Stafford needs to go

[darksabre]

So let me get this straight........it IS possible for a few strong, entrenched voices to dominate philosophy and message to a point that it becomes so stale, that 90% of the others tune it out and no longer have the drive or will to perform here on a regular basis?

 

AAAAAANNNNND...............on top of it you highly support the owner of the structure to shake things up by chasing these few entrenched individuals away for the good of the entire group?

 

I'm gonna just step back and let that sink in for a minute...................

 

And Chz......feel free to move this post to the Lindy Ruff thread..........

 

:thumbsup:

[Robviously]

Does Stafford have to go if he scores six goals in the next five games?

Definitely. For once, we might be able to trade a guy when his stock is high. Unfortunately, if he ever scores six goals in five games again (probably in his next contract year), Darcy will take it as a sign that he's "untouchable" in trade talks.

 

 

 

Do players on other teams in Stafford cap hit range, who are also underachieving, have to go too?

I don't really care what the other teams do. I just want the Sabres to lose their lazy underachievers. We're never going to get anywhere waiting for Stafford to lead us there.

[LabattBlue]

So let me get this straight........it IS possible for a few strong, entrenched voices to dominate philosophy and message to a point that it becomes so stale, that 90% of the others tune it out and no longer have the drive or will to perform here on a regular basis?

 

AAAAAANNNNND...............on top of it you highly support the owner of the structure to shake things up by chasing these few entrenched individuals away for the good of the entire group?

 

I'm gonna just step back and let that sink in for a minute...................

 

And Chz......feel free to move this post to the Lindy Ruff thread..........

 

Well said.

[Weave]

So let me get this straight........it IS possible for a few strong, entrenched voices to dominate philosophy and message to a point that it becomes so stale, that 90% of the others tune it out and no longer have the drive or will to perform here on a regular basis?

 

AAAAAANNNNND...............on top of it you highly support the owner of the structure to shake things up by chasing these few entrenched individuals away for the good of the entire group?

 

I'm gonna just step back and let that sink in for a minute...................

 

And Chz......feel free to move this post to the Lindy Ruff thread..........

 

I'm betting someone doesn't get it.

[Claude_Verret]

So let me get this straight........it IS possible for a few strong, entrenched voices to dominate philosophy and message to a point that it becomes so stale, that 90% of the others tune it out and no longer have the drive or will to perform here on a regular basis? AAAAAANNNNND...............on top of it you highly support the owner of the structure to shake things up by chasing these few entrenched individuals away for the good of the entire group? I'm gonna just step back and let that sink in for a minute................... And Chz......feel free to move this post to the Lindy Ruff thread..........

 

Clever analogy and I get what you're saying. I don't think there is a poster on this board who doesn't believe a significant shake up is well past due for this team. However, based on public comments from Pegula and Black as well as some knowledge I had passed on to me from a family member who had the opportunity to candidly speak one on one for a few hours with Darcy back in September, I just don't believe that shake up will come in the form of changes at the top of the organization this year. I believe it will take them missing out on the playoffs for Pegs to re-think his "ain't going nowhere" line

[RazielSabre]

So let me get this straight........it IS possible for a few strong, entrenched voices to dominate philosophy and message to a point that it becomes so stale, that 90% of the others tune it out and no longer have the drive or will to perform here on a regular basis?

 

AAAAAANNNNND...............on top of it you highly support the owner of the structure to shake things up by chasing these few entrenched individuals away for the good of the entire group?

 

I'm gonna just step back and let that sink in for a minute...................

 

And Chz......feel free to move this post to the Lindy Ruff thread..........

 

No, I don't support anyone being 'chased away'. I support a valid point being made, i highly disagree with someone who told him to shut up and go back to his corner.

 

I'm not really sure why you think I'm a big supporter of Staff, Roy and the others being called into question because I'm not. I agree Stafford should go when we are healthier, Roy should be given until the end of the season to turn his game around, Miller is still our no.1 in my eyes. Ruff is the biggest point of disagreement, I believe he should stay and that he is better than most coaches out there, Regier needs an assistant/replacement. Anyone I've missed?

