Game Discussion Thread GDT: Buffalo Sabres @ Winnipeg Jets 3/5/12 8:00PM

[CallawaySabres]

I think these players are very expendable for the offseason moves:

 

Roy

Stafford

Gerbe

Pomm and Vanek if you can get a scoring forward with size (I'll take less goals for someone who is not invisible for long stretches)

 

Now that I thnk of it, there really isn't anyone who I would not trade (except Hodgson). The only forwards I would like to keep are Hodgson and Ennis. I can't believe how small this team plays! Throw players like Gerbe on a Boston team and they probably thrive but these finesse guys can't cut it on a team as weak as Buffalo. The last few wins were nice but oh my God, these teams are taking control of the puck MINUTES at a time and there is NOTHING Buffalo can do.

[waldo]

Regehr was probably not healthy enough to play last night. On a play like that it's clear how difficult of a time he has rotating his hips and Thorburn got a bead on him. Before the hip flexor injury in San Jose, Regehr drives Thorburn into the corner and he never gets a shot off. He'll probably be fine in another few days.

 

thank you Punch for the first rational comment in a string of six or so comments

[apuszczalowski]

All this talk about not breaking up the top line to avoid messing up the other lines that are going well is bunk. The Sabres have scored 2, 2, 2, 2, 1, 5, and 1 goals in their last 7 games respectively.

 

Shuffle that deck, Lindy.

 

(null)

Wait a minute, first its Lindy shuffles the lines too much, he needs to leave them alone so guys can build chemistry. Then its he is keeping lines together and not shuffling them enough.

 

As for Thorburns goal, that was just a really sweet goal he scored and not much more could be done by a goaltender to stop it. Miller was in position to make the initial save but either the puck went off his pad right back to his stick, or he somehow was able to keep control of it inches from Millers pad and pull it back to go around him. Its not easy to make a save on a goal like that when your defencemen is doing nothing to prevent him from coming in

[bunomatic]

Last night with the tired legs and the size discrepancy among the forwards it was more than evident that this team just isn't built for a playoff run. Winnipeg had a simple gameplan of pounding us until we wilted which is what any team we possibly meet in the playoffs will do. When a normally non physical Nik Antropov can skate around and hit anything that moves and we have no answer for that its embarrassing.

[spndnchz]

Wait a minute, first its Lindy shuffles the lines too much, he needs to leave them alone so guys can build chemistry. Then its he is keeping lines together and not shuffling them enough.

 

As for Thorburns goal, that was just a really sweet goal he scored and not much more could be done by a goaltender to stop it. Miller was in position to make the initial save but either the puck went off his pad right back to his stick, or he somehow was able to keep control of it inches from Millers pad and pull it back to go around him. Its not easy to make a save on a goal like that when your defencemen is doing nothing to prevent him from coming in

 

This.

[Assquatch]

Ruff needs to get Roy away from Vanek, period. You are attributing other people's quotes to me.

 

(null)

[deluca67]

Oh please. Vanek had over 16 minutes of ice time, over 2 minutes of PP time, got off 2 shots on goal and was a minus-2. He didn't do a GD thing to demonstrate that he should be getting more ice time. He now has 5 goals in his last 31 games.

 

Bottom line: Vanek isn't that good. Like many Sabres forwards, he has some talent, he's well overpaid and he doesn't show up in crunch time. I can name 50 NHL players I'd rather have without having to think hard about it.

 

I agree that Thorburn's goal was a terrible one for Miller to give up.

 

 

 

But it's not about the Jets playing better at home. It's about the Sabres not showing up when it really matters.

 

 

 

Good call.

 

 

 

There is some truthiness to this. My problem is that I think the Sabres -- especially the forwards -- went into the game thinking this way.

Than trading Vanek needs to be this teams #1 priority. For $7 mil a year you need to have a top 50 player. There are over 100 forwards that average more ice time than Vanek and 55 forwards with more points.

