Will Gerbe be pushed out of the lineup?

[DumbPuck]

 

Isn't winning the point?

 

Not really to me. For me, the point is not a point at all it is more of a journey. Sometimes when reading peoples' posts (Not to be finger-pointing but yours in this thread are an example) I think that they wouldn't care whether the Sabres actually earned a Stanley Cup over the course of a hard fought season and post-season or they won one by way of some goofy mismatching where the opponents had 50% of their team injured the first week of the playoffs. Or the Sabres went around cheapshotting everybody to win it. Or for us to miraculously trade Roy, stafford, and eveyrone else for Stamkos, Giroux, and every other star in the league and win a cup. That's just not me.

 

My enjoyment of watching the Sabres comes from watching the players that I like do amazing things. This includes things like Gerbe's crazy spin-o-rama goal last year to help clinch a playoff spot. Ennis's OT goal against Philly last year also holds a special spot in my memory. These things stand out in my memory as reasons why I continue to watch the Sabres. Now, I would still love the Sabres even if gerbe was no longer a member, but to be in line with the topic of this thread, I would much rather see others go before he does. Try him in a different position even, I don't care. It worked for Ennis!

 

I would further argue if "all that matters is winning" were true then why would the Sabres have any following at all? They haven't won anything worth mention in their 40+ year history.

 

 

Gerbe is an LW. Which LW would you like to see replaced by Gerbe, and how do you see the lines as a result?

 

It doesn't happen in a vacuum. You can't replace Boyes with Gerbe because they aren't playing the same position. You have to make a justification that takes position into account.

 

I guess I gave my point of view on this above.

[dudacek]

3rd line is a label that means third most dangerous line on some teams and checking line on others.

It rarely applies to the line that gets the most ice time, or leads the team in points, or gets paid the most - Pominville, Roy, Leino is the first line in all three of those scenarios.

They also happen to be our most effective line defensively at the moment.

One of the reasons why the Sabres are looking better is because the addition of Hodgson and the re-emergence of Ennis has given us a mismatch against most teams third Lines, and especially third best D pairing.

 

Not sure why Cody can't play the middle of the fourth line between Gerbe and Kaleta when all three are healthy.

 

As far as Gerbe goes, he was an effective third liner in the back half of last year. He has not been the same player this year.

He will have to score 15 a year or turn into a great penalty killer to stay in the league given the rest of his skill set.

[jabtot]

No chance Gerbe sits.....Boyes, Turnbull ride the pines....I think!

[inkman]

Some people like Dennis Rodman's seconds.

Yeah she's gross.

 

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-LcJpGYUxTvk/T1ceuLTcdwI/AAAAAAAAZHE/O6u0p0cB02M/s1600/carmen_electra_fancy_mag_5.jpg

[neverenough]

so you want to put 13.8mil on the 3rd line, including our leader in points? Im done with this thread, carry on.

Hahaha yeah seems over the boards to me also.

[JJFIVEOH]

3rd line is a label that means third most dangerous line on some teams and checking line on others.

It rarely applies to the line that gets the most ice time, or leads the team in points, or gets paid the most - Pominville, Roy, Leino is the first line in all three of those scenarios.

They also happen to be our most effective line defensively at the moment.

One of the reasons why the Sabres are looking better is because the addition of Hodgson and the re-emergence of Ennis has given us a mismatch against most teams third Lines, and especially third best D pairing.

 

Not sure why Cody can't play the middle of the fourth line between Gerbe and Kaleta when all three are healthy.

 

As far as Gerbe goes, he was an effective third liner in the back half of last year. He has not been the same player this year.

He will have to score 15 a year or turn into a great penalty killer to stay in the league given the rest of his skill set.

 

I agree, Gerbe hasn't produced like he did last year, or at least the 2nd half of last year. Although like I mentioned, he is 7th on the team in scoring. But one thing to take into consideration the vast majority of this team has been in an offensive funk most of the year. Even when they started to turn things around they weren't scoring very much. It wasn't until recently that the offense started producing. By that time Gerbe was given a more defensive role. If the rest of the team had been scoring up to their potential and Gerbe was producing as he is, then it might be different. I'd like to see the team rebound next year, put the puck in the net with more regularity and then see how he responds. He's been given chances to produce, but he hasn't necessarily been given 1st and 2nd line opportunities most of the year.

