SportsFan88 Posted January 14, 2012 Report Posted January 14, 2012 Gotta chime in for a a sec. I admit I haven't read the thread, too long. But what is wrong with the Ducks this year? They have the same team pretty much as last year, how they can be this bad is beyond me. Also isn't Getzlaf still under contract for next year? Why fire sale all of these guys, if any this year? The Ducks are really underachieving with the talent they have.
deluca67 Posted January 14, 2012 Report Posted January 14, 2012 Isn't it illegal under the CBA? The Sabres can request to talk to Getzlaf before a trade is completed. Like they did with Regehr. The Sabres can lay out a long term plan with Getzlaf including their willingness to address a long term, financially significant. commitment. If the Ducks are willing to listen and Getzlaf would be willing to come to Buffalo and consider a long term contract, it is a opportunity too good to pass up. That is fine too, but I want a draft pick out of that deal. Miller though not playing great is better than Hiller and Myers in my opinion is a one of a kind, whereas Getzlaf if very talented, but not at Myers level lifetime. Give me a first round draft choice and I would throw in Stafford. Contract extension issue resolved as well. Hiller has a slightly higher save percentage and his gga is only .01 higher than Miller's over their careers. Miller has more of a track record and is more established as a NHL star, statically they are pretty close. A top line of Vanek - Getzlaf - Pominville and a goalie rotation with Hiller and Enroth sounds really good to me.
waldo Posted January 14, 2012 Report Posted January 14, 2012 well that's insightful My meh was in response to your willingness to use a bogus statistical argument to support your position relating to Mr. Myers. impact. You are better than that. You boy played the best game of his year against Toronto last night. Loved his game . His position was very good, he was physical, moved the puck well, made relatively quick decisions ( for him) on his outlet passes, did not cough up the puck in the defensive zone more than a couple of times, and he blocked a number of shots. The context being , he was fresh and the game was against Toronto.Lindy would do him a great service by not playing him 20+ minutes a night . I was equally impressed with the fourth lines play last night.
nfreeman Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 As a follow-up to my earlier post, Hammy was on WGR with Howard Simon yesterday and they asked him about the piece -- in particular, whether it was Hammy's opinion that Anaheim would require Myers in return for Getzlaf, or whether that was based on something he'd been told by Anaheim. He confirmed that that came from a source of his with the Ducks. So, if you believe him and his source, the price for Getzlaf is Myers.
shrader Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 As a follow-up to my earlier post, Hammy was on WGR with Howard Simon yesterday and they asked him about the piece -- in particular, whether it was Hammy's opinion that Anaheim would require Myers in return for Getzlaf, or whether that was based on something he'd been told by Anaheim. He confirmed that that came from a source of his with the Ducks. So, if you believe him and his source, the price for Getzlaf is Myers. So one side sets the bar as high as possible? Shocking bit of information there. Is there any other first step to a negotiation process?
RazielSabre Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Myers, Vanek, Miller and Pom are off the table for me. Unless Miller has expressed a desire to leave (which as far as I know he hasn't). Doesn't Getzlaf become a UFA at end of season? If so I'd lay, Roy, Stafford or a 1st on the table and walk off. His call. Our problem lies with management, not missing a damn centre, thats just one small issue.
Sabres Fan in NS Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 As a follow-up to my earlier post, Hammy was on WGR with Howard Simon yesterday and they asked him about the piece -- in particular, whether it was Hammy's opinion that Anaheim would require Myers in return for Getzlaf, or whether that was based on something he'd been told by Anaheim. He confirmed that that came from a source of his with the Ducks. So, if you believe him and his source, the price for Getzlaf is Myers. I do believe that Myers would be the Ducks asking price and I don't really think it is an unreasonable asking price. With what both teams have done the last week or so, since this thread was started, I doubt that a deal is happening any time soon. Maybe nearer to the trade deadline depending on how each team performs in the coming weeks leading to the deadline.