 

This team needs their top priced talent to produce on a nightly basis. Right now the Sabres have over $13 mil tied up in Vanek and Miller, they need more from both of them.

[RazielSabre]

Oh please. Vanek had over 16 minutes of ice time, over 2 minutes of PP time, got off 2 shots on goal and was a minus-2. He didn't do a GD thing to demonstrate that he should be getting more ice time. He now has 5 goals in his last 31 games.

 

Bottom line: Vanek isn't that good. Like many Sabres forwards, he has some talent, he's well overpaid and he doesn't show up in crunch time. I can name 50 NHL players I'd rather have without having to think hard about it.

 

I agree that Thorburn's goal was a terrible one for Miller to give up.

 

 

 

But it's not about the Jets playing better at home. It's about the Sabres not showing up when it really matters.

 

 

 

Good call.

 

 

 

There is some truthiness to this. My problem is that I think the Sabres -- especially the forwards -- went into the game thinking this way.

Vanek isn't top 10, but his a talented forward who has good hands, good skill and good size. He also is the most talented player on the Sabres roster (Myers excluded). He often tries to play through his injuries and has always put the team first. He is a top line LW on most NHL teams and the ONLY offense we had through the first 3 months. Just because we lost to Winnipeg doesnt make the Sabres crap again, please calm down.

 

Yes, the Sabres were tired, yes the probably knew that when they went into the game (stunning that, someone knowing their tired). You really think they just thought they could lose this key match up. The fact is we aren't Calgary, our team identity isn't 'make the playoffs year after year but get nowhere'. We will win a Stanley Cup within a few years, if that means trying but failing to get into the playoffs this year big deal, I'll live with it. Ted Black has stated that and that is the clear direction of the team.

 

Regehr should have had Thorburn, Miller arguably should have had the save but we lost 3-1, not 2-1 so get over it.

 

God people like you piss me off.

 

Than trading Vanek needs to be this teams #1 priority. For $7 mil a year you need to have a top 50 player. There are over 100 forwards that average more ice time than Vanek and 55 forwards with more points.

 

This team needs their top priced talent to produce on a nightly basis. Right now the Sabres have over $13 mil tied up in Vanek and Miller, they need more from both of them.

Funny how most of you weren't saying that before this season or for the few games before the Winnipeg game.

[BarDown]

Wow, what do you expect from these guys. They had a GREAT road trip. 4 games in 6 nights on the west coast...the team they played last night was finishing up a long homestand...and had 3 days off. All that, and it was tied going into the 3rd. The 3rd period was close until their 2nd goal, which should have been a scoring chance for us, but it got blocked...we got caught and give up the break away. For those of you that think they won't be able to handle a long playoff series (if they make the playoffs of course), remember the team they'll be playing will be as tired as them...not rested like the Jets were. By the way, with that crowd and the energy they had, I'm not sure how many teams would have won in that barn last night. A couple days ago, they blew Florida out 7-0 there.

 

I'm probably in the minority, but i liked how they've been playing lately...IMHO they're playing with passion and heart...and that's all i really ever want.

[deluca67]

Vanek isn't top 10, but his a talented forward who has good hands, good skill and good size. He also is the most talented player on the Sabres roster (Myers excluded). He often tries to play through his injuries and has always put the team first. He is a top line LW on most NHL teams and the ONLY offense we had through the first 3 months. Just because we lost to Winnipeg doesnt make the Sabres crap again, please calm down.

 

Yes, the Sabres were tired, yes the probably knew that when they went into the game (stunning that, someone knowing their tired). You really think they just thought they could lose this key match up. The fact is we aren't Calgary, our team identity isn't 'make the playoffs year after year but get nowhere'. We will win a Stanley Cup within a few years, if that means trying but failing to get into the playoffs this year big deal, I'll live with it. Ted Black has stated that and that is the clear direction of the team.

 

Regehr should have had Thorburn, Miller arguably should have had the save but we lost 3-1, not 2-1 so get over it.