[neverenough]

Its not Gerbe's fault Cody McCormick is one of the only tough guys on the sabres roster. If Darcy wouldnt have set up such a soft team, nobody would be sayin we cant win a cup with Gerbe. I forgot McCormick is the sabres Matt Carkner.

[I am Defecting]

I really enjoyed having a line against Wpeg, that, when near the oppositions crease, weren't treated like heavy bags after the play.

 

If Gerbe is going to play on the fourth line, I'd like him to have, not one, but two linemates that can do punching. If someone pats Gerbe, or otherwise molests him, and a scrum ensues, I don't want to end up feeling sorry for Gerbe. I want to be feeling sorry for the guy who did the act.

 

I've decided Gerbe, McCormick, and Turnbull, or no Gerbe at all, for me. The other lines are too balanced to throw Foligno or Tropp on the fourth. They've got their own lines to patrol. Is Gerbe even worth it? Gerbe gets abused = mind-game lost. However, Guy who tries to abuse Gerbe is beaten = mind-game won! Otherwise, I don't much care who sits from the fourth line.

[Weave]

so you want to put 13.8mil on the 3rd line, including our leader in points? Im done with this thread, carry on.

 

I don't *want* to put that much cash on a 3rd line, but the reality is our GM has paid out that much money for players who are best suited to a two way role.

 

Tell you what, how about you offer some substance and suggest an alternative. It'll take changes on at least two lines. ;)

 

 

Edit to add-- rigth now Leino-Roy-Pommer isn't really a 3rd line. I think you can argue that Vanek-Hods-Tropp is closer to that distinction today. Still, is there some sort of negative connotation associated with putting Pommer and Leino on a defensively responsible line? L-R-P are arguably the 3 most defensivfely responsible guys we have in the lineup, why wouldn't we want them grouped up and sent out to counter another teams' top line. Especially when they have the skill to turn the tables and get some goals against the other teams' top groups.

[Marvelo]

I think alot of you guys hearken back to last year as the good old days for Nathan. It might be true. This year, he's had injury after injury as hard as he tries. I hope he can back and show us all, but this might be too injury plagued a year for him. As Lafontaine observed after his spinerama goal, Nathan is a very special player. I believe that.

[Weave]

Not sure why Cody can't play the middle of the fourth line between Gerbe and Kaleta when all three are healthy.

 

Not sure how I missed this, but this might be the compromise that works. I'm not sure I like McC at center though. I doubt Lindy does either. I guess it'll come down to whether Lindy is more comfortable with McC or Boyes playing center on that 4th line.

[waldo]

You cannot be small and survive in the NHL without being contact adverse. Gerbe is not contact adverse. Ennis is learning to be and Gerbe needs to adapt. All one needs to do to survive and prosper is to watch tapes of Roy and Pom and then a few Savard reels.

 

Putting Gerbe on the fourth line is equivelent to saying goodbye. He will not survive. He is already a prime canidate for soft melon disease given his size. Gerbe needs a finese line. People who make the argument he should play on the fourth line have either 1. never played this game or 2.are trying to end his career prematurely via injury. Gerbe has skills but is unlucky to have landed on a team that was already suffering from play small disease.

[Wraith]

What has he done for us other than work hard? How effective has he really been?

 

I think Gerbe has been excellent. His offensive numbers have been hurt by the role he's filling and even more so by an exceptionally low shooting percentage (also known as Stafford-itus). Here are some non-traditional statistics that support my arguments. All numbers are SABRES FORWARDS -EVEN STRENGTH (AS OF 3-21-12).