SportsFan88 Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 As a follow-up to my earlier post, Hammy was on WGR with Howard Simon yesterday and they asked him about the piece -- in particular, whether it was Hammy's opinion that Anaheim would require Myers in return for Getzlaf, or whether that was based on something he'd been told by Anaheim. He confirmed that that came from a source of his with the Ducks. So, if you believe him and his source, the price for Getzlaf is Myers. Myers and Miller for Getlaf, a prospect of some kind and a 2nd or 3rd round draft pick. That is a fair trade though involving Myers, our best player for perhaps their best player. Only other thing we could do is offer Vanek... Myers, Vanek, Miller and Pom are off the table for me. Unless Miller has expressed a desire to leave (which as far as I know he hasn't). Doesn't Getzlaf become a UFA at end of season? If so I'd lay, Roy, Stafford or a 1st on the table and walk off. His call. Our problem lies with management, not missing a damn centre, thats just one small issue. Roy and Stafford for Getlaf is a total ripoff. Doubt Anahiem would fall for that.
LabattBlue Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Our problem lies with management, not missing a damn centre, thats just one small issue. While I agree that there are several problems with the team, the center problem isn't one "small" issue. It has been a BIG issue with the Sabres, their farm team, and in the amateur ranks since 7-1-2007.
spndnchz Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Myers, Vanek, Miller and Pom are off the table for me. Unless Miller has expressed a desire to leave (which as far as I know he hasn't). Doesn't Getzlaf become a UFA at end of season? If so I'd lay, Roy, Stafford or a 1st on the table and walk off. His call. Our problem lies with management, not missing a damn centre, thats just one small issue. Getzlaf is signed through 2012-13.
thesportsbuff Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Myers, Vanek, Miller and Pom are off the table for me. Unless Miller has expressed a desire to leave (which as far as I know he hasn't). Doesn't Getzlaf become a UFA at end of season? If so I'd lay, Roy, Stafford or a 1st on the table and walk off. His call. Our problem lies with management, not missing a damn centre, thats just one small issue. Not having a #1 center for 5+ years is more than "one small issue." I wouldn't trade this years first rounder, whether we get Getzlaf or not, there's a good chance we wind up with a Top 10 pick. Myers and Miller for Getlaf, a prospect of some kind and a 2nd or 3rd round draft pick. That is a fair trade though involving Myers, our best player for perhaps their best player. Only other thing we could do is offer Vanek... I don't get it. The proposed trade is Myers for Getzlaf.... so you'll throw in Miller for a 3rd round pick and "some kind" of prospect? In any event, the numbers won't work for the Ducks. For Miller to be moved, a starting goalie has to come back. I don't think the Ducks can afford to pay two goalies 4+ million each. Anyway... I'm still on the fence. I think I'd do Myers for Getzlaf.
SportsFan88 Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Not having a #1 center for 5+ years is more than "one small issue." I wouldn't trade this years first rounder, whether we get Getzlaf or not, there's a good chance we wind up with a Top 10 pick. I don't get it. The proposed trade is Myers for Getzlaf.... so you'll throw in Miller for a 3rd round pick and "some kind" of prospect? In any event, the numbers won't work for the Ducks. For Miller to be moved, a starting goalie has to come back. I don't think the Ducks can afford to pay two goalies 4+ million each. Anyway... I'm still on the fence. I think I'd do Myers for Getzlaf. The Ducks have two goalie prospects under contract(actually 3 but one is at the bottom of the depth chart and is going nowhere and i'm certain they won't resign him after his entry level deal ends next year) and Hiller. They could move one of those three guys.(Tarkki, Bobkov or Hiller) Tarkki: http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=7555 Bobkov: http://www.eliteprospects.com/player.php?player=34768 They also have Dan Ellis but he is hurt. Have no idea what his injury status is though and when he might return.
JKB1646 Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 No Way! It takes a D man four to five yrs to reach thier potential. Myers will be the cornerstone of our franchise in yrs to come.
nfreeman Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 So one side sets the bar as high as possible? Shocking bit of information there. Is there any other first step to a negotiation process? How do we know it was the first step? I frankly don't see any reason to think that Myers is anything other than Anaheim's bottom line for Getzlaf. They need defensemen, Getzlaf is an elite player, and there is NFW they are going to take the Sabres' overpaid mediocrities in exchange for him.
