Eleven Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Ok. So I'm thinking about starting a poll in about a week or so, and it might even be a "playoff poll," i.e., the top two or three vote-getters have a re-vote. Sort of like elections in some countries. And, it's NEGATIVE! This should thrill people. Worst player move in Sabres history. So far, I'm inclined to include the following: --Not re-signing Briere (yeah, that's what brought it up in my mind) --Acceding to Hasek's demand that we get a crappy player in return from Detroit --Rene Robert for John Van Boxmeer --Tom Barasso for Shannon and Bodger --Rick Martin and Don Luce for draft picks --Not re-signing Peca --drafting Paul Cyr and John Tucker, and counting on them as the future --Ray Sheppard for $1 What do we think? What am I missing, here?
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Not trading Peca for Iginla when Peca was holding out and offer was confirmed on the table.
Iron Crotch Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 I can't view the Briere non-move in isolation. It was a comedy of errors that I can never quite forgive Darcy for.
Eleven Posted April 30, 2012 Author Report Posted April 30, 2012 Not trading Peca for Iginla when Peca was holding out and offer was confirmed on the table. You sure? All I found was Calgary turning it down (and even that, on another message board): http://forum.calgarypuck.com/showthread.php?t=580 I'd rather stick to certainties, but if you've got good authority on this one, bring it. That would be a meaningful mistake. I can't view the Briere non-move in isolation. It was a comedy of errors that I can never quite forgive Darcy for. I completely understand, that's why I want to do this. To me, it was horrible, but was it as horrible as Robert for JVB? That's what I want to know!
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 You sure? All I found was Calgary turning it down (and even that, on another message board): http://forum.calgary...hread.php?t=580 I'd rather stick to certainties, but if you've got good authority on this one, bring it. That would be a meaningful mistake. Jim Kelley said Darcy turned it down. Iginla had an off year at the time. If you google: Iginla, Peca, Regier....the entire front page is accounts of him agreeing to it but asking for juice at the last second. I remember it as fact, but don't know the added pieces. It was heavily reported at the time though. Here is an in depth discussion with multiple Buffalonians in 2004. Iginla for Peca was agreed upon, but Regier wanted Lydman thrown in after the deal was agreed upon. This was years before Lydman was a Sabre....the discussion that is. http://hfboards.hockeysfuture.com/showthread.php?t=87663&page=3#ad_not_found
Taro T Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 In no particular order, some that you've missed: Drafting Jiri Dudacek in the 1st. Giving up Andreychuk, Puppa, and a 1st (Kenny Jonsson) for Fuhr when Hasek was already on the roster. Sarich, Primeau, Holzinger, & a 3rd (Kharitonov) for Gratton & a 2nd (Roy). Letting Neely slip away at 9, when they took Barasson at 5 and held picks 10 & 11. Ric Seiling at 14. Muni & a 5th for Carney & a 6th. Giving up McKegney, Savard, Frankie Sauve, & a 3rd for Cloutier & a 1st (Creighton). Gare, Schoenfeld, & Derek Smith for McCourt, Peterson, & Foligno. Leaving Peterson exposed to waivers. Carriere & a 1st for probably the biggest bum ever to wear the blue & gold Jacques Richard. I'd expect Tom Webster would add letting Dennis Wideman walk. Giving up Boucher so that Huddy could be added to the deal for Zhitnik. Spinner Spencer for Ron Schock. Jim Kelley said Darcy turned it down. Iginla had an off year at the time. If you google: Iginla, Peca, Regier....the entire front page is accounts of him agreeing to it but asking for juice at the last second. I remember it as fact, but don't know the added pieces. It was heavily reported at the time though. Here is an in depth discussion with multiple Buffalonians in 2004. Iginla for Peca was agreed upon, but Regier wanted Lydman thrown in after the deal was agreed upon. This was years before Lydman was a Sabre....the discussion that is. http://hfboards.hock...=3#ad_not_found Hadn't heard the Lydman part, but Iginla being available is what I'd heard. Didn't make much sense at the time, but with the Adelphia implosion shortly thereafter, not bringing on salary made more sense in hindsight. Criminals knew cashflow was tight.
bunomatic Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 There's more than a few bonehead moves sprinkled throughout the history of this franchise. The one that hits home personally for me is Briere.
