sort of team were to qualify, I would not expect them to do anything in the tournament. 

 

 

This is all fair.  I guess maybe I like Klinsmann more than most.  I don't think they have the players to succeed in a 3-5-2 formation and they players were right to insist on switching back to the more farmiliar four back set.  I think they'll figure it out.

[That Aud Smell]

The US has thrived under Klinsman.  They made it out of the group of death in the WC when few thought they would.  We have outstanding young talent.  The Costa Rica loss is not surprising, people are over reacting based on the score IMO.  It'll work out.

 

I guess we'll agree to disagree.

 

 

This is all fair.  I guess maybe I like Klinsmann more than most.  I don't think they have the players to succeed in a 3-5-2 formation and they players were right to insist on switching back to the more farmiliar four back set.  I think they'll figure it out.

 

This is good stuff. 

 

And it's wrong to have one's memory fade so quickly about the successes they've had with Klinsmann -- getting out of that group was a real accomplishment.

 

I dunno. Often times, these things are just cyclical. It may be nigh time to move on from him, not because he's a bad coach, but because it's just . . . time to move on. My concern, though, remains: If they're going to go back in the direction of Arenas or whomever, they're likely going to push away from the foreign-born naturalized prospects, and possibly push away from having their players playing in the European leagues, and either or both of those developments would be very bad ideas.

[Samson's Flow]

This is good stuff. 

 

And it's wrong to have one's memory fade so quickly about the successes they've had with Klinsmann -- getting out of that group was a real accomplishment.

 

I dunno. Often times, these things are just cyclical. It may be nigh time to move on from him, not because he's a bad coach, but because it's just . . . time to move on. My concern, though, remains: If they're going to go back in the direction of Arenas or whomever, they're likely going to push away from the foreign-born naturalized prospects, and possibly push away from having their players playing in the European leagues, and either or both of those developments would be very bad ideas.

Maybe it is just a matter of Klinsmann having to do both the technical director role (developing youth, pushing for more US players to play in better leagues) and the head coach role (put the best 11 on the field/tactics). I would say he has done a very good job of the technical director role in developing talent and bringing in the foreign-born naturalized players. The team is younger and more talented than it has ever been. His failing is that he has not found an identity for this team in terms of playstyle and tactics. At the top level, you can't keep switching up formations game to game and expect any sort of discipline and consistency. It's like switching defenses in the NFL and being surprised that the linebackers are missing gap responsibilities. 

 

I wouldn't be opposed to keeping Klinsmann as the technical director/GM and hiring a different coach to focus their efforts 100% on the distinct roles. I doubt Klinsmann would go for that since it is a demotion, but who knows.

[That Aud Smell]

Maybe it is just a matter of Klinsmann having to do both the technical director role (developing youth, pushing for more US players to play in better leagues) and the head coach role (put the best 11 on the field/tactics). I would say he has done a very good job of the technical director role in developing talent and bringing in the foreign-born naturalized players. The team is younger and more talented than it has ever been. His failing is that he has not found an identity for this team in terms of playstyle and tactics. At the top level, you can't keep switching up formations game to game and expect any sort of discipline and consistency. It's like switching defenses in the NFL and being surprised that the linebackers are missing gap responsibilities. 

 

I wouldn't be opposed to keeping Klinsmann as the technical director/GM and hiring a different coach to focus their efforts 100% on the distinct roles. I doubt Klinsmann would go for that since it is a demotion, but who knows.

 

I've heard that solution floated. But seems like there's NFW that Klinsmann would go for that, or that a new coach would either.

[chileanseabass]

It seems to me like Jurgen has lost the team.  Time to cut bait and bring in a stop gap replacement to get them through qualifying, then reevaluate.  His recent tactical decisions make little to no sense whatsoever.   

[Hank]

It seems to me like Jurgen has lost the team.  Time to cut bait and bring in a stop gap replacement to get them through qualifying, then reevaluate.  His recent tactical decisions make little to no sense whatsoever.   

 

I agree tactical decisions.  I think he tried something new, lesson learned, I have no problem with that.  Until they lose a WCQ their not supposed to I'm not concerned.

Edited November 17, 2016 by Hank

[Hank]

Klinsman fired. I think it's a mistake. I'm excited about the future though.

[RonHextallsShoulderPads]

Klinsman fired. I think it's a mistake. I'm excited about the future though.

i heard we may go back to Arenas...

 

i would be pretty happy if Klinsman accepted a role with USMNT's scouting dept or front office. 

Edited November 21, 2016 by RonHextallsShoulderPads

[Samson's Flow]

Klinsman fired. I think it's a mistake. I'm excited about the future though.

I think it was inevitable, and I hope the team finds its identity before the next round of qualifying games.

[Hank]

i heard we may go back to Arenas...

i would be pretty happy if Klinsman accepted a role with USMNT's scouting dept or front office.

 

Arena seems like a step backwards to me.

[Sabel79]

It would appear that US Soccer is out of ideas as well.  The case can be made that Klinsmann took the team as far as he could with the players available to him.  The problems run much deeper than the manager of the USMNT. 

[chileanseabass]

Can't say I'm thrilled with the (possible/likely?) choice of Arena to replace him, but he's the safe pick.  USSF knows what they're getting with him.  He's not a bad coach and he's been there before, so it's his job to lose.  I'd rather see them go with someone outside the box (Bielsa), but understand why Sunil wouldn't want to at this stage.

[Huckleberry]

Can't say I'm thrilled with the (possible/likely?) choice of Arena to replace him, but he's the safe pick.  USSF knows what they're getting with him.  He's not a bad coach and he's been there before, so it's his job to lose.  I'd rather see them go with someone outside the box (Bielsa), but understand why Sunil wouldn't want to at this stage.

 

Should I apply ? :p