Edited December 20, 2011 by LimeySabre

[Samson's Flow]

First time back to the board in a few days and this bad boy of a thread has blown the f*** up. Gotta say I kind of saw that comin'

 

I have long stated on this board that I do not want to watch any player that doesn't play with an edge, willing to play for his teammates and give an honest effort every night. I believe you know where I stand on the Stafford/Roy debate.

[wonderbread]

I'm betting someone doesn't get it.

 

Get what?

[...]

By your logic, the only way to affect change on this team is by trading the entire roster, firing all of the Sabres staff, and moving the team to a completely different city. Is that delimited enough for you? Or would you like to act even more ridiculous today?

 

So, this thread has advanced based on this straw man post. That others agree with this hyperbole is almost as shocking as the irony of d4rk calling Deluca "ridiculous".

 

And then comes some personal attacks because one group feels its point of view is superior to another group's and is therefore justified in their mockery. This passes as discourse in our society today, sadly.

 

I guess I'm a full-fledged member of Team Stormcloud because I DO NOT believe that a few player changes will take this club up to next level - a level where they are sincerely competitive and in a position to at least challenge for the Cup. Right now, as far as I see it, they are barely in a position to make the playoffs.

 

I'm on record here saying that I don't necessarily believe Ruff is the entire problem, and that he is not tops on my list of changes to be made, but that if he were a casualty in a shake-up I would not mind that. I believe that Darcy needs to go FIRST, and then some players, and then whatever else the new GM decides is in the best interest of a club - a club whose stated objectives is to "win a Stanley Cup, and then go win another Stanley Cup."

 

It appears that most people agree this team needs some sort of change. I would call that "common ground" among the various groups, or camps. Okay, going forward from that point, there are, obviously, various ways the Sabres can "change". That is where we all seem to differ.

 

I do not see, and I would be interested to see evidence of the contrary if someone can find it, anyone advocating "firing the entire staff" and "trading the entire roster" (should I bother with the "move the team" nonsense?). I do see people suggesting trading SOME players, people suggesting Ruff being fired, or some of the assistant coaches being fired, and that most people seem to agree Darcy should go. Are these not all valid paths to change for a professional sports team? Who here is so super-smart that they know WHICH of these strategies to enact, and in what order?

 

Sorry, but NONE OF US are that good. So, NONE OF US should be attacking another because we're thinking about "our" team. d4rk's ideas are no more valid than deluca's - and spndnchz's fandom is no better than dwight's.

 

Trolls are very obvious - most of us know one when we see one, eventually. Shame on you calling others "whiners" and "complainers" those who stick around here season after season, whose ideas differ from yours, but whose passion for the team is clearly as hot as yours. Perhaps you don't understand the point-of-view, but then be big about it and admit it, rather than pedestrian and mock it. There's no shame in not being able to relate to what someone is saying, so long as the point in question is lucid and part of the conversation (or, in other words, not trolling or just out-and-out misinformed and foolish). That is where interesting conversations BEGIN - right now some of you are shooting down the interesting conversations before they begin.

Edited December 20, 2011 by sizzlemeister

[darksabre]

So, this thread has advanced based on this straw man post. That others agree with this hyperbole is almost as shocking as the irony of d4rk calling Deluca "ridiculous".

 

And then comes some personal attacks because one group feels its point of view is superior to another group's and is therefore justified in their mockery. This passes as discourse in our society today, sadly.

 

I guess I'm a full-fledged member of Team Stormcloud because I DO NOT believe that a few player changes will take this club up to next level - a level where they are sincerely competitive and in a position to at least challenge for the Cup. Right now, as far as I see it, they are barely in a position to make the playoffs.

 

I'm on record here saying that I don't necessarily believe Ruff is the entire problem, and that he is not tops on my list of changes to be made, but that if he were a casualty in a shake-up I would not mind that. I believe that Darcy needs to go FIRST, and then some players, and then whatever else the new GM decides is in the best interest of a club - a club whose stated objectives is to "win a Stanley Cup, and then go win another Stanley Cup."

