Crowd noise and fan-dom

[Weave]

I am doing the promoting? May I remind you that I was not the first one to introduce the labels "blue collar" or "Chet and Muffy" in this thread. I doubt the latter is being used with the same level of respect as the former.

 

As the guy who explained the whole Chet and Muffy thing I feel compelled to respond.

 

Yes, there is a bit of classism in the Chet and Muffy comment. Obviously it is a stereotype. It was introduced by a fellow whom I believe is probably a bit of a classist. That doesn't make his observation incorrect given the correct context. And context is important. When the Aud was closed down and the new arena opened there was a very overt effort by the Rigas' to upscale the crowd at the games. Frankly, there is more profit in it. And it most definitely did result in a more reserved, less vocal crowd. Is it classist to recognize that the more upscale crowd was less vocal? I hope not as I probably more closely represent the new crowd than the Aud crowd these days.

[Matty Ice]

Why do some of you people hate on the Buffalo crowds at Sabres games? Why do you equate fan-dom with crowd noise/activity? Why is it important to you that the crowds act like obnoxious fools, and when they don't, then you hate on them?

 

 

 

I don't get this crowd noise = fan-dom equation. If the crowds were raucous for an entire game, for no reason other than to "party on", then I wouldn't go - and I'm sure a lot of other people wouldn't, either.

 

I personally don't "hate" on the Buffalo crowds at the Sabres games, and I honestly couldn't tell you why and if other people do. I'll take your word for it. I do equate crowd noise/activity with fan-dom. However I also throw in ratings, sales, and attendance, as you mentioned, into the fan-dom equation. I personally don't find it particularly important for crowds to act like obnoxious fools. But if my neighbor next to me wants to party-on, than I'll say "don't threaten me with a good time," and will gladly join him/her.

 

What I have been trying to convey, is that I prefer a loud crowd, to a passive crowd. I like crowd noise, I like crowd activity. I could do without some of the "obnoxious" people. (Like the guy in the mens bathroom last night who was wearing a red ladies halter top, with overalls, and felt the need to show everyone his... shortcomings.) While we are discussing the term obnoxious, I personally feel that the person behind me who tells me to sit down during the game is infinitely more obnoxious than the fan who has been drinking since noon, and is swearing at the fan that is telling me to sit down.

 

 

I would say that defines most Sabres fans, but is not the point at hand - because this is the basis I start from and there are people on this forum who question the fans at the arena who like to cheer, stand up at break aways, fights, saves, and goals. The place aways sells out, the TV ratings are good, the product sales are good. I'm not sure there's an argument on what defines a "good" fan here.

 

 

 

 

I don't think this is questionable, either. But it does not address the original point. People at games cheer saves, goals, fights, they boo bad call, they heckle the goalies, they heckle the Sabres when they play like crap.

 

Now, pay attention, there are people here who say THAT ISN'T ENOUGH. There are people here who complain that the fans aren't like European fans, or even fans in Canada. The latter of which is funny, because even the Canadian arenas get quiet, too.

 

Apparently Buffalo fans don't live up to some expectations of the armchair pundits. What say you to THAT? You say you go to games - would you say with all of the support the team gets, which, as I said above, is proven by ratings, sales, and attendance, but because Buffalo fans aren't loud all of the time, that they're not "good" fans?

 

And, who is to blame for that, then? The fans? The team's home performance?

 

Can you answer these questions directly, since you're in the thread?

 

Sorry, but I don't think that its enough. I can understand why some fans want us to be more like European fans, especially since we started the season over their, and got to see how loud they are. That certainly entices me. The atmosphere alone gave me chills through my TV. While I don't think Buffalo needs to be like Munich, it would be nice if Buffalo would be more like our fathers Buffalo. Sure some people at games cheer saves, goals, fights, they boo bad calls, they heckle the goalies, and they heckle the Sabres when they play like crap. But the crowd intensity isn't what it used to be, and I genuinely miss that. Call me selfish, but my game experience suffers as a result. I do blame the fans. As demonstrated by an earlier post, our team's home performance has been quite good in recent years.

 

With all that I have said about my dissatisfaction with the noise levels, I don't think the Buffalo Sabres have a fan base full of bad fans. I actually think they have an excellent fan base full of great fans. Look at this website for example. It is full of knowledgeable, and passionate fans. Like you said, ticket sales, product sales, and TV ratings are all excellent. I don't disagree with you on that, WNY and beyond supports our hockey team.

 

In closing, I just want to say that passionate, loud, and active fans aren't necessarily obnoxious. They are fun to be around and improve the game experience. I am an educated, white collar, paper pushing Chet 8-5, M-F. But when it is 7pm on game night, you can bet that I am buttoning up my blue collar, and sliding my Sabres jersey over the top of it.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

When Ted Nolan and his band of overachievers were tearing up the new arena....it was a madhouse at times. It wasn't just about fights and it wasn't just about winning a division. It was about a group of guys playing nads out, who had each other's back, and who represented the franchise, the city, and the fanbase to a point where you couldn't NOT respect them and have a good time.

