Worst Sabres FO move ever?

[dEnnis the Menace]

I disagree.

 

9/29/1997 Pat LaFontaine to NY Rangers for 1998 2nd round pick (Andrew Peters)

 

This one bugs me the most because of who we picked in the 2nd round. I don't disagree that Patty was a hit away from being a vegetable, but Andrew Peters in the 2nd round? this pick just irks me!

[R_Dudley]

I am reaching back (not around) for this one but the stats for years after tell the story.

 

Peter Mcnab to Boston the season following our first 1975 SC appearance. A large scoring center to boot go figure.

[Eleven]

trading chris gratton for danny briere. idiots.

 

We can do a best move ever poll, too.

 

possibly even worse was trading campbell. like really? why? you just lost briere and drury. man thre EFFED up huge after 2006.. lost grier dumont mckee drury briere campbell, that hurts man.

 

Wasn't Campbell in 2008, after it was certain that (1) the Sabres were not making the playoffs and (2) Campbell was going to command an incredible amount of money as FA? I think that was a classic "seller at the deadline" scenario and in fact was a smart move. McKee wasn't worth 4x4, either, at that point in his career. The rest are more problematic.

[Fire Lindy Ruff NOW]

We can do a best move ever poll, too.

 

 

 

Wasn't Campbell in 2008, after it was certain that (1) the Sabres were not making the playoffs and (2) Campbell was going to command an incredible amount of money as FA? I think that was a classic "seller at the deadline" scenario and in fact was a smart move. McKee wasn't worth 4x4, either, at that point in his career. The rest are more problematic.

dude, i said AFTER 06. come on man. and no the campbell trade sucked, we got bernier and who? shoulda broke the bank on campbell. just my opinion though. and mckee was so worth it. great stay at home defensive who could block a bazooka blast.

[dEnnis the Menace]

Wasn't Campbell in 2008, after it was certain that (1) the Sabres were not making the playoffs and (2) Campbell was going to command an incredible amount of money as FA? I think that was a classic "seller at the deadline" scenario and in fact was a smart move. McKee wasn't worth 4x4, either, at that point in his career. The rest are more problematic.

 

Yes it was, and it was almost certain that we weren't going to be able to pay him what he wanted (slash TG/LQ not wanting to break bank for him). I agree that it was a smart move just to get something in return, even if that didn't pan out like we had hoped.

 

I'm torn on whether or not McKee was worth it or not.

[mphs mike]

I think that the age of the poster may influence the poll. For instance, I'll never forgive the Sabres for getting rid of Schoeny and Gare. I also agree that Scotty drafting Jiri Dudacek with a 1st belongs on this list. Indeed, Ric Ceiling over Mike Bossy is horrible, yet younger posters won't recognize what influence those decisions had on the organization going forward. Again, any move is difficuklt to evaluate in isolation - except for the gut reaction that you love/hate a particular move.

Having said that, I'm looking forward to the results

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Made more sense in terms of understanding WHY it happened. (The ###### criminals needed all the cash they could come up with to keep their house of cards from collapsing.) Not made more sense in terms of it being a reasonable course of action as far as improving the team was concerned nor anything that ANY Sabres' fan should have condoned or been pleased with.

 

Taro.....when you have built a house of cards and are running a $100 million racket that may be on the verge of collapse, the last thing you are worried about is paying a guy an extra million a year over 4 years. If anything, they would have been mortgaging the future to bring in big names and trying to stimulate immediate revenue flows in the form of tickets, concessions, and jerseys in order to prolong their survival in hopes of a homerun manifesting itself out of the blue somewhere else. Trading your entire draft for Joe Sakic would have made more sense than nitpicking a hockey deal. Let the new ownership worry about the future if they knew they were toast.

 

Iginla for Peca falls on Darcy.

[IKnowPhysics]

There's a lot listed here I don't agree with, but if we're considering "FO" moves and not just "player moves," I'd say that not keeping Jim Benning was a huge mistake.

[tom webster]

Ok. So I'm thinking about starting a poll in about a week or so, and it might even be a "playoff poll," i.e., the top two or three vote-getters have a re-vote. Sort of like elections in some countries. And, it's NEGATIVE! This should thrill people.

 

Worst player move in Sabres history. So far, I'm inclined to include the following:

 

--Not re-signing Briere (yeah, that's what brought it up in my mind)

--Acceding to Hasek's demand that we get a crappy player in return from Detroit

--Rene Robert for John Van Boxmeer

--Tom Barasso for Shannon and Bodger

--Rick Martin and Don Luce for draft picks

--Not re-signing Peca

--drafting Paul Cyr and John Tucker, and counting on them as the future

--Ray Sheppard for $1

 

 

What do we think? What am I missing, here?