 

It appears that most people agree this team needs some sort of change. I would call that "common ground" among the various groups, or camps. Okay, going forward from that point, there are, obviously, various ways the Sabres can "change". That is where we all seem to differ.

 

I do not see, and I would be interested to see evidence of the contrary if someone can find it, anyone advocating "firing the entire staff" and "trading the entire roster" (should I bother with the "move the team" nonsense?). I do see people suggesting trading SOME players, people suggesting Ruff being fired, or some of the assistant coaches being fired, and that most people seem to agree Darcy should go. Are these not all valid paths to change for a professional sports team? Who here is so super-smart that they know WHICH of these strategies to enact, and in what order?

 

Sorry, but NONE OF US are that good. So, NONE OF US should be attacking another because we're thinking about "our" team. d4rk's ideas are no more valid than deluca's - and spndnchz's fandom is no better than dwight's.

 

Trolls are very obvious - most of us know one when we see one, eventually. Shame on you calling others "whiners" and "complainers" those who stick around here season after season, whose ideas differ from yours, but whose passion for the team is clearly as hot as yours. Perhaps you don't understand the point-of-view, but then be big about it and admit it, rather than pedestrian and mock it. There's no shame in not being able to relate to what someone is saying, so long as the point in question is lucid and part of the conversation (or, in other words, not trolling or just out-and-out misinformed and foolish). That is where interesting conversations BEGIN - right now some of you are shooting down the interesting conversations before they begin.

 

I think that unfortunately you misinterpreted my post. I intended it as an extreme counter to DeLuca's extreme argument that my desire to make changes in a reasonable manner is apathetic. He insisted that the only way to not be apathetic about this team is by expressing a desire for unlimited change. That if I limit the extent to which I think changes to be made that it makes me a fan that does not want the team to win a Stanley Cup.

 

Nothing in life operates outside of boundaries. The changes that can be made to this team are limited by a multitude of factors, and because of these factors I choose to limit what I believe should be done to a realm of reason.

 

Do I believe that a number of players should be moved? Yes. Do I believe that there should be changes at the coaching and GM positions? Yes. But I want them to be done in a manner that leaves this team capable of operating for the next hundred years.

 

But apparently DeLuca believes that being level headed makes me someone that doesn't care. That is the issue here that I take monumental offense to.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

I'm betting someone doesn't get it.

 

You win, that's why there's alcohol.

[nfreeman]

So, this thread has advanced based on this straw man post. That others agree with this hyperbole is almost as shocking as the irony of d4rk calling Deluca "ridiculous".

 

And then comes some personal attacks because one group feels its point of view is superior to another group's and is therefore justified in their mockery. This passes as discourse in our society today, sadly.

 

I guess I'm a full-fledged member of Team Stormcloud because I DO NOT believe that a few player changes will take this club up to next level - a level where they are sincerely competitive and in a position to at least challenge for the Cup. Right now, as far as I see it, they are barely in a position to make the playoffs.

 

I'm on record here saying that I don't necessarily believe Ruff is the entire problem, and that he is not tops on my list of changes to be made, but that if he were a casualty in a shake-up I would not mind that. I believe that Darcy needs to go FIRST, and then some players, and then whatever else the new GM decides is in the best interest of a club - a club whose stated objectives is to "win a Stanley Cup, and then go win another Stanley Cup."

 

It appears that most people agree this team needs some sort of change. I would call that "common ground" among the various groups, or camps. Okay, going forward from that point, there are, obviously, various ways the Sabres can "change". That is where we all seem to differ.

 

I do not see, and I would be interested to see evidence of the contrary if someone can find it, anyone advocating "firing the entire staff" and "trading the entire roster" (should I bother with the "move the team" nonsense?). I do see people suggesting trading SOME players, people suggesting Ruff being fired, or some of the assistant coaches being fired, and that most people seem to agree Darcy should go. Are these not all valid paths to change for a professional sports team? Who here is so super-smart that they know WHICH of these strategies to enact, and in what order?

 

Sorry, but NONE OF US are that good. So, NONE OF US should be attacking another because we're thinking about "our" team. d4rk's ideas are no more valid than deluca's - and spndnchz's fandom is no better than dwight's.

