Kassian to Vancouver for Hodgson

[FolignosJock]

Haha, good point.

 

look at really large athletes, yao ming and greg oden and others. Those that are huge have bodies that break down a lot more than those of average size. Is that really your argument?

[nfreeman]

How could you not be shocked??? There has been 6 offer sheets in the last 14 years, obviously due to the CBA but if tyler ennis is the 7th that is pretty shocking. If someone said at the trade deadline that you get a 1st and a third for ennis, you make that deal. Its not giving up on him it is getting a higher return. Im not saying I wouldnt sign him around 3 million, but if a team wants to take him they are going to have to offer him higher than we are willing to offer, so if they go with that 5 million dollar sheet (which they wont) the compensation is much better than overpaying. I think ennis is awesome but not at 5 million a year.

 

I wouldn't trade Ennis for a 1st and a 3rd unless the picks were in the top 5 of the respective rounds.

[Derrico]

look at really large athletes, yao ming and greg oden and others. Those that are huge have bodies that break down a lot more than those of average size. Is that really your argument?

 

So your argument is to only have what average sized players on your team? Come on, if your point is that you don't want to invest too much in Ennis because he's small and small players tend to get injured more then I think that's weak. You must be pretty upset in the investment we made in Tyler1.

[shrader]

I did say "obviously due to the CBA" dont you think for ennis to get a sheet would be pretty shocking when less than one a year is handed out and none in the last two eyars though? that is my only argument

 

No, I completely agree with you. We just need to refine that time window a bit as the rules were completely different prior to 2005. It's not going to happen and I beat that drum every single offseason. Another thing about those 6 offers, Vanek-Penner and Backes-Bernier are directly tied to each other so in a way, there really were only 4 cases over those 6 years where offers were signed.

[FolignosJock]

So your argument is to only have what average sized players on your team? Come on, if your point is that you don't want to invest too much in Ennis because he's small and small players tend to get injured more then I think that's weak. You must be pretty upset in the investment we made in Tyler1.

 

 

When bigger people hit smaller people a lot throughout years of an NHL career those shorter players are most definately more prone for injuries than those that are equal to or bigger than the ones doing the hitting. This is not my end all be all determination of signing an offer sheet for ennis. But it should be a factor. He has not sustained this level of play for an entire season especially with the higher amount of work a center puts in. I am only saying I would rather get the picks than over pay ennis and give him jordan staal type money when he is most definately not at the level of staal.

[Weave]

Intuitively it may seem to make sense that smaller players get injured more, but really, if you are going to state it as fact you'd better have some hard data to post or link to to back it up. And a couple of anecdotal cases =/= hard data.

[LastPommerFan]

Intuitively it may seem to make sense that smaller players get injured more, but really, if you are going to state it as fact you'd better have some hard data to post or link to to back it up. And a couple of anecdotal cases =/= hard data.

 

Ennis/Gerbe = 52 Games missed

Myers/Regehr = 29 Games missed

 

The little duo misses approx 2x the time the big duo does!!!

 

(you didn't say i couldn't cherry pick slightly irrelevant and misleading data ;))

[Kristian]

so because Ennis accidentally slid foot first into the goal post he is more injury prone? And Gerbe getting blasted face first into the boards makes him more injury prone? I can't agree. If the injuries were things like shoulder injuries or even something along the lines of getting banged up I would be with you. but considering Ennis has had 1 injury, not really sure that counts. I mean Tyler Myers got injured so maybe really big guys get injured too? Roy has been healthy every year minus last season. Injuries are sometimes chronic (TIM CONNOLLY) but in all honesty its usually just an unlucky play here or there.

 

Eric Lindros is a prime example of just that.

 

Keith Primeau too.

Edited March 29, 2012 by Kristian

[Robviously]

How could you not be shocked??? There has been 6 offer sheets in the last 14 years, obviously due to the CBA but if tyler ennis is the 7th that is pretty shocking. If someone said at the trade deadline that you get a 1st and a third for ennis, you make that deal. Its not giving up on him it is getting a higher return. Im not saying I wouldnt sign him around 3 million, but if a team wants to take him they are going to have to offer him higher than we are willing to offer, so if they go with that 5 million dollar sheet (which they wont) the compensation is much better than overpaying. I think ennis is awesome but not at 5 million a year.

I wouldn't trade Ennis for a 1st and a 3rd unless the picks were in the top 5 of the respective rounds.

Same here. If Ennis was part of a package that got me to the very top of the draft, I'd definitely consider it. But I wouldn't trade him for any 1st round pick and 3rd round pick.

 

Also, I do agree (intuitively) that being smaller probably makes it tougher for a guy to stay healthy in the NHL. But it's not everything. If not for that cheap shot last year, Pominville would have never missed any time and he's just an average-sized guy. Style of play really matters when you think about who gets hurt and who doesn't. And some guys are just more durable than others.