 

- 2nd overall in shots per game (Top 4- Stafford: 2.15 Sh/G, Gerbe: 2.05 Sh/G, Pominville: 1.96 Sh/G, Vanek: 1.64 SH/G)

- 3rd worst in shooting percentage (Bottom 5 - McCormack: 0.0%, Ellis: 3.7%, Gerbe: 5.0%, Boyes: 5.7%, Stafford 6.5%)

- 1st overall in Corsi Quality of Competition (Top 3 - Gerbe: 0.87, Pominville: 0.85, Roy: 0.85)

- 3rd worst in offensive zone start percentage (Bottom 3 - Kaleta: 42.0%, Ellis 45.3%, Gerbe 47.8%)

- Tied for second in penalties drawn per 60 min (Top 3 - Kaleta: 1.5 Pen/60, Gerbe/Hodgson/Leino: 1.0 Pen/60, Vanek: 0.9 Pen/60)

 

Gerbe was part of a very good shut-down line for a while with Gaustad and Kaleta and the offensive zone start percentage and quality of competition numbers reflect how that line was used. Despite playing against t he best competition and being used heavily on defense, he is still piling up shots at the second highest rate on the team. But like Stafford, he has been the victim of a very low shooting percentage. Gerbe has a great shot, there's no reason he should be sandwhiched between Matt Ellis and Brad Boyes in shooting percentage except for bad luck. His style leads to power plays as well (Kaleta owns this category).

[wonderbread]

Yeah she's gross.

 

http://4.bp.blogspot...fancy_mag_5.jpg

 

I read the entire thread just for this reply.

[ROCBuffalo]

_{If you remember last year, Gerbe was one of the main reasons we made the playoff push. I really like him in the lineup even though he is small. Brings speed and physicallity.}

[DR HOLLIDAY]

_{If you remember last year, Gerbe was one of the main reasons we made the playoff push. I really like him in the lineup even though he is small. Brings speed and physicallity.}

 

I think he needs to make better decisions about when to be physical, to both keep the opposition off balance and to stay in the lineup.

[Taro T]

so you want to put 13.8mil on the 3rd line, including our leader in points? Im done with this thread, carry on.

While I can see taking issue with the price tag for the '3rd line' heading into next season, how does the price tag for that line make one iota of difference in what the team does this year?

 

They have the roster they do, and that looks to be far and away the best checking line the Sabres can currently assemble. That line also has the ability to contribute points in the offensive zone as well.

 

Now, heading into next season, that line's price tag may limit what can be done to improve the players on Vanek's line - assuming LR also keeps the Ennis line set. But after the trade deadline, price tag really shouldn't be a consideration in who plays w/ whom. All that should matter is chemistry. Pominville is what he is, he can't be Royed; Leino seems to be comfortable playing on the '3rd line' and the way he's scored to date he seems to have already Royed himself. Keep them together and keep the other team off the scoreboard and see if Pomms or Roy can't chip something in even strength as a back breaker.

[LGR4GM]

I don't *want* to put that much cash on a 3rd line, but the reality is our GM has paid out that much money for players who are best suited to a two way role.

 

Tell you what, how about you offer some substance and suggest an alternative. It'll take changes on at least two lines. ;)

 

 

Edit to add-- rigth now Leino-Roy-Pommer isn't really a 3rd line. I think you can argue that Vanek-Hods-Tropp is closer to that distinction today. Still, is there some sort of negative connotation associated with putting Pommer and Leino on a defensively responsible line? L-R-P are arguably the 3 most defensivfely responsible guys we have in the lineup, why wouldn't we want them grouped up and sent out to counter another teams' top line. Especially when they have the skill to turn the tables and get some goals against the other teams' top groups.