 

Given their condition at the time, moving Rick Martin, Rene Robert and Don Luce were actually good moves.

 

 

 

I am reaching back (not around) for this one but the stats for years after tell the story.

 

 

Peter Mcnab to Boston the season following our first 1975 SC appearance. A large scoring center to boot go figure.

 

Andre Savard was actually quite valuable and at the time, teh team was full of scorers. Still McNab did turn out more prolific then expected.

 

In no particular order, some that you've missed:

 

Drafting Jiri Dudacek in the 1st.

 

Giving up Andreychuk, Puppa, and a 1st (Kenny Jonsson) for Fuhr when Hasek was already on the roster.

 

Sarich, Primeau, Holzinger, & a 3rd (Kharitonov) for Gratton & a 2nd (Roy).

 

Letting Neely slip away at 9, when they took Barasson at 5 and held picks 10 & 11.

 

Ric Seiling at 14.

 

Muni & a 5th for Carney & a 6th.

 

Giving up McKegney, Savard, Frankie Sauve, & a 3rd for Cloutier & a 1st (Creighton).

 

Gare, Schoenfeld, & Derek Smith for McCourt, Peterson, & Foligno.

 

Leaving Peterson exposed to waivers.

 

Carriere & a 1st for probably the biggest bum ever to wear the blue & gold Jacques Richard.

 

I'd expect Tom Webster would add letting Dennis Wideman walk.

 

Giving up Boucher so that Huddy could be added to the deal for Zhitnik.

 

Spinner Spencer for Ron Schock.

 

 

Hadn't heard the Lydman part, but Iginla being available is what I'd heard.

 

Didn't make much sense at the time, but with the Adelphia implosion shortly thereafter, not bringing on salary made more sense in hindsight. Criminals knew cashflow was tight.

 

Man you got a good memory but I consider Wideman more a symptom of a bigger problem then a singificantly singular bad move.

Did you also remember that Spinner Spenser was actually my original moniker before Tom Webster?

[Charlemagne]

We can do a best move ever poll, too.

 

 

 

Wasn't Campbell in 2008, after it was certain that (1) the Sabres were not making the playoffs and (2) Campbell was going to command an incredible amount of money as FA? I think that was a classic "seller at the deadline" scenario and in fact was a smart move. McKee wasn't worth 4x4, either, at that point in his career. The rest are more problematic.

 

Plus SJ's first rounder turned into ennis

[Taro T]

Taro.....when you have built a house of cards and are running a $100 million racket that may be on the verge of collapse, the last thing you are worried about is paying a guy an extra million a year over 4 years. If anything, they would have been mortgaging the future to bring in big names and trying to stimulate immediate revenue flows in the form of tickets, concessions, and jerseys in order to prolong their survival in hopes of a homerun manifesting itself out of the blue somewhere else. Trading your entire draft for Joe Sakic would have made more sense than nitpicking a hockey deal. Let the new ownership worry about the future if they knew they were toast.

 

Iginla for Peca falls on Darcy.

I disagree. By the time they realized that they weren't going to get Peca signed, they were too far into the season for a guy like Iginla to bolster ticket / concession sales. Bringing in Iginla would have only hurt their ability to meet the payments on their illegal loans.

 

Far better to hang onto him and get something cheap for him next year than to lose $'s today. The thing they didn't bargain for was Hasek getting ticked off about the Peca deal and then deciding to leave town. If Hasek sticks around, the Connolly deal doesn't look AS crappy (at least casually).

 

Without Hasek, and a lot of the veteran forwards that also didn't come back that off-season, '01-'02 was a disaster.

 

Given their condition at the time, moving Rick Martin, Rene Robert and Don Luce were actually good moves.

 

 

 

Andre Savard was actually quite valuable and at the time, teh team was full of scorers. Still McNab did turn out more prolific then expected.

 

 

 

Man you got a good memory but I consider Wideman more a symptom of a bigger problem then a singificantly singular bad move.

Did you also remember that Spinner Spenser was actually my original moniker before Tom Webster?

Thought you spelled it like Brian did (w/ a c rather than 2 s's) but don't remember why you went away from the tribute to #21.

[darksabre]

dude, i said AFTER 06. come on man. and no the campbell trade sucked, we got bernier and who? shoulda broke the bank on campbell. just my opinion though. and mckee was so worth it. great stay at home defensive who could block a bazooka blast.