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Didn't make much sense at the time, but with the Adelphia implosion shortly thereafter, not bringing on salary made more sense in hindsight. Criminals knew cashflow was tight. Please tell me you didn't just go there?
thesportsbuff Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 I'm on the fence about adding "Leaving Vanek exposed to an offer sheet." I guess you can't really blame Darcy because offer sheets are so rare, but still, you just let your top two players leave town, you'd think locking up Vanek would be become an immediate priority. Probably could have signed him for 5 years at ~$5 mil at the time, maybe less, if Darcy hadn't sat there with his thumb up his ass for five or six days. But that's just an idea for others, for me it's hands down the Briere/Drury debacle. Mostly Briere, but at the time I was mad about Drury, too, so I'll include it. 05-06 is when I really came into my own as a Sabres fan. I watched every game I could since like '98, and I knew all the players by name & #, but I was too young to understand trades/free agency/etc and the management aspect of it. I didn't know much about players outside of Buffalo. But I watched the playoffs every year and started to learn some players around the league and by 03-04 I was talking trades and having intelligent hockey conversations (not just "go buffalo!"), then the lockout hit and I was hockey starved. So in 05-06, I came back with a vengeance. I got tickets to the season opener vs NYI, and attended 5 other games that year. I honestly don't think I missed a game on TV that entire season either. It was just the best year of my life hands down and I could go on all day about how much fun I had that season. 06-07 was also exciting but by then the bandwagonners were back on board and it didn't seem as legit of an experience, but I still had a hell of a time. Regardless, letting Briere and Drury walk after all those memorable moments post-lockout stings. Bad.
Kristian Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 I'm on the fence about adding "Leaving Vanek exposed to an offer sheet." I guess you can't really blame Darcy because offer sheets are so rare, but still, you just let your top two players leave town, you'd think locking up Vanek would be become an immediate priority. Probably could have signed him for 5 years at ~$5 mil at the time, maybe less, if Darcy hadn't sat there with his thumb up his ass for five or six days. But that's just an idea for others, for me it's hands down the Briere/Drury debacle. Mostly Briere, but at the time I was mad about Drury, too, so I'll include it. 05-06 is when I really came into my own as a Sabres fan. I watched every game I could since like '98, and I knew all the players by name & #, but I was too young to understand trades/free agency/etc and the management aspect of it. I didn't know much about players outside of Buffalo. But I watched the playoffs every year and started to learn some players around the league and by 03-04 I was talking trades and having intelligent hockey conversations (not just "go buffalo!"), then the lockout hit and I was hockey starved. So in 05-06, I came back with a vengeance. I got tickets to the season opener vs NYI, and attended 5 other games that year. I honestly don't think I missed a game on TV that entire season either. It was just the best year of my life hands down and I could go on all day about how much fun I had that season. 06-07 was also exciting but by then the bandwagonners were back on board and it didn't seem as legit of an experience, but I still had a hell of a time. Regardless, letting Briere and Drury walk after all those memorable moments post-lockout stings. Bad. The fact that offer sheets are as rare as they are, just goes to show how big an idiot Larry Quinn was to panic completely after losing D&B, and come out say in public that the Sabres "would mantch ANY offer sheet" given to Vanek. That move ranks right up there with the best of them.
deluca67 Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Ok. So I'm thinking about starting a poll in about a week or so, and it might even be a "playoff poll," i.e., the top two or three vote-getters have a re-vote. Sort of like elections in some countries. And, it's NEGATIVE! This should thrill people. Worst player move in Sabres history. So far, I'm inclined to include the following: --Not re-signing Briere (yeah, that's what brought it up in my mind) --Acceding to Hasek's demand that we get a crappy player in return from Detroit --Rene Robert for John Van Boxmeer --Tom Barasso for Shannon and Bodger --Rick Martin and Don Luce for draft picks --Not re-signing Peca --drafting Paul Cyr and John Tucker, and counting on them as the future --Ray Sheppard for $1 What do we think? What am I missing, here? Not signing Peca and than trading him for Tim Connolly is the worst player move in Sabres team history. Not only did it cost the Sabres a chance at the Stanley Cup, it forced us to live through the Tim Connolly debacle of a career.
Guest Sloth Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 The fact that offer sheets are as rare as they are, just goes to show how big an idiot Larry Quinn was to panic completely after losing D&B, and come out say in public that the Sabres "would mantch ANY offer sheet" given to Vanek. That move ranks right up there with the best of them. + 1 Well said. Not signing Peca and than trading him for Tim Connolly is the worst player move in Sabres team history. Not only did it cost the Sabres a chance at the Stanley Cup, it forced us to live through the Tim Connolly debacle of a career. Did I like Peca leaving Buffalo? No, I did not. But at the time, there was a lot of hype about Tim Connolly. I'll admit I was excited when the Sabres got a hold of the guy. Too bad Connolly turned out to be a bust.