[FolignosJock]

Same here. If Ennis was part of a package that got me to the very top of the draft, I'd definitely consider it. But I wouldn't trade him for any 1st round pick and 3rd round pick.

 

Also, I do agree (intuitively) that being smaller probably makes it tougher for a guy to stay healthy in the NHL. But it's not everything. If not for that cheap shot last year, Pominville would have never missed any time and he's just an average-sized guy. Style of play really matters when you think about who gets hurt and who doesn't. And some guys are just more durable than others.

 

I can pick and choose any small guys that have been hurt but that doesnt really help this convo and even if i did the people on the other side would pick the injury and say it was a freak case just as they did with gerbe and ennis

[papazoid]

Cody Hodgson due for breakout season in 2012-13:

 

 

With six games remaining, Tampa Bay’s Steven Stamkos has 55 goals and a legitimate shot at 60.

Meanwhile, Tyler Seguin has taken over as Boston’s go-to scorer as a sophomore, leading the team with 61 points through 75 games. James Neal has been a revelation for the Penguins, nearly doubling his offensive production from last year and smashing his previous career high by 20 points. Carolina’s Jeff Skinner is on nearly the same points-per-game pace as last year’s Calder Trophy-winning season, despite missing 16 games to a concussion and two to suspension.

 

What do all these players have in common? They all train with Gary Roberts in the off-season.

 

And I have a sneaking suspicion that next year’s breakout player in the NHL will be Buffalo’s Cody Hodgson.

 

Not surprisingly, the newest Sabres weapon is also a client of ‘Scary’ Gary and whatever subterfuge has been out there in the past about Hodgson’s attitude can pretty much be tossed out the window based on the company he keeps in the summer. Simply put, Roberts does not mess around. What the former NHLer preaches is no less than a lifestyle decision, where players commit themselves to both rigorous workouts and nutrition rites involving organic food and the right kinds of it.

 

http://www.thehockeynews.com/articles/45945-Kennedy-Cody-Hodgson-due-for-breakout-season-in-201213.html

[shrader]

Same here. If Ennis was part of a package that got me to the very top of the draft, I'd definitely consider it. But I wouldn't trade him for any 1st round pick and 3rd round pick.

 

Also, I do agree (intuitively) that being smaller probably makes it tougher for a guy to stay healthy in the NHL. But it's not everything. If not for that cheap shot last year, Pominville would have never missed any time and he's just an average-sized guy. Style of play really matters when you think about who gets hurt and who doesn't. And some guys are just more durable than others.

 

And speaking of Pominville, there's also those complete fluke events like he had in the playoffs last year, being cut by a skate. Buffalo's the perfect example that this can happen to anyone of any size, since both Pominville and Gaustad have had it happen in recent years.

 

And speaking of flukes, the whole Gerbe skate to the face thing earlier this year. That's a rare case where his size probably played to his advantage. Just imagine where that skate hits if he's slightly taller.

[BetterDays06]

Cody Hodgson due for breakout season in 2012-13:

 

 

With six games remaining, Tampa Bay’s Steven Stamkos has 55 goals and a legitimate shot at 60.

Meanwhile, Tyler Seguin has taken over as Boston’s go-to scorer as a sophomore, leading the team with 61 points through 75 games. James Neal has been a revelation for the Penguins, nearly doubling his offensive production from last year and smashing his previous career high by 20 points. Carolina’s Jeff Skinner is on nearly the same points-per-game pace as last year’s Calder Trophy-winning season, despite missing 16 games to a concussion and two to suspension.

 

What do all these players have in common? They all train with Gary Roberts in the off-season.

 

And I have a sneaking suspicion that next year’s breakout player in the NHL will be Buffalo’s Cody Hodgson.

 

Not surprisingly, the newest Sabres weapon is also a client of ‘Scary’ Gary and whatever subterfuge has been out there in the past about Hodgson’s attitude can pretty much be tossed out the window based on the company he keeps in the summer. Simply put, Roberts does not mess around. What the former NHLer preaches is no less than a lifestyle decision, where players commit themselves to both rigorous workouts and nutrition rites involving organic food and the right kinds of it.

 

http://www.thehockey...-in-201213.html

I loved this article, everyone should read it. I pray buffalo signs Hodgson to a 5-6 year deal. He definitely has what it takes to be our number 2, if not number 1.

[FolignosJock]

And speaking of Pominville, there's also those complete fluke events like he had in the playoffs last year, being cut by a skate. Buffalo's the perfect example that this can happen to anyone of any size, since both Pominville and Gaustad have had it happen in recent years.

 

And speaking of flukes, the whole Gerbe skate to the face thing earlier this year. That's a rare case where his size probably played to his advantage. Just imagine where that skate hits if he's slightly taller.

