Paul Hamilton: Two GMs tell him Darcy overvalues his players by quite a bit

[TheChimp]

Hamilton has been using that bit for a long time now. Interesting that he's come out and said that he got that tidbit from other GM's. Until now I assumed it was his own observation.

That's probably why he said it. See, it worked!! ;)

[qwksndmonster]

Oh screw this, just check our Briere vs Roy for the 07-08, 08-09, 09-10 and 10-11 seasons.

 

Infact damn, the more I look into it Roy is quick a bit better than Briere.

No. No he is not. I would take Briere over Roy every single time.

 

I'll agree with this, taking contracts into account. Roy is the far greater value.

I disagree. In fact, I think Roy brings the team's play down as a whole.

 

The Sabres have spent far more time out of the playoffs than in, plus we've never gone deep while Roy's been in the lineup. The Flyers have had a far more successful few seasons. Roy has had playoff success at the lower leagues, didn't he lead Kitchener to the Cup? I'm not pretending hs better, just that his as good.

 

Infact you want to know why you probably think his so much better? Because he 95 points in 1 season, his final season here, a contact year. His never come close since.

1st bold point: Yes we have. Roy scored 15 points (5 G) in 18 games in 2006, and 7 points (2 G) in 16 games in 2007. After that he scored 2 points (2 A) in 6 games in 2010. He hasn't showed up in the playoffs since 2006.

 

2nd bold point: Please don't spew this nonsense. Uncalled for and disrespectful to another poster.

[RazielSabre]

Right so at $4mill a year you'd rather have a 60 point player who's done well on what is an extremely talented Philly lineup than a 75 point player who's put those points up despite being on a chronically underperforming team? Just sayin'.

 

No. No he is not. I would take Briere over Roy every single time.

 

 

I disagree. In fact, I think Roy brings the team's play down as a whole.

 

 

1st bold point: Yes we have. Roy scored 15 points (5 G) in 18 games in 2006, and 7 points (2 G) in 16 games in 2007. After that he scored 2 points (2 A) in 6 games in 2010. He hasn't showed up in the playoffs since 2006.

 

2nd bold point: Please don't spew this nonsense. Uncalled for and disrespectful to another poster.

 

1st bold: 1 playoff performance does not a career make :P.

2nd bold: I'm no big fan of Roy, but this boards love for Briere is confusing so I tried to break it down to make sense of it. Remember when he first went to Philly and they were greatly disappointed with his play?

 

Umm, no. This is why I think he's better.

 

Briere: 42 goals in 97 playoff games

Roy: 7 goals in 41 playoff games

 

Don't pretend to think for me. I do quite well on my own.

 

 

I'll offer an olive branch here. I don't know why you seem to want to get snarky and condescending with me. I don't recall starting a conversation with you that way. But I could be mis-remembering. I'm willing to discontinue the condescension. But I'm equally willing to escalate if you feel the need. Just sayin'...

 

Refer above. I'm not trying to start a flame war, I'm asking you all to look at the stats, look at the last few seasons from an outsiders perspective and just think how similar in talent and performance those two are. The reason it seems to be condescending is because I'm pushing it, sorry about that but I really don't see the difference. Before you come back with those playoff stats again compare the clubs a little, everyone disappeared these last two seasons. Hell we were lucky to be in the playoffs at all last season, let alone the year before.

 

Could it be part of the reason for his bad numbers are Stafford being stuck with him, Stafford is inconsistant at the best of times? Genuine thought, just considering it

[Weave]

Right so at $4mill a year you'd rather have a 60 point player who's done well on what is an extremely talented Philly lineup than a 75 point player who's put those points up despite being on a chronically underperforming team? Just sayin'.

 

 

 

1st bold: 1 playoff performance does not a career make :P.

2nd bold: I'm no big fan of Roy, but this boards love for Briere is confusing so I tried to break it down to make sense of it. Remember when he first went to Philly and they were greatly disappointed with his play?

 

 

 

Refer above. I'm not trying to start a flame war, I'm asking you all to look at the stats, look at the last few seasons from an outsiders perspective and just think how similar in talent and performance those two are. The reason it seems to be condescending is because I'm pushing it, sorry about that but I really don't see the difference. Before you come back with those playoff stats again compare the clubs a little, everyone disappeared these last two seasons. Hell we were lucky to be in the playoffs at all last season, let alone the year before.

 

Could it be part of the reason for his bad numbers are Stafford being stuck with him, Stafford is inconsistant at the best of times? Genuine thought, just considering it

 

It is your tone, not your point that is condescending but I'm willing to let it drop at this point.

 

As for the rest, players make their money on the biggest stage. So they are similar in the regular season. And Roy is less expensive. I get that. I agree with that portion of your point. But once the playoffs start Briere has shown time and again that he rises to the occassion. You say it is because of the team he is on. I say he is one of the guys that MAKES those teams beast. Roy has had his chances to become the clutch big stage player that we needed and he has never risen to the occassion. Not for one single playoff game after Drury/Briere left. Not one. And neither has Stafford. I see them as products of the same mold. Going back in time they are this generations' Pierre Turgeon, talented folk that are missing *whatever* it is that become big stage successes.