 

Trolls are very obvious - most of us know one when we see one, eventually. Shame on you calling others "whiners" and "complainers" those who stick around here season after season, whose ideas differ from yours, but whose passion for the team is clearly as hot as yours. Perhaps you don't understand the point-of-view, but then be big about it and admit it, rather than pedestrian and mock it. There's no shame in not being able to relate to what someone is saying, so long as the point in question is lucid and part of the conversation (or, in other words, not trolling or just out-and-out misinformed and foolish). That is where interesting conversations BEGIN - right now some of you are shooting down the interesting conversations before they begin.

 

Stafford for Malkin. Done.

[Samson's Flow]

Stafford for Malkin. Done.

but do we the get the 2nd round pick or do they? :unsure:

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

I think that unfortunately you misinterpreted my post. I intended it as an extreme counter to DeLuca's extreme argument that my desire to make changes in a reasonable manner is apathetic. He insisted that the only way to not be apathetic about this team is by expressing a desire for unlimited change. That if I limit the extent to which I think changes to be made that it makes me a fan that does not want the team to win a Stanley Cup.

 

Nothing in life operates outside of boundaries. The changes that can be made to this team are limited by a multitude of factors, and because of these factors I choose to limit what I believe should be done to a realm of reason.

 

Do I believe that a number of players should be moved? Yes. Do I believe that there should be changes at the coaching and GM positions? Yes. But I want them to be done in a manner that leaves this team capable of operating for the next hundred years.

 

But apparently DeLuca believes that being level headed makes me someone that doesn't care. That is the issue here that I take monumental offense to.

 

I think where the problem in communication lies, is that some of us have felt that changes needed to be made for 5 years. Yet year after year the exact same structure has been in place. When the team was sold, I was willing to give Ruff a year or two...IF...Darcy was canned. The entire organization is reflective of groupthink from top down and needed to be chopped up. Darcy was allowed to stay on with a blank check and players changed. Yes there are injuries, but that doesn't explain off the same style of play where we rarely see 40 minutes of full effort let alone 60, a passive defense in their own zone, lack of cohesive puck control, and cycling in the offensive zone, the same excuses after every lackluster result, and a full out failure to stick up for one another until the team was a national laughingstock.

 

Darcy was already given his chance and 40% of the ballot box has been counted. At a minnimum, he should be gone, allowing the new GM to evaluate further moves. Maybe a shrewd GM can make 2 or 3 big moves and Ruff will be able to let those new leaders come in and dictate the feel of the room......but I also doubt that is in Ruff's nature. That leaves many of us wishing for a 1-2 punch of GM and coach to be gone....and if need be, many of the core. It is beyond obvious the 3 Muskatter system doesn't work, yet Ted Black and Pegula, who I gave FULL support to knowing there is a learning curve involved, are further entrenching Regier and Ruff, and now throwing players under the bus. For as much as I see flaws in a lot of the players, I am on their side on this. It has gone on for too long.

 

I am shocked at the lack of realisation of what Pegula did to Miller, and his failing to understand how that could effect a mental tinderbox like he is. Snarkily saying that was good goaltending and that his teenage daughter can make those saves......Jeez....for an employee friendly owner, he sure strung that kid up. We as fans can critique and bitch, but when you are the owner of a flailing team with possibly your most important player off his game....and you belittle him like that........you are just throwing gasoline on the self made fire you created by empowering Regier and Ruff.

 

How was there no thread dedicated to Pegula undressing Miller? Some of you guys ran PA out of here for his constant questioning of Miller, yet in Miller's time of need, much like his team in Boston did...his fanbase is now doing the same by hanging him out to dry. He had a crappy game, but he wasn't backpeddling at the blueline on every entry, or being outhit 18-5 with 0 goals at the time. That is a team philosophy at best, or lack of effort at worst, yet Sabres controlled WGR is setting the tone the past few weeks trumpeting the injury excuse, bad goaltending, and all of a sudden the same core that some folks have been clammoring to change for 5 years is now the obvious problem.

