spndnchz Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 Columbus got screwed last night. Somehow the clock stops during the last seconds of play only to restart and the Kings get the goal to win. Howson explains http://bluejackets.n...blog.htm?id=106 UPDATE: Seems someone has taken down his blog this morning but the screen grab is...
Eleven Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 Columbus got screwed last night. Somehow the clock stops during the last seconds of play only to restart and the Kings get the goal to win. Howson explains http://bluejackets.n...blog.htm?id=106 WOW. It almost has to be deliberate.
frissonic Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 WOW. It almost has to be deliberate. 25+ years of watching sports of every kind ... I've NEVER seen anything like that. I find it extremely hard to believe that that was any kind of mechanical malfunction.
dEnnis the Menace Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 wow. that's gotta be tough to swallow. I wonder what the NHL is going to find. I don't see how they could determine if it was deliberate or not. Sadly Howson is right too. What if it comes down to one point like it has in several of the past few seasons?
frissonic Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 WOW. It almost has to be deliberate. I'm assuming chz pulled this out to make it its own thread since my original comment is still in the "Around the NHL" thread, but yah. I find it damn near impossible to believe that that's a mechanical error.
shrader Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 WOW. It almost has to be deliberate. I don't know how you deliberately stop the clock for exactly 1 second. That certainly can't be done by a human. It's funny though. If you watch the full speed "live" video on the Columbus broadcast, their clock stops at 1.8 seconds too.
nobody Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 I'm assuming chz pulled this out to make it its own thread since my original comment is still in the "Around the NHL" thread, but yah. I find it damn near impossible to believe that that's a mechanical error. Not anymore it isn't - looks like we have our own conspiracy going on! :) Mechanical or not - the BJs and the rest of the western conference got robbed.
IKnowPhysics Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 Replay: http://www.nhl.com/i...m?id=2011020753 It looks like a situation that could give rise to human error: the shot comes in, the timekeeper sees the save with less than two seconds left, they're quick to stop the clock because either they assumed there'd be a whistle or maybe for a split second they thought they missed the whistle because they couldn't hear it. A full second+ later, the timekeeper realizes the whistle didn't blow and the puck is actually loose, so they start the clock again, of course giving Doughty just enough time to bury the puck after the it got lost in seven skaters' feet. Sanford immediately points at the clock. The refs/Toronto review the goal and see that the puck crosses the line before time expires, but nobody checks the length of the 1.8s mark. There's no indication, besides the clock itself, that a stoppage has occurred (there's no exclusive clock on/off light).
thesportsbuff Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 sounds like a terrible place to have an all star game, can we get a re-vote?
That Aud Smell Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBrdSZ0t_-U&feature=player_embedded Now, the clock does move a little faster after it stirs from its coma, but it still gains at least half a second, and considering Doughty scores with 00.3 seconds remaining, we have a genuine controversy on our hands. http://sports.yahoo....BHRlc3QD;_ylv=3 I don't know how you deliberately stop the clock for exactly 1 second. That certainly can't be done by a human. It's funny though. If you watch the full speed "live" video on the Columbus broadcast, their clock stops at 1.8 seconds too. Campbell confirmed that the clock on the screen in television replays of the goal is in fact the official in-arena clock and not that of the broadcaster: http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/ EDIT: also, this C. Campbell says result of CBJ-LA game can't change regardless of investigation. ``No you can’t. Once the game is over, it’s over,'' he said. https://twitter.com/...121865373851648
shrader Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 Smell, I was actually talking about the clock built into the score graphic that was used during the actual live broadcast of the game, not the replay video. Those are the ones that aren't typically lined up perfectly with the true game clock. Watching those things can be funny sometimes. That final minute countdown tends to jump around a bit.
TheChimp Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 Replay: http://www.nhl.com/i...m?id=2011020753 It looks like a situation that could give rise to human error: the shot comes in, the timekeeper sees the save with less than two seconds left, they're quick to stop the clock because either they assumed there'd be a whistle or maybe for a split second they thought they missed the whistle because they couldn't hear it. A full second+ later, the timekeeper realizes the whistle didn't blow and the puck is actually loose, so they start the clock again, of course giving Doughty just enough time to bury the puck after the it got lost in seven skaters' feet. Sanford immediately points at the clock. The refs/Toronto review the goal and see that the puck crosses the line before time expires, but nobody checks the length of the 1.8s mark. There's no indication, besides the clock itself, that a stoppage has occurred (there's no exclusive clock on/off light). Fact that it went to replay and they still didn't bother to get it right is yet one more argument against replay. Which bites, because it SHOULD be fool-proof. Perhaps professional sports needs to spend some more money hiring better support staff....
MattPie Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 25+ years of watching sports of every kind ... I've NEVER seen anything like that. I find it extremely hard to believe that that was any kind of mechanical malfunction. I know I've seen something like this in basketball, unless you mean the clock actually pausing rather than the home timekeeper holding the clock for a second when play starts. Fact that it went to replay and they still didn't bother to get it right is yet one more argument against replay. Which bites, because it SHOULD be fool-proof. Perhaps professional sports needs to spend some more money hiring better support staff.... I'm calling BS. Replay screws up once and you want to trash the entire system? ... I have a feeling I've just been trolled.
TheChimp Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 I'm calling BS. Replay screws up once and you want to trash the entire system? ... I have a feeling I've just been trolled. I only said it provided one more example of how something that was sold to us as a help to the game was misused and made redundant. Try and relax. I even made reference to them hiring better people to operate the replay booth, dunno if you caught that as you ranted about "Chimp the Troll". Parrot.