 

God people like you piss me off.

 

 

Funny how most of you weren't saying that before this season or for the few games before the Winnipeg game.

The Sabres needing their best players to step up and earn their contracts have been a long standing opinion on this board. Both Miller and Vanek have showed over the years that they can play at an extremely high level and both have showed they can play long stretches of mediocre hockey. When both look mediocre fans are going to question if the Sabres are getting good value.

[nfreeman]

Than trading Vanek needs to be this teams #1 priority. For $7 mil a year you need to have a top 50 player. There are over 100 forwards that average more ice time than Vanek and 55 forwards with more points.

 

This team needs their top priced talent to produce on a nightly basis. Right now the Sabres have over $13 mil tied up in Vanek and Miller, they need more from both of them.

 

I completely agree with this post, especially the bolded parts.

 

Vanek isn't top 10, but his a talented forward who has good hands, good skill and good size. He also is the most talented player on the Sabres roster (Myers excluded). He often tries to play through his injuries and has always put the team first. He is a top line LW on most NHL teams and the ONLY offense we had through the first 3 months. Just because we lost to Winnipeg doesnt make the Sabres crap again, please calm down.

 

Yes, the Sabres were tired, yes the probably knew that when they went into the game (stunning that, someone knowing their tired). You really think they just thought they could lose this key match up. The fact is we aren't Calgary, our team identity isn't 'make the playoffs year after year but get nowhere'. We will win a Stanley Cup within a few years, if that means trying but failing to get into the playoffs this year big deal, I'll live with it. Ted Black has stated that and that is the clear direction of the team.

 

Regehr should have had Thorburn, Miller arguably should have had the save but we lost 3-1, not 2-1 so get over it.

 

God people like you piss me off.

 

Wow. So much blather and incoherence in this post it's hard to know where to start.

 

Do you think I am unhappy "just because we lost to Winnipeg?" Or is it more likely due to the high likelihood that the Sabres will miss the playoffs (and thus fail to win a playoff round for the 5th year in a row) despite having the highest payroll in the NHL? Perhaps it has something to do with yet another dreary 3-1 loss in which the multitude of highly-paid forwards yet again fail to deliver any forecheck, offensive zone time, heart, intensity or scoring chances (let alone goals)? Or perhaps it's yet another terrible performance in a critical game?

 

I agree with your incisive observation that they lost 3-1 and not 2-1. To me that emphasizes how poor the forwards played last night. But perhaps I'm missing something.

 

As for TP and TG's ultimate goal, I agree with you that it's to win the SC and I too have confidence that they will get this franchise to where we all want it to go. In the meantime, I think I'm permitted to express unhappiness with the group of losers they've trotted out at forward for the past 5 years, delivering the same unacceptable results.

[Robviously]

Bottom line: Vanek isn't that good. Like many Sabres forwards, he has some talent, he's well overpaid and he doesn't show up in crunch time. I can name 50 NHL players I'd rather have without having to think hard about it.

7th on the Sabres list of all-time goal scorers. :rolleyes:

[Weave]

But it's not about the Jets playing better at home. It's about the Sabres not showing up when it really matters.

 

 

Thank you.

[deluca67]

7th on the Sabres list of all-time goal scorers. :rolleyes:

I looked up the total and was shocked he only has 226 goals, Why does it seem like it should be much more.

[RazielSabre]

The Sabres needing their best players to step up and earn their contracts have been a long standing opinion on this board. Both Miller and Vanek have showed over the years that they can play at an extremely high level and both have showed they can play long stretches of mediocre hockey. When both look mediocre fans are going to question if the Sabres are getting good value.

Vanek can be streaky, sure, it's annoying, sure. The more annoying thing is that his the only top 50 talent on this team and we do rely on him, we have no secondary scoring and for most of the year no offense from the bottom two lines. If anyone has earned a mediocre streak it's him. Yes he should be better at the moment, much much better but he isn't a PPG player. His been a consistent 35 goal scorer, probably capable of a few more, who's played on poor teams (yes, the Sabres have been an average talent team for years, since Drury and Briere walked off actually) and the closest thing to a playmaker his had is Roy, who isn't even a top line center on most teams.