 

As a poster, I have leveled my sterness at the team and individuals involved. I never aim at a poster with a differing idea, that is until the level of person attack or ganging up on a differing point of view gets to an absurd level. Some of the best posters here disagree with my point of view 70-90% of the time, but they are good because we can learn from each other and open each other's eyes to things we may individually miss.

 

Yes....the excuse de jour is injuries. But on one hand please don't tell me how big of a stud Adam, Kassian or McNabb is, then cry because we are missing a few bottom 6 forwards. Who would you rather trade right now for a #1 center? Adam, Kassian and McNabb, or Hecht, Boyes and Kaleta? Or hell, even Myers, Lieno and Gerbe? Paul Szczechura comes up and is flying all over the place, setting up 3 goals, including 2 game winners in his first 3 games.....all without a Lindy Ruff practice. Now it seems as if he is "Learning the System".

 

If someone wants to call out a person for going "Lindy Sucks"..."Darcy Sucks", without any valid points....fine. That is clutter. But because you may get frustrated that some people have counterpoints to the 5 years of constant excuses, and can make them well.....don't give up. We are ALL frustrated. I don't even have it in my heart to joke around here because the thermostat is redlining to a point where it isn't fun or advisable.

 

I was as excited as anyone here when Pegula surfaced. I figured if he ran the team like a new owner would in any other dysfunctional business that they just took over, we were in great shape. Now I am as confused about him as ever. One thing for sure...... he shows plenty of patience when surrounded by a bunch of gas.

[darksabre]

I think where the problem in communication lies, is that some of us have felt that changes needed to be made for 5 years. Yet year after year the exact same structure has been in place. When the team was sold, I was willing to give Ruff a year or two...IF...Darcy was canned. The entire organization is reflective of groupthink from top down and needed to be chopped up. Darcy was allowed to stay on with a blank check and players changed. Yes there are injuries, but that doesn't explain off the same style of play where we rarely see 40 minutes of full effort let alone 60, a passive defense in their own zone, lack of cohesive puck control, and cycling in the offensive zone, the same excuses after every lackluster result, and a full out failure to stick up for one another until the team was a national laughingstock.

 

Darcy was already given his chance and 40% of the ballot box has been counted. At a minnimum, he should be gone, allowing the new GM to evaluate further moves. Maybe a shrewd GM can make 2 or 3 big moves and Ruff will be able to let those new leaders come in and dictate the feel of the room......but I also doubt that is in Ruff's nature. That leaves many of us wishing for a 1-2 punch of GM and coach to be gone....and if need be, many of the core. It is beyond obvious the 3 Muskatter system doesn't work, yet Ted Black and Pegula, who I gave FULL support to knowing there is a learning curve involved, are further entrenching Regier and Ruff, and now throwing players under the bus. For as much as I see flaws in a lot of the players, I am on their side on this. It has gone on for too long.

 

I am shocked at the lack of realisation of what Pegula did to Miller, and his failing to understand how that could effect a mental tinderbox like he is. Snarkily saying that was good goaltending and that his teenage daughter can make those saves......Jeez....for an employee friendly owner, he sure strung that kid up. We as fans can critique and bitch, but when you are the owner of a flailing team with possibly your most important player off his game....and you belittle him like that........you are just throwing gasoline on the self made fire you created by empowering Regier and Ruff.

 

How was there no thread dedicated to Pegula undressing Miller? Some of you guys ran PA out of here for his constant questioning of Miller, yet in Miller's time of need, much like his team in Boston did...his fanbase is now doing the same by hanging him out to dry. He had a crappy game, but he wasn't backpeddling at the blueline on every entry, or being outhit 18-5 with 0 goals at the time. That is a team philosophy at best, or lack of effort at worst, yet Sabres controlled WGR is setting the tone the past few weeks trumpeting the injury excuse, bad goaltending, and all of a sudden the same core that some folks have been clammoring to change for 5 years is now the obvious problem.

 

As a poster, I have leveled my sterness at the team and individuals involved. I never aim at a poster with a differing idea, that is until the level of person attack or ganging up on a differing point of view gets to an absurd level. Some of the best posters here disagree with my point of view 70-90% of the time, but they are good because we can learn from each other and open each other's eyes to things we may individually miss.