OverPowerYou Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 The only way we would trade for getzlaf would probably be like a 3 way trade where we give up a lot to the 3rd team, and they would have to give a superstar or a top tier player to anaheim and we would obtain getzlaf.. I could see that team either being Montreal (desperate team looking for trades) or Calgary. It would probably cost us vanek but we need a change of pace, and a center. Wow. I sound like Eklund More to come (I really hate him and that website)
LabattBlue Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 No Way! It takes a D man four to five yrs to reach thier potential. Myers will be the cornerstone of our franchise in yrs to come. So a guy who has arguably regressed since his rookie year is all of a sudden going to reach his potential in the next year or two? I'll be waiting. There are way too many people who believe that Myers is going to be an all-star and perennial Norris Trophy candidate for the next 10 years? Based on what? Maybe he will, but if I had to place odds on it, I think it is greater than 50% chance that Myers is nothing more than a 2nd pair defenseman with some good offensive skills.
SportsFan88 Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 The only way we would trade for getzlaf would probably be like a 3 way trade where we give up a lot to the 3rd team, and they would have to give a superstar or a top tier player to anaheim and we would obtain getzlaf.. I could see that team either being Montreal (desperate team looking for trades) or Calgary. It would probably cost us vanek but we need a change of pace, and a center. Wow. I sound like Eklund More to come (I really hate him and that website) Lol. That was good. I'm just ready to blow this all up. Start over from scratch. That includes Vanek. I've never found him to be a really good team player. A guy like him should be the Captain, a leader on and off the ice for what he is making. I know the contract had to be matched at the time due to recent events but Vanek just disappoints me. He has talent something just seems to be missing IMO. Aside from Miller when it comes to the guys infront of him Vanek is the face of the franchise maybe by default but he smells like an underachiever for having such a tag thrown his way as a franchise type of player.
Who Else? Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 So a guy who has arguably regressed since his rookie year is all of a sudden going to reach his potential in the next year or two? I'll be waiting. There are way too many people who believe that Myers is going to be an all-star and perennial Norris Trophy candidate for the next 10 years? Based on what? Maybe he will, but if I had to place odds on it, I think it is greater than 50% chance that Myers is nothing more than a 2nd pair defenseman with some good offensive skills. Myers needs a defenseman to play with game in and game out that meshes with his all over the ice style. You find a player like that, Myers is a Norris candidate. Probably to late to have him back, but I must mention Tallinder. Look at how many different pairing Myers has been in since. Hell just look over the last three games.
MattPie Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Myers needs a defenseman to play with game in and game out that meshes with his all over the ice style. You find a player like that, Myers is a Norris candidate. Probably to late to have him back, but I must mention Tallinder. Look at how many different pairing Myers has been in since. Hell just look over at the last three games. Fixed that for you. It's unfortunate, he looked pretty good with McNabb who is now down with an injury. I don't think you trade any vital piece for Getzlaf on the *hope* that you sign him next year to an extension. Too big a risk. And, if the people reporting that the Anaheim fans are saying the same things Sabres' fans are saying about Roy, that's a huge red flag. I know others have been saying this, but it bears repeating until someone does the leg work (watching games) explains their wrong. Take a look at the all-star roster for centers, how many of the 11 can you really say Getzlaf is better than? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/59th_National_Hockey_League_All-Star_Game#Rosters I don't know the answers to these questions, I just know that it's easy to be fooled if you only catch the game highlights and whatnot. Unless someone steps up and says they've gone thru a lot of the LA games this year on Gamecenter I'm pretty wary.
shrader Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 How do we know it was the first step? I frankly don't see any reason to think that Myers is anything other than Anaheim's bottom line for Getzlaf. They need defensemen, Getzlaf is an elite player, and there is NFW they are going to take the Sabres' overpaid mediocrities in exchange for him. Saying something to Hamilton has absolutely nothing with an actual negotiation process. If you're leaking something to the media, you're absolutely going to start with the highest asking price though. You leak out your "aim high" price just as you would if you were actually proposing an offer. If these two teams would decide to make a deal, it wouldn't go down exactly as Myers-Getzlaf. There'd be further negotations and additional picks/players would be added in or removed from a final deal.