Alright if you want to play:

 

Derek Roy is less defensively responsible then Hodgson. Pommers is our best RW. Leino is Hecht 2.0 so in that way you are correct. Now I understand the logic behind it and I am fine with it right up until I see Jason Pominville sitting back there. Tropp and Pommers will at some point be flipped. Vanek and Pommers already have Chemistry and Hodgson is adjusting. As for Nathan Gerbe, there were many ppl this season saying to trade Ennis and keep Gerbe and now that he is injured they have switched sides. Gerbe is a 3/4 guy and we all know it. So put him on the 4th line

Vanek - Hodgson - Pommers

Foligno - Ennis - Stafford

Leino - Roy - Boyes/Tropp

Gerbe - McCormick - Kaleta

After this year Boyes won't be taking up a spot so Tropp can probably just slide right in. I personally do not think Turnbull has been that great so why not send gerbe out with the 4th line. Right now with the lineup we have our best shot at a Cup could come next year before we lose players like Leopold and Regehr or even Roy. I see no reason why Gerbe can not be a part of that.

[Punch]

FWIW:

 

Joe Buscaglia ‏ @JoeB_WGR

Lindy Ruff told the media that both Gerbe and Kaleta are available to play, and they'll make a decision on them tomorrow. #Sabres

[dEnnis the Menace]

FWIW:

 

Joe Buscaglia ‏ @JoeB_WGR

Lindy Ruff told the media that both Gerbe and Kaleta are available to play, and they'll make a decision on them tomorrow. #Sabres

 

and the plot thickens...

 

I think you see Kaleta back in for the Sheriff, and Gerbe may replace Tropp, but there is no way Foligno goes anywhere (which I believe everyone agrees on).

[Punch]

and the plot thickens...

 

I think you see Kaleta back in for the Sheriff, and Gerbe may replace Tropp, but there is no way Foligno goes anywhere (which I believe everyone agrees on).

 

The Sabres still have 4 recalls left which they'll almost certainly use on Foligno. I'd like to see Kaleta in for McCormick rather than Turnbull, at least for tomorrow night, but I'm sure Turnbull is out. I'd also prefer Tropp over Gerbe--- and I'll be wearing a Gerbe jersey to the game tomorrow night.

[dEnnis the Menace]

The Sabres still have 4 recalls left which they'll almost certainly use on Foligno. I'd like to see Kaleta in for McCormick rather than Turnbull, at least for tomorrow night, but I'm sure Turnbull is out. I'd also prefer Tropp over Gerbe--- and I'll be wearing a Gerbe jersey to the game tomorrow night.

 

Honestly, I agree that I'd rather put Tropp in over Gerbe at this point. In regards to Kaleta going in: I think it would be very beneficial to have him back (as long as the refs stop calling EVERYTHING that he does a penalty). Whether you sit Turnbull or Cody Mc, I don't really have a preference. Kaleta's PK ability and his ability to play more minutes than Turnbull would be beneficial against a team like Washington.

 

Although, messing with the chemistry we've got going right now does not seem like a good idea at all.

[K-9]

and the plot thickens...

 

I think you see Kaleta back in for the Sheriff, and Gerbe may replace Tropp, but there is no way Foligno goes anywhere (which I believe everyone agrees on).

 

I think this is a no-brainer for Lindy. Turnbull gave us some quality minutes but Kaleta brings more to the table.

 

And there is no way Tropp sits with the balance we have over the lines at this time.

 

Gerbe should be a healthy scratch.

 

GO SABRES!!!

[nucci]

Honestly, I agree that I'd rather put Tropp in over Gerbe at this point. In regards to Kaleta going in: I think it would be very beneficial to have him back (as long as the refs stop calling EVERYTHING that he does a penalty). Whether you sit Turnbull or Cody Mc, I don't really have a preference. Kaleta's PK ability and his ability to play more minutes than Turnbull would be beneficial against a team like Washington.

 

Although, messing with the chemistry we've got going right now does not seem like a good idea at all.

Agree that Tropp stays and Kaleta for Turnbull makes sense.

[spndnchz]

Lines last game sorted by ice time:

 

Leino-Roy-Pommers

Foligno-Ennis-Stafford

Tropp-Hodgson-Vanek

Boyes-McCormick-Turnbull

 

IMO You don't change those first three lines.

 

Turnbull goes back to Rachacha.

McCormick sits.

Gerbe-Boyes-Kaleta.

 

And using up one of the final four call-ups to make Foligno a non-emergency call-up.