 

Yes....the excuse de jour is injuries. But on one hand please don't tell me how big of a stud Adam, Kassian or McNabb is, then cry because we are missing a few bottom 6 forwards. Who would you rather trade right now for a #1 center? Adam, Kassian and McNabb, or Hecht, Boyes and Kaleta? Or hell, even Myers, Lieno and Gerbe? Paul Szczechura comes up and is flying all over the place, setting up 3 goals, including 2 game winners in his first 3 games.....all without a Lindy Ruff practice. Now it seems as if he is "Learning the System".

 

If someone wants to call out a person for going "Lindy Sucks"..."Darcy Sucks", without any valid points....fine. That is clutter. But because you may get frustrated that some people have counterpoints to the 5 years of constant excuses, and can make them well.....don't give up. We are ALL frustrated. I don't even have it in my heart to joke around here because the thermostat is redlining to a point where it isn't fun or advisable.

 

I was as excited as anyone here when Pegula surfaced. I figured if he ran the team like a new owner would in any other dysfunctional business that they just took over, we were in great shape. Now I am as confused about him as ever. One thing for sure...... he shows plenty of patience when surrounded by a bunch of gas.

 

Great post. I can't disagree with your points. Many of the disagreement on this forum is based on how long people have been following the team, how long they've had issues with it, and what kinds of things they want to see. I have no problem with people feeling frustrated. I simply resent being told that my timeline in which changes should be made somehow makes me part of this teams problems.

[K-9]

...Trolls are very obvious - most of us know one when we see one, eventually. Shame on you calling others "whiners" and "complainers" those who stick around here season after season, whose ideas differ from yours, but whose passion for the team is clearly as hot as yours. Perhaps you don't understand the point-of-view, but then be big about it and admit it, rather than pedestrian and mock it. There's no shame in not being able to relate to what someone is saying, so long as the point in question is lucid and part of the conversation (or, in other words, not trolling or just out-and-out misinformed and foolish). That is where interesting conversations BEGIN - right now some of you are shooting down the interesting conversations before they begin.

 

Are you suggesting I'm a troll because I call The Stormcloud whiners on occasion? Like I and many others have been doing since Scott started this thing back in '96? When The Stormcloud calls me Kool-aid drinker are they trolling as well? Is chz a troll when she suggests someone will have reason to "bitch" for another couple years? Directly calling into question someone's bona fides as a fan by saying he is apathetic about the team is furthering interesting conversation? Only Team Kool-aid is incapable of understanding an opposing view? Is Team Stormcloud just misunderstood because their message is just too complex? That seems to be your message here. Welcome to the league, Team Sanctimonious.

 

GO SABRES!!!

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Great post. I can't disagree with your points. Many of the disagreement on this forum is based on how long people have been following the team, how long they've had issues with it, and what kinds of things they want to see. I have no problem with people feeling frustrated. I simply resent being told that my timeline in which changes should be made somehow makes me part of this teams problems.

 

Don't take it personal. Apathy being used as a definition might be the wrong word in your case. You are pretty balanced. I think it's a valid word to throw out in general because we are 10 months removed from all those titilating Pegula quotes, yet already there seems to be a mass lowering of expectations, starting from management and being accepted by some fans. Ted Black even added the addendum "Or die trying", like a good reformed lawyer would when it becomes obvious the franchise dysfunction is in need of more than Tony Robbins to turn things around.

 

Again, everyone is frustrated. I long for the day where I can flow glowingly about the consistant effort on the ice and focus on matchups and strategy knowing full well I have pride in the team from top to bottom. I would love to get back to the days where I could hate Jay Miller, or Claude Lemieux, or Darcy Tucker more than I hate the makeup of my own franchise. Some peoples' lips tell me one thing, but my eyes, head and heart tell me another...and they have been for far too long.