 

it may have hit him where he has pads.... i dont think this is a good examply because it was such a freak accident though

[LGR4GM]

I wouldn't trade Ennis for a 1st and a 3rd unless the picks were in the top 5 of the respective rounds.

Thank you. At least someone sees Ennis for what he is. This is his sophmore year and despite injury if you run is ppga against his rookie year its up. Ennis is better this year than he was last year. A lot of that has to do with him having more room and puck control at center. I wouldn't trade him unless its for a top 5 first rounder and a top 5 2nd personally but if a 4mil offer sheet for 4 years hits the table, I match and sign him. Tyler Ennis and his linemates have something like 38pts in the last 9games.

[FolignosJock]

Thank you. At least someone sees Ennis for what he is. This is his sophmore year and despite injury if you run is ppga against his rookie year its up. Ennis is better this year than he was last year. A lot of that has to do with him having more room and puck control at center. I wouldn't trade him unless its for a top 5 first rounder and a top 5 2nd personally but if a 4mil offer sheet for 4 years hits the table, I match and sign him. Tyler Ennis and his linemates have something like 38pts in the last 9games.

 

4 million is a little high but i would most likely do that especially if this keeps up into the playoffs but that is pretty high. If its closer to five million i probably turn it down, this is a kid that has not played center for very long and he looks great right now i would just like a larger sample size before im paying him top 20 center money.

[FolignosJock]

Darcy traded away 6 points and a -4 rating for a first round pick 10 points and a +1 so far, to me this has to be his best deadline day. I know he did well before but he got helped by new NHL rules and a lockout. This is quite impressive

[Robviously]

4 million is a little high but i would most likely do that especially if this keeps up into the playoffs but that is pretty high. If its closer to five million i probably turn it down, this is a kid that has not played center for very long and he looks great right now i would just like a larger sample size before im paying him top 20 center money.

The sample sizes for most players in the 2008 draft (i.e. players the same age as Ennis) are pretty small:

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2008e.html

 

It's remarkable how many games/points we've already gotten out of our first three picks in that draft (Myers, Ennis, Adam) and now we have Hodgson from that draft as well. That was a really good draft for the Sabres and will only get better if Ennis the Center is for real and if Adam turns things around.

[LGR4GM]

4 million is a little high but i would most likely do that especially if this keeps up into the playoffs but that is pretty high. If its closer to five million i probably turn it down, this is a kid that has not played center for very long and he looks great right now i would just like a larger sample size before im paying him top 20 center money.

Tyler Ennis is not going to get a 5million dollar offer sheet from anyone. If he got 4 I would be stunned. Actually if he gets an offer sheet at all I would be stunned. Tyler Ennis will be signed prior to July 1

[nfreeman]

Tyler Ennis is not going to get a 5million dollar offer sheet from anyone. If he got 4 I would be stunned. Actually if he gets an offer sheet at all I would be stunned. Tyler Ennis will be signed prior to July 1

 

I think you're right about all of this.

[shrader]

Tyler Ennis is not going to get a 5million dollar offer sheet from anyone. If he got 4 I would be stunned. Actually if he gets an offer sheet at all I would be stunned. Tyler Ennis will be signed prior to July 1

 

You've learned a bit in your year here. Nice work.

[drnkirishone]

Is Kevin Lowe the GM anywhere in the NHL still? If not then I am not worried about anyone getting a offer sheet

[TheMatrix31]

Love that Hodgson article. If we make it to the playoffs, I have a feeling he's gonna have a huge impact.

[LGR4GM]

You've learned a bit in your year here. Nice work.

I've been attempting to read more and post off the cuff less. To elaborate on what I said, considering Ennis' limited sample/body of work, it is unlikely a team would try to poach him or give up a 1st rnd pick + for him. Personally I think Ennis will be a very good player as time goes by. If you look around the league most GM's avoid offer sheets and considering that the owner of this team has demonstrated he has absolutely no problem spending cash, it makes the Sabres RFA's less vulnerable.

[Knightrider]

This thread has drifted a bit from strictly a discussion re: Kassian-Hodgson, but I saw this Hockey News article this afternoon and thought the notion that Hodgson trains under Gary Roberts in the offseason probably should dispel any real concerns about a bad attitude:

 

http://www.thehockey...-in-201213.html

 

"Not surprisingly, the newest Sabres weapon is also a client of ‘Scary’ Gary and whatever subterfuge has been out there in the past about Hodgson’s attitude can pretty much be tossed out the window based on the company he keeps in the summer. Simply put, Roberts does not mess around. What the former NHLer preaches is no less than a lifestyle decision, where players commit themselves to both rigorous workouts and nutrition rites involving organic food and the right kinds of it."

 

He ought to drag Myers with him...