 

You are correct that Philly fans were disappointed in Briere's performance. Until he got into the playoffs. The fans love him now. They know what he is about. He's a gamer that elevates what he's got when he gets on the biggest stage. And I'll gladly support any GM that's willing to pay more for that.

 

I'll change my mind about Briere vs Roy when Roy shows me he can rise to the occassion when it matters. Until then, I miss Danny here.

[qwksndmonster]

Right so at $4mill a year you'd rather have a 60 point player who's done well on what is an extremely talented Philly lineup than a 75 point player who's put those points up despite being on a chronically underperforming team? Just sayin'.

 

1st bold: 1 playoff performance does not a career make :P.

2nd bold: I'm no big fan of Roy, but this boards love for Briere is confusing so I tried to break it down to make sense of it. Remember when he first went to Philly and they were greatly disappointed with his play?

 

Refer above. I'm not trying to start a flame war, I'm asking you all to look at the stats, look at the last few seasons from an outsiders perspective and just think how similar in talent and performance those two are. The reason it seems to be condescending is because I'm pushing it, sorry about that but I really don't see the difference. Before you come back with those playoff stats again compare the clubs a little, everyone disappeared these last two seasons. Hell we were lucky to be in the playoffs at all last season, let alone the year before.

 

Could it be part of the reason for his bad numbers are Stafford being stuck with him, Stafford is inconsistant at the best of times? Genuine thought, just considering it

The best thing Roy will EVER do is be the best performer on an under-performing team. It's no coincidence that the team doesn't play well when Roy is in the line up.

 

1st bold: He didn't do anything in 2007 or 2010... How is that one playoff appearance?

2nd bold: Weave took care of that one.

[Taro T]

And I'll bet you dollars to donuts that one of the G.M.'s is that windbag Brian Burke. One thing I'm fairly certain of is that any G.M. worth his salt is surrounded by competent people who aren't afraid to argue vehemently for or against what they believe it takes to get the right player or mix of players. Hopefully Darcy hasn't surrounded himself with yes men. All I know is losing 8 out of the last 11 regardless of injuries is sick. Something has to happen soon.And hopefully not on Darcys glacial timeframe.

I know for a fact that Don Waddell would often cry about how Darcy overvalued Sabres' properties. As he is no longer an NHL GM, I don't know if he is one that PH is referring to. Burke could be another, as he has grabbed 2 Sabres castoffs when they became available. Neither of which griping about Darcy really bothers me.

 

What bothers me, is that the Sabres desperately need to have a true #1 center and ideally should have a legit power forward on the top 2 lines and if WE all know that, then so does DR. I was really hoping to see at least 1 move made by mid-December. As I don't expect this team to win it all this year, and I am impressed with what they do have coming up in the next couple of years, I don't want them to mortgage the future for those guys; but I am fine with mortgaging the present for them.

 

I am hoping that the lack of moves is due to all the injuries (no one will make a trade for a player that can't play) but don't expect that's the reason a trade hasn't happened.

[deluca67]

I know for a fact that Don Waddell would often cry about how Darcy overvalued Sabres' properties. As he is no longer an NHL GM, I don't know if he is one that PH is referring to. Burke could be another, as he has grabbed 2 Sabres castoffs when they became available. Neither of which griping about Darcy really bothers me.

 

What bothers me, is that the Sabres desperately need to have a true #1 center and ideally should have a legit power forward on the top 2 lines and if WE all know that, then so does DR. I was really hoping to see at least 1 move made by mid-December. As I don't expect this team to win it all this year, and I am impressed with what they do have coming up in the next couple of years, I don't want them to mortgage the future for those guys; but I am fine with mortgaging the present for them.

 

I am hoping that the lack of moves is due to all the injuries (no one will make a trade for a player that can't play) but don't expect that's the reason a trade hasn't happened.

We all know Regier's thoughts on mid-season trades. We also know how much Regier loves his "core." I have no doubt that Regier considers Roy the #1 center and that Stafford is the top six power forward. I believe that 100%.

 

I think that not only will Regier use injuries as the excuse, I think he believes it.

[Kristian]

We all know Regier's thoughts on mid-season trades. We also know how much Regier loves his "core." I have no doubt that Regier considers Roy the #1 center and that Stafford is the top six power forward. I believe that 100%.

 

I think that not only will Regier use injuries as the excuse, I think he believes it.

 

Can't disagree with any of that, though I just want to add that I feel convinced Darcy thinks Ruff's approach to coaching is the right one for the team that he put together.

[deluca67]

Can't disagree with any of that, though I just want to add that I feel convinced Darcy thinks Ruff's approach to coaching is the right one for the team that he put together.

Which is why they both need to be removed. They don't realize that there is a huge problem, and never will. It is up to Pegula and Black to see it as the eyes from the outside. Sadly, they seem to buy what Regier and Ruff are selling, which is really depressing for a long time Sabre fan.

[TheChimp]

Which is why they both need to be removed. They don't realize that there is a huge problem, and never will. It is up to Pegula and Black to see it as the eyes from the outside. Sadly, they seem to buy what Regier and Ruff are selling, which is really depressing for a long time Sabre fan.

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