[Weave]

Are you suggesting I'm a troll because I call The Stormcloud whiners on occasion? Like I and many others have been doing since Scott started this thing back in '96? When The Stormcloud calls me Kool-aid drinker are they trolling as well? Is chz a troll when she suggests someone will have reason to "bitch" for another couple years? Directly calling into question someone's bona fides as a fan by saying he is apathetic about the team is furthering interesting conversation? Only Team Kool-aid is incapable of understanding an opposing view? Is Team Stormcloud just misunderstood because their message is just too complex? That seems to be your message here. Welcome to the league, Team Sanctimonious.

 

GO SABRES!!!

 

Yep, those are all examples of trolling too.

[...]

 

 

Are you suggesting I'm a troll because I call The Stormcloud whiners on occasion? Like I and many others have been doing since Scott started this thing back in '96? When The Stormcloud calls me Kool-aid drinker are they trolling as well? Is chz a troll when she suggests someone will have reason to "bitch" for another couple years? Directly calling into question someone's bona fides as a fan by saying he is apathetic about the team is furthering interesting conversation? Only Team Kool-aid is incapable of understanding an opposing view? Is Team Stormcloud just misunderstood because their message is just too complex? That seems to be your message here. Welcome to the league, Team Sanctimonious.

 

GO SABRES!!!

 

I don't have the patience to respond thoroughly on the phone, but suffice to say that you're missing the mark by a wide margin on the troll thing.

 

Unless, of course, the idea is to take what I said and stir the pot more, rather than allow it to settle down.

Edited December 21, 2011 by sizzlemeister

[deluca67]

I think that unfortunately you misinterpreted my post. I intended it as an extreme counter to DeLuca's extreme argument that my desire to make changes in a reasonable manner is apathetic. He insisted that the only way to not be apathetic about this team is by expressing a desire for unlimited change. That if I limit the extent to which I think changes to be made that it makes me a fan that does not want the team to win a Stanley Cup.

 

Nothing in life operates outside of boundaries. The changes that can be made to this team are limited by a multitude of factors, and because of these factors I choose to limit what I believe should be done to a realm of reason.

 

Do I believe that a number of players should be moved? Yes. Do I believe that there should be changes at the coaching and GM positions? Yes. But I want them to be done in a manner that leaves this team capable of operating for the next hundred years.

 

But apparently DeLuca believes that being level headed makes me someone that doesn't care. That is the issue here that I take monumental offense to.

As Dwight said, don't take it personally. IMO, your position constitutes sitting on the fence, which to me is a sign of apathy. That's just my opinion and is likely fueled by frustration. Frustrated that here we are in 2011 going into 2012 with yet another billionaire owner who is supposedly willing to spend money, yet here we are with the same exact quality of product on the ice as if the ownership change never happened.

[Samson's Flow]

As Dwight said, don't take it personally. IMO, your position constitutes sitting on the fence, which to me is a sign of apathy. That's just my opinion and is likely fueled by frustration. Frustrated that here we are in 2011 going into 2012 with yet another billionaire owner who is supposedly willing to spend money, yet here we are with the same exact quality of product on the ice as if the ownership change never happened.

You think it's the same? I think it is much worse. In years past we could at least score with the rest of the teams in the league while wearing our prada purses on the ice - this year we are soft and ineffective

[deluca67]

You think it's the same? I think it is much worse. In years past we could at least score with the rest of the teams in the league while wearing our prada purses on the ice - this year we are soft and ineffective

You know me, Mr. Positive. :blush:

[Samson's Flow]

You know me, Mr. Positive. :blush:

Welcome to team sunshine and rainbows ;)

[deluca67]

Welcome to team sunshine and rainbows ;)

Where do I pickup my kitten? Ooh, is that Kool-Aid?

[nfreeman]

As Dwight said, don't take it personally. IMO, your position constitutes sitting on the fence, which to me is a sign of apathy. That's just my opinion and is likely fueled by frustration. Frustrated that here we are in 2011 going into 2012 with yet another billionaire owner who is supposedly willing to spend money, yet here we are with the same exact quality of product on the ice as if the ownership change never happened.

 

Well, there's nothing "supposed" about his willingness to spend money. This offseason speaks for itself in that regard.