 

For anyone here who is a football fan and has been to the Ralph this year....the current team has the exact same characteristics, and I beg anyone to say they didn't have a great time at any of the games so far. The New England game bordered on spiritual.

 

I think this is part of the problem. Football has 16 games, and something is on the line in each of them. You don't have the choice to coast for a game or a stretch of games, or you are toast. The past few years at the stadium were not like this year, but at the same time, the current Sabres are playing well and this offseason came tied for the most anticipation and expectations in the past 15 years. What I experienced the other night bordered on going to a Bisons game.

 

I don't know how much of it is the makeup of the fans, how much of it is a different product on the ice than 15+ years ago, and how much of it is the makeup of the current franchise and players on the ice. All I know is that as much as I want to feel the passion I have for hockey in the past and this team, my gut overtakes my will. With the current Bills on the other hand, my passion re-ignited on a dime as I really want the team and all the idividuals on it from top down to succeed. Again, it's my gut.

I look at Fitzpatrick, Freddy Jackson, David Nelson, Eric Wood, George Wilson, Dareus, Barnett, etc.....and I just see good guys that play hard and smart. Nix and Gailey have been here for 2 years and have put their giant, no-BS, get the job done, stamp on the team. It may not be a finished product yet, but like I said before the season started...I trust these guys and respect them all the way.

[ozone]

I took a friend of mine, who had never been to a live Sabres game before, to the home opener versus Carolina. We had a great time despite the loss but he was a bit disappointed about how quiet the crowd was. I was hyping up the experience and I expected the place to be raucous after coming from Europe 2-0 and it being the first game. I figured it would be just like the last playoff game against the Flyers. The crowd was pretty enthusiastic but it would be a lot more fun it was louder. I don't recall any heckling chants to the opposing goalie in that game or the Columbus one.

 

Certainly, nothing compares to playoff games but getting FNC livelier would only add to the experience of regular season games--for the fan and the players. That being said, FNC is a great arena to watch a game. I've watched the Sabres play the Panthers in Fort Lauderdale and the Sabres fans take over the arena. There are so many opposing fans there, it's ridiculous. At regular season Sabres games, it's like 99% Sabres fans with a few exceptions (playoffs being one of them).

[TheMatrix31]

You can be loud and a crazy fanbase without being obnoxious. Obnoxious and violent fans are awful. You don't want to be like Bruins or Flyers fans.

 

Being loud definitely doesnt mean that. Being loud creates an environment. A fun environment. An environment where it shows that people CARE. Why would any team want to play for a crowd that doesn't give a damn? I root for teams in other sports (Suns, Braves) that have notoriously awful fans that don't care so much of the time. That really, really sucks. When I went to a Suns playoff game in 2010, I actually had people behind me tell me to SIT. And this was my first Suns home game that I attended and I drove from LA just to do so. No one's telling me to sit down.

 

It's a damn shame that I don't get to go to home games for my favorite teams, being as I live in LA and none of my teams are LA (or even CA) based. I'm relatively reserved when I go to sporting events (I generally leave the crazy yelling and cussing for my TV) but I imagine if I got to home games I would be a bit more open about it. Last thing I want to do is get my ass beat by piece of crap Dodger fans because I'm cheering my Braves.

 

Be into it. Be smart though. Be loud. Yell to your heart's content. Sing, chant, wave towels, do whatever you need to do. Just like a great band like a Metallica interacts with the crowd during songs, I want the PA to interact with the crowd. I love that connection. I made a suggested off the heels of the Europe trip for us to do like they do in the German Bundesliga (soccer league) where, after a goal, the PA guy says the scorer's first name, and the crowd yells back the last name. This happens three times. I mean, how bad ass would that be?

 

Make your crowd stand out for the right reasons. It's critical. And just bad ass.

[CallawaySabres]

I think there has been one semi-vocal "lets go Buffalo" chant in the two games I have gone to so far. My concern is that the building has lost ANY sort of atmosphere that I perceive to be advantageous to the team. Even the playoff games have been lacking (starting with the Boston series 3 years ago and Philly again last year."

 

I think in time it will get better but I'll tell ya, that Columbus game was just brutal. There was not a peep until the first fight and that's when people woke up for 30 seconds. Obnoxious yelling - no... atmosphere - yes

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

I think there has been one semi-vocal "lets go Buffalo" chant in the two games I have gone to so far. My concern is that the building has lost ANY sort of atmosphere that I perceive to be advantageous to the team. Even the playoff games have been lacking (starting with the Boston series 3 years ago and Philly again last year."

 

I think in time it will get better but I'll tell ya, that Columbus game was just brutal. There was not a peep until the first fight and that's when people woke up for 30 seconds. Obnoxious yelling - no... atmosphere - yes

 

I think a lot of it has to do with technology and the dumbing down of the casual fan. Be it at the arena or on TV, they are spinning you around with pretty graphics, pimping products, and cramming you with useless information the whole time. The whole beauty about sports is that it is supposed to be poetic and an art form. You appreciate when something happens in 100% symmetry to the absolute standard.....a crazy deke for a goal, the perfect hip-check, a toe tapping sideline catch, a giant hit from a safety, a 3 