 

Few are going to agree with you on this. McKee might have been better that...Rivet, but not by a lot. He was a mess when the Sabres let him go.

 

Campbell? The Sabres couldn't afford his price tag, which turned out to be way too high, especially with Vanek signed. There might have been one person here at the time who felt we should have paid him that money, but as I remember the consensus was "good riddance".

[LastPommerFan]

The single worst FO move had to be not putting a "good" team in front of Hasek. Dom never had anything that even resembled a top 10 team in front of him. And that's all it would have taken. You put Hasek in his prime on the 10th best team in the league, and they win at least one stanley cup, probably several.

[Fire Lindy Ruff NOW]

Few are going to agree with you on this. McKee might have been better that...Rivet, but not by a lot. He was a mess when the Sabres let him go.

 

Campbell? The Sabres couldn't afford his price tag, which turned out to be way too high, especially with Vanek signed. There might have been one person here at the time who felt we should have paid him that money, but as I remember the consensus was "good riddance".

mckee was WAY better than old rivet. come on dude. and im saying in hindsight we should have kept campbell, but we all know how golisano was. its all opinion based i can could give 2 craps and an unused paperclip about who agrees with me. just lettin you know.

[TrueBlueGED]

Interesting reading some of the moves from a long time ago that I wasn't really familiar with (first time I really remember reading a lot about a front office decision was trading LaFontaine away).

 

I'm surprised nobody has gone with a generic "hiring Regier" or "hiring Quinn (twice!)" yet.

[Taro T]

Interesting reading some of the moves from a long time ago that I wasn't really familiar with (first time I really remember reading a lot about a front office decision was trading LaFontaine away).

 

I'm surprised nobody has gone with a generic "hiring Regier" or "hiring Quinn (twice!)" yet.

Well, if we're going more front office rather than player personnel, I'd suggest we add canning Schoeny with 43 points through 43 games, only to end the year in 5th place in the Adams with, you guessed it, 80 points in 80 games. Nice job Scotty.

[darksabre]

mckee was WAY better than old rivet. come on dude. and im saying in hindsight we should have kept campbell, but we all know how golisano was. its all opinion based i can could give 2 craps and an unused paperclip about who agrees with me. just lettin you know.

 

The point I'm trying to argue is that they weren't that bad of moves then or in hindsight. Compared to other massive mistakes listed here, these two really don't come close. McKee never had and never would play a full season in the NHL. St. Louis had even labeled him as fragile by the time he was shown the door there, something I don't think we'd have called him. Leaving when he did was for the best: watching him decline so rapidly would have been hard for any of his fans. He was old, slow and broken.

 

At least we didn't feel obligated to give Rivet a free pass for it. But Jay would probably have gotten one.

 

As for Campbell, he hasn't been a number one on any team since Buffalo, but he got paid like it. I'm glad Buffalo didn't make that mistake. And as someone else mentioned, we got Ennis out of it. I'd say we won that trade by a mile.

[Fire Lindy Ruff NOW]

The point I'm trying to argue is that they weren't that bad of moves then or in hindsight. Compared to other massive mistakes listed here, these two really don't come close. McKee never had and never would play a full season in the NHL. St. Louis had even labeled him as fragile by the time he was shown the door there, something I don't think we'd have called him. Leaving when he did was for the best: watching him decline so rapidly would have been hard for any of his fans. He was old, slow and broken.

 

At least we didn't feel obligated to give Rivet a free pass for it. But Jay would probably have gotten one.

 

As for Campbell, he hasn't been a number one on any team since Buffalo, but he got paid like it. I'm glad Buffalo didn't make that mistake. And as someone else mentioned, we got Ennis out of it. I'd say we won that trade by a mile.

i dunno man i disagree. isnt ennis another one of those skill guys with no toughness that all of you seem to hate? i think ennis is solid, buuuuuuuuuuuuuut dont we have enough ennisisisisiss on the team already? PLUS campbell is definitly a number 1 now... and who knows maybe if mckee stayed here, he would have lasted longer, for all we know he ONLY wanted to play for buffalo and just gave up after we let him go. theres just too many factors involved with these fantasy thoughs. ya know??

[tom webster]

I disagree. By the time they realized that they weren't going to get Peca signed, they were too far into the season for a guy like Iginla to bolster ticket / concession sales. Bringing in Iginla would have only hurt their ability to meet the payments on their illegal loans.