Taro T Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Please tell me you didn't just go there? Made more sense in terms of understanding WHY it happened. (The ###### criminals needed all the cash they could come up with to keep their house of cards from collapsing.) Not made more sense in terms of it being a reasonable course of action as far as improving the team was concerned nor anything that ANY Sabres' fan should have condoned or been pleased with. I've stated several times here, that NOT getting Peca nor anything for Peca in '00-'01 cost them the Stanley Cup. (I believe it cost them the Chalice, but it absolutely cost them the Finals at a minimum.) + 1 Well said. Did I like Peca leaving Buffalo? No, I did not. But at the time, there was a lot of hype about Tim Connolly. I'll admit I was excited when the Sabres got a hold of the guy. Too bad Connolly turned out to be a bust. It's not so much about having Connolly as it is having a hole in the roster the previous season. The way things turned out with Connolly was just salt in the wounds. The wounds came the previous year when the team was built to win a Stanley Cup and needed what Peca (or fair value for Peca) would have brought.
Marvelo Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 There's more than a few bonehead moves sprinkled throughout the history of this franchise. The one that hits home personally for me is Briere. Buffalo has never been a particularly smart organization over the years. If there's success, it's usually by accident, it isn't the top level of success and they can't sustain it. The Canadians, Bruins, Rangers all have personalities. Buffalo's is just to be a bit over mediocrity.
darksabre Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 + 1 Well said. Did I like Peca leaving Buffalo? No, I did not. But at the time, there was a lot of hype about Tim Connolly. I'll admit I was excited when the Sabres got a hold of the guy. Too bad Connolly turned out to be a bust. I have a hard time labeling Connolly a bust. Before his injuries he was exactly what this team needed. But something changed and he lost that "it" factor. Connolly wasn't so much a bust as a tragedy.
Kristian Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 I have a hard time labeling Connolly a bust. Before his injuries he was exactly what this team needed. But something changed and he lost that "it" factor. Connolly wasn't so much a bust as a tragedy. I have to disagree. Tim Connolly had ONE good season as a Sabre, and that was the 05-06 season, coming straight out the lockout. Prior to that, he has one decent year where he put up 45 points, and one absolutely ATROCIOUS year in which he managed only 25 points, but also a -28 rating. We all know the rest, but due to injuries we'll never really know what kind of player Tim Connolly really was.
rbochan Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Not signing Peca and than trading him for Tim Connolly is the worst player move in Sabres team history... I disagree. 9/29/1997 Pat LaFontaine to NY Rangers for 1998 2nd round pick (Andrew Peters)
Kristian Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 I disagree. 9/29/1997 Pat LaFontaine to NY Rangers for 1998 2nd round pick (Andrew Peters) How could I forget that one. I guess, only because Pat went out and ran into Mike Keane later that season, making Quinn and Darcy look like geniuses, but at the time, this was a bonehead move if ever there was one.
Eleven Posted April 30, 2012 Author Report Posted April 30, 2012 Some really good candidates so far. This is going to be a fun poll. BTW, wasn't the LaFontaine move kind of humanitarian? As in, "we don't want you killing yourself, but if you insist upon it, do it elsewhere?"
Kristian Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Some really good candidates so far. This is going to be a fun poll. BTW, wasn't the LaFontaine move kind of humanitarian? As in, "we don't want you killing yourself, but if you insist upon it, do it elsewhere?" They certainly wanted to sell that story, but the fact that Patty was making 5 mill. a year on his contract probably had a lot to do with them wanting him to retire. Or just leave, rather. Jim Kelley ran a story back in the day on how the Sabres didn't have insurance on Patty's contract, meaning they'd be on the hook for the full amount if he went down with another injury. Quinn wanted absolutely nothing to do with such a financial liability. *edit Funny how Quinn saw the entire Tim Connolly affair differently, isn't it? Timmy had his bell rung more than Patty ever did, yet he got a 50% raise instead. I guess the people mentioning his friendship with Timmy's father were more right than I ever thought possible.
bunomatic Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Some really good candidates so far. This is going to be a fun poll. BTW, wasn't the LaFontaine move kind of humanitarian? As in, "we don't want you killing yourself, but if you insist upon it, do it elsewhere?" Thats how I remember it. I recall people being worried about his future. He felt capable of playing and the organization felt otherwise. The fact that all they got in return was Peters leads me to believe others felt he was done as well.
Fire Lindy Ruff NOW Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 trading chris gratton for danny briere. idiots.
Weave Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 Thats how I remember it. I recall people being worried about his future. He felt capable of playing and the organization felt otherwise. The fact that all they got in return was Peters leads me to believe others felt he was done as well. Peters was the guy we drafted with the pick we got in return. It wasn't like they said, "well, Patty has no value so we'll take Peters cuz it's better than nothing". That was a wasted draft pick.
Fire Lindy Ruff NOW Posted April 30, 2012 Report Posted April 30, 2012 possibly even worse was trading campbell. like really? why? you just lost briere and drury. man thre EFFED up huge after 2006.. lost grier dumont mckee drury briere campbell, that hurts man.
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