IKnowPhysics Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 I don't know if the game-time video reviewers in Toronto have a protocol for addressing clock anomalies. If they don't, they couldn't overturn the call on the ice. Funnier to me is this: http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=386722 "Those clocks are sophisticated instruments that calculate time by measuring electrical charges called coulombs," explained Kings general manager Dean Lombardi in an email to TSN. "Given the rapidity and volume of electrons that move through the measuring device the calibrator must adjust at certain points which was the delay you see – the delay is just recalibrating for the clock moving too quickly during the 10 - 10ths of a second before the delay - this insures that the actual playing time during a period is exactly 20 minutes. That is not an opinion - that is science - amazing devise quite frankly."
MattPie Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 I only said it provided one more example of how something that was sold to us as a help to the game was misused and made redundant. Try and relax. I even made reference to them hiring better people to operate the replay booth, dunno if you caught that as you ranted about "Chimp the Troll". Parrot. Heh, that was hardly a rant.
spndnchz Posted February 2, 2012 Author Report Posted February 2, 2012 snip... “Those clocks are sophisticated instruments that calculate time by measuring electrical charges called coulombs—given the rapidity and volume of electrons that move through the measuring device the calibrator must adjust at certain points which was the delay you see—the delay is just recalibrating for the clock moving too quickly during the 10 - 10ths of a second before the delay—this insures that the actual playing time during a period is exactly 20 minutes That is not an opinion—that is science—amazing devise quite frankly.” -Dean Lombardi, GM for the LA Kings All seems so simple....
MattPie Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 snip... “Those clocks are sophisticated instruments that calculate time by measuring electrical charges called coulombs—given the rapidity and volume of electrons that move through the measuring device the calibrator must adjust at certain points which was the delay you see—the delay is just recalibrating for the clock moving too quickly during the 10 - 10ths of a second before the delay—this insures that the actual playing time during a period is exactly 20 minutes That is not an opinion—that is science—amazing devise quite frankly.” -Dean Lombardi, GM for the LA Kings All seems so simple.... He's also full of it. A coulomb is a unit of charge, analogous to a volume of water, like a gallon. Unless there's something strange going on, no clocks run on current any more because current through a circuit is variable on things like heat. In modern clocks, there's an oscillator that runs at a specific frequency. So electrically the voltage goes from high to low to high at a very predictable rate The output of the oscillator is piped into a circuit that counts the highs and lows. When it counts the correct amount of cycles (frequency / 10), the counter circuit signals that the 'wall clock' should drop by 0.1s. The counter resets and waits to count the correct number again. There's no reasonable way that it would auto-calibrate, since you'd need a better source of time to compare it to. If you have a better source time available, why not just use that one?
thesportsbuff Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 snip... “Those clocks are sophisticated instruments that calculate time by measuring electrical charges called coulombs—given the rapidity and volume of electrons that move through the measuring device the calibrator must adjust at certain points which was the delay you see—the delay is just recalibrating for the clock moving too quickly during the 10 - 10ths of a second before the delay—this insures that the actual playing time during a period is exactly 20 minutes That is not an opinion—that is science—amazing devise quite frankly.” -Dean Lombardi, GM for the LA Kings All seems so simple.... I didn't know there was any science behind it, but this is what I was trying to explain to my friend earlier. If you watch any hockey game, the clock ALWAYS freezes during the last 1-2 seconds for just a moment and then corrects... of course, that's the clock we see on TV, not necessarily the scoreboard clock, so it may not be relevant. But I assume the same theory applies. I see it every time and always thought it was just some sort of mess up.
K-9 Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 snip... “Those clocks are sophisticated instruments that calculate time by measuring electrical charges called coulombs—given the rapidity and volume of electrons that move through the measuring device the calibrator must adjust at certain points which was the delay you see—the delay is just recalibrating for the clock moving too quickly during the 10 - 10ths of a second before the delay—this insures that the actual playing time during a period is exactly 20 minutes That is not an opinion—that is science—amazing devise quite frankly.” -Dean Lombardi, GM for the LA Kings All seems so simple.... Duh! GO SABRES!!!
Sabres Fan in NS Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 How bout this for conspiracy theories ... They (Columbus) paid off the timekeeper to mess with the clock so LA would have more time to score ... "Fail for Nail"
Two or less Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 WOW. It almost has to be deliberate. Yeah, i can't believe how many media people are blaming mechanical error. C'mon. Kings had the PP, in their own zone, and the dude stopped the clock for about 1.5 seconds to give them a slight bigger advantage. And it worked and in todays technology, we found it. My question isn't if this was deliberate or not, because it had to be, my question is, how often does this happen, with NO AVAIL, but despite not working out, it's still cheating.
nobody Posted February 2, 2012 Report Posted February 2, 2012 He's also full of it. A coulomb is a unit of charge, analogous to a volume of water, like a gallon. Unless there's something strange going on, no clocks run on current any more because current through a circuit is variable on things like heat. In modern clocks, there's an oscillator that runs at a specific frequency. So electrically the voltage goes from high to low to high at a very predictable rate The output of the oscillator is piped into a circuit that counts the highs and lows. When it counts the correct amount of cycles (frequency / 10), the counter circuit signals that the 'wall clock' should drop by 0.1s. The counter resets and waits to count the correct number again. There's no reasonable way that it would auto-calibrate, since you'd need a better source of time to compare it to. If you have a better source time available, why not just use that one? It's all Time Warners fault - the time guy in LA tried going to the US atomic clock but there was a glitch with his internet connection. Question about Coulomb's law - does the F stand for Falk? :)
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