nfreeman Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Saying something to Hamilton has absolutely nothing with an actual negotiation process. If you're leaking something to the media, you're absolutely going to start with the highest asking price though. You leak out your "aim high" price just as you would if you were actually proposing an offer. If these two teams would decide to make a deal, it wouldn't go down exactly as Myers-Getzlaf. There'd be further negotations and additional picks/players would be added in or removed from a final deal. Again, there is no reason to think that this is the initial "aim high" move by Anaheim -- and given the time that's elapsed since Anaheim announced that everyone is for sale, it's probably not their initial move. If you're Anaheim, you're well into the negotiation process, you're not interested in anything except Myers, the Sabres aren't budging and you think the Sabres may be getting desperate, why not tell Hamilton that Getzlaf can be had for Myers? This will create some pressure from the public to make the deal. It can't hurt and it might get you what you want. I agree that it likely wouldn't be a straight-up Myers-for-Getzlaf deal, but getting the Sabres to agree to include Myers is by far the biggest hurdle.
shrader Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Again, there is no reason to think that this is the initial "aim high" move by Anaheim -- and given the time that's elapsed since Anaheim announced that everyone is for sale, it's probably not their initial move. If you're Anaheim, you're well into the negotiation process, you're not interested in anything except Myers, the Sabres aren't budging and you think the Sabres may be getting desperate, why not tell Hamilton that Getzlaf can be had for Myers? This will create some pressure from the public to make the deal. It can't hurt and it might get you what you want. I agree that it likely wouldn't be a straight-up Myers-for-Getzlaf deal, but getting the Sabres to agree to include Myers is by far the biggest hurdle. And quite simply put, it's a deal that is impossible for Buffalo to make. The Sabres cannot take on a dime in salary. Myers' cap hit is $1.3 million and Getzlaf's is at $5.325. If they want to move Getzlaf, they are going to have to take on some money. The same will go no matter who they were to trade him to, unless some low level cap team has the right pieces and decides to make a run.
apuszczalowski Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Lol. That was good. I'm just ready to blow this all up. Start over from scratch. That includes Vanek. I've never found him to be a really good team player. A guy like him should be the Captain, a leader on and off the ice for what he is making. I know the contract had to be matched at the time due to recent events but Vanek just disappoints me. He has talent something just seems to be missing IMO. Aside from Miller when it comes to the guys infront of him Vanek is the face of the franchise maybe by default but he smells like an underachiever for having such a tag thrown his way as a franchise type of player. I have always found him to be a good to great player, but not one of the better forwards in the league, basically, not a top tier/superstar kind of player. hes the type of guy who should be your 2nd or 3rd best forward on your team, not the top guy, and I don't see him as the type of guy who is a leader. He seems more like the kind of guy who just wants to go about his business and sit under the radar. Problem with this team is that it seems to be built of secondary/complementary players, with no one to take the lead/complement
sabres1970 Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 And quite simply put, it's a deal that is impossible for Buffalo to make. The Sabres cannot take on a dime in salary. Myers' cap hit is $1.3 million and Getzlaf's is at $5.325. If they want to move Getzlaf, they are going to have to take on some money. The same will go no matter who they were to trade him to, unless some low level cap team has the right pieces and decides to make a run. Right. I don't think it will be possible to get a deal done during the season if we can't dump guys like Roy, Leopold, Stafford or Boyes who are worth 3$ million +. Unless Darcy is okay with trading these guys with virtually nothing in return then they're stuck there for the rest of the year.
LabattBlue Posted January 17, 2012 Report Posted January 17, 2012 Myers needs a defenseman to play with game in and game out that meshes with his all over the ice style. You find a player like that, Myers is a Norris candidate. Probably to late to have him back, but I must mention Tallinder. Look at how many different pairing Myers has been in since. Hell just look over the last three games. Sorry...what I have seen in Myers over the last couple of years has nothing to do with who his partner is. Great defensemen are just that, no matter what team they are on, or who their partner is. Their is no way I believe that Myers ability to become a Norris candidate is going to rely on who his partner is. How many blueline partners has Lidstrom had over the last 20 years? Was he only good in the years when he was paired up with the perfect running mate? Myers is nothing more than potential at this point... which may or may not turn out to be all-star Norris Trophy potential.
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