 

Miller has been just awful this season, especially after the Lucic hit. The whole team let him down and the whole organisation screwed the thing up and it got turned into some major event, not helping anything. His been massively overpaid this season but there is a reason he is considered a top 5 goalie in the league. Ignoring the fact Sabres fans got so lazy with Hasek in goal every goalie since has been chased out of town. We're like Philly post-Hextall in that respect.

 

7th on the Sabres list of all-time goal scorers. :rolleyes:

+1

[Claude_Verret]

But it's not about the Jets playing better at home. It's about the Sabres not showing up when it really matters.

 

Historically with this team that argument is most certainly valid, but I don't buy it in the game last night. I attribute more of it to a road weary team at the end of a west coast swing versus a well rested team with the biggest home ice advantage in hockey.

[RazielSabre]

I completely agree with this post, especially the bolded parts.

 

 

 

Wow. So much blather and incoherence in this post it's hard to know where to start.

 

Do you think I am unhappy "just because we lost to Winnipeg?" Or is it more likely due to the high likelihood that the Sabres will miss the playoffs (and thus fail to win a playoff round for the 5th year in a row) despite having the highest payroll in the NHL? Perhaps it has something to do with yet another dreary 3-1 loss in which the multitude of highly-paid forwards yet again fail to deliver any forecheck, offensive zone time, heart, intensity or scoring chances (let alone goals)? Or perhaps it's yet another terrible performance in a critical game?

 

I agree with your incisive observation that they lost 3-1 and not 2-1. To me that emphasizes how poor the forwards played last night. But perhaps I'm missing something.

 

As for TP and TG's ultimate goal, I agree with you that it's to win the SC and I too have confidence that they will get this franchise to where we all want it to go. In the meantime, I think I'm permitted to express unhappiness with the group of losers they've trotted out at forward for the past 5 years, delivering the same unacceptable results.

 

The problem is the same load of not thought out, dreary bile gets spewed out after EVERY loss. Not an ounce of rationale in it, same ###### different game.

 

Historically with this team that argument is most certainly valid, but I don't buy it in the game last night. I attribute more of it to a road weary team at the end of a west coast swing versus a well rested team with the biggest home ice advantage in hockey.

That was certainly a big part of it, from what I read and saw before the game about the Jets.

[deluca67]

Vanek can be streaky, sure, it's annoying, sure. The more annoying thing is that his the only top 50 talent on this team and we do rely on him, we have no secondary scoring and for most of the year no offense from the bottom two lines. If anyone has earned a mediocre streak it's him. Yes he should be better at the moment, much much better but he isn't a PPG player. His been a consistent 35 goal scorer, probably capable of a few more, who's played on poor teams (yes, the Sabres have been an average talent team for years, since Drury and Briere walked off actually) and the closest thing to a playmaker his had is Roy, who isn't even a top line center on most teams.

 

Miller has been just awful this season, especially after the Lucic hit. The whole team let him down and the whole organisation screwed the thing up and it got turned into some major event, not helping anything. His been massively overpaid this season but there is a reason he is considered a top 5 goalie in the league. Ignoring the fact Sabres fans got so lazy with Hasek in goal every goalie since has been chased out of town. We're like Philly post-Hextall in that respect.

 

 

+1

Everyone agrees Vanek is a quality goal scorer. What he is proving now is that when he doesn't score he doesn't bring much else to the rink. For the cap hit he needs to find other ways to contribute. He's in his 7th year, he is pretty much the player he is going to be, there is not much more as far as potential. For the price tag I would like to see a little more.

 

I'm am going to bow out of any Miller conversation for now and save it for the off-season. My thoughts on Miller are well known and don't want go back over well traveled ground.