 

Far better to hang onto him and get something cheap for him next year than to lose $'s today. The thing they didn't bargain for was Hasek getting ticked off about the Peca deal and then deciding to leave town. If Hasek sticks around, the Connolly deal doesn't look AS crappy (at least casually).

 

Without Hasek, and a lot of the veteran forwards that also didn't come back that off-season, '01-'02 was a disaster.

 

 

Thought you spelled it like Brian did (w/ a c rather than 2 s's) but don't remember why you went away from the tribute to #21.

 

I did spell it with a c, just messing with you and quite frankly I don't remember why I changed the name.

[shrader]

The single worst FO move had to be not putting a "good" team in front of Hasek. Dom never had anything that even resembled a top 10 team in front of him. And that's all it would have taken. You put Hasek in his prime on the 10th best team in the league, and they win at least one stanley cup, probably several.

 

The perfect example being a not in his prime Hasek winning a cup thanks to the incredible team skating in front of him.

[Fire Lindy Ruff NOW]

The perfect example being a not in his prime Hasek winning a cup thanks to the incredible team skating in front of him.

that was hard to read. haha

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Here's an interesting question.......I don't want to get all riled up about Darcy being handcuffed, and the debate........but if people are willing to let him off the hook for a series of horrible moves, then you also need to NOT give him credit for say, picking Briere up off waivers. If you want a clean slate......and start with Pegula.....I'm now willing to accept that thought. But who says claiming Danny Briere off waivers was Darcy's first choice? Is it not possible he wanted to bring in a high-priced center if he had the resources? And given the types of players he has brought in when he does have resources.....is it not possible that the high priced player he would have brought in would be a total flop and he lucked out by being forced to go to the waiver wire?

 

I'm just saying.

 

Going forward I am dropping looking into the past because it is the only way to keep sane and still contribute. But given the topic of the thread, I feel it is a valid point.

[Fire Lindy Ruff NOW]

Here's an interesting question.......I don't want to get all riled up about Darcy being handcuffed, and the debate........but if people are willing to let him off the hook for a series of horrible moves, then you also need to NOT give him credit for say, picking Briere up off waivers. If you want a clean slate......and start with Pegula.....I'm now willing to accept that thought. But who says claiming Danny Briere off waivers was Darcy's first choice? Is it not possible he wanted to bring in a high-priced center if he had the resources? And given the types of players he has brought in when he does have resources.....is it not possible that the high priced player he would have brought in would be a total flop and he lucked out by being forced to go to the waiver wire?

 

I'm just saying.

 

Going forward I am dropping looking into the past because it is the only way to keep sane and still contribute. But given the topic of the thread, I feel it is a valid point.

he wasnt claimed off waivers i thought...didnt we trade for him???

[Taro T]

Here's an interesting question.......I don't want to get all riled up about Darcy being handcuffed, and the debate........but if people are willing to let him off the hook for a series of horrible moves, then you also need to NOT give him credit for say, picking Briere up off waivers. If you want a clean slate......and start with Pegula.....I'm now willing to accept that thought. But who says claiming Danny Briere off waivers was Darcy's first choice? Is it not possible he wanted to bring in a high-priced center if he had the resources? And given the types of players he has brought in when he does have resources.....is it not possible that the high priced player he would have brought in would be a total flop and he lucked out by being forced to go to the waiver wire?

 

I'm just saying.

 

Going forward I am dropping looking into the past because it is the only way to keep sane and still contribute. But given the topic of the thread, I feel it is a valid point.

Darcy did better than pick Briere up off waivers, he got rid of Gratton at the same time. ;)

 

Your premise is basically a reverse look at Muckler's tenure in Buffalo. His teams when given carte blanche were serious underachievers. When he had to stay within a budget, he built a nice little team.

[dEnnis the Menace]

i dunno man i disagree. isnt ennis another one of those skill guys with no toughness that all of you seem to hate? i think ennis is solid, buuuuuuuuuuuuuut dont we have enough ennisisisisiss on the team already? PLUS campbell is definitly a number 1 now... and who knows maybe if mckee stayed here, he would have lasted longer, for all we know he ONLY wanted to play for buffalo and just gave up after we let him go. theres just too many factors involved with these fantasy thoughs. ya know??

 

:blink: :huh:

 

1) I don't even know how to address your Ennis comments

2) Campbell is certainly not a number 1 defense man. He's a second line pairing.

3) He didn't ONLY want to play for Buffalo, he wanted a pay raise, one which in my opinion wasn't warranted here. Good for him for getting it elsewhere, but fact is, with his playing style, he was on the decline.