[RazielSabre]

Everyone agrees Vanek is a quality goal scorer. What he is proving now is that when he doesn't score he doesn't bring much else to the rink. For the cap hit he needs to find other ways to contribute. He's in his 7th year, he is pretty much the player he is going to be, there is not much more as far as potential. For the price tag I would like to see a little more.

 

I'm am going to bow out of any Miller conversation for now and save it for the off-season. My thoughts on Miller are well known and don't want go back over well traveled ground.

Yes I wasn't going to add anything about Miller, we all know how we all feel. His been a quality PKer, very good on the power play and lead our offense. He'll never live up to $7mill a year but Regier didn't have a choice at the time, Edmonton played his bluff and he had to prove Drury/Briere wasn't going to happen again.

 

EDIT: Vanek I mean, not Miller lol.

[deluca67]

Historically with this team that argument is most certainly valid, but I don't buy it in the game last night. I attribute more of it to a road weary team at the end of a west coast swing versus a well rested team with the biggest home ice advantage in hockey.

IMO, if the game was played in Buffalo than the Sabres win a game they shouldn't have won. Timing means a lot when it comes scheduling. Not being at your best in a tough building to win is a recipe for a loss. Ideally you would like to have a lessor team at home considering the games the Sabres played leading up to last night.

[Punch]

The problem is the same load of not thought out, dreary bile gets spewed out after EVERY loss. Not an ounce of rationale in it, same ###### different game.

 

 

That was certainly a big part of it, from what I read and saw before the game about the Jets.

 

There's no question the Jets were fresh from the long homestand and extra days of rest and also energized from their crowd and the Sabres were the exact opposite at the end of a long road trip. It was a perfect recipe for a dreary 3-1 loss. HOWEVER, this Sabres team can only stand up to a physically superior team when all the elements are exactly right. If they're gassed, they fold. They're not built for the playoffs and last night was a pretty good look at a playoff atmosphere. That's why there are many that are frustrated this morning.

 

I fully expect them to make a go of it and continue to challenge for the 8th spot, but I'm not optimistic considering they're consistently physically overmatched, night after night, even in the games that they've won in this stretch.

[deluca67]

Yes I wasn't going to add anything about Miller, we all know how we all feel. His been a quality PKer, very good on the power play and lead our offense. He'll never live up to $7mill a year but Regier didn't have a choice at the time, Edmonton played his bluff and he had to prove drury/briere wasn't going to happen again.

The Sabres are far enough removed from that situation where they should take a long hard look at Vanek and his contract. Is there an opportunity for the Sabres to get more out of Vanek? In regards to both production and ice time.

[nfreeman]

The problem is the same load of not thought out, dreary bile gets spewed out after EVERY loss. Not an ounce of rationale in it, same ###### different game.

 

Really? What, exactly, about the complaint regarding the forwards was "not thought out" or lacked rationale? Do you think the Sabres' group of forwards is a quality group? If so, why?

 

Just because you don't want to hear it doesn't mean it's not logical.

[Robviously]

I looked up the total and was shocked he only has 226 goals, Why does it seem like it should be much more.

He has more goals than Rene Robert and in less games. And he sure as hell isn't playing with Perrault and Martin.

 

Yes, he's horribly streaky. He's also played for mostly horrible teams. I just can't stand that no one ever misses an opportunity to declare "There are 30, 50, 100 NHL players I'd rather have!!!!1!" Yeah, no kidding. You could say that about literally every player on our team.

[LastPommerFan]

The Sabres were absolutely gassed last night. How they perform wednesday, and especially against boston will determine, for me, if last nights game was a problem or the result of 4 in 6 on the road and thousands of miles in travel playing a team that has been at home for 3 weeks with 3 days rest.

 

Still have a Game in Hand on the jets, the jets play against playoff teams in 6 of their next ten, we play playoff teams in 4 of our next 10. There is no excuse for us not to be in 8th place with 6 games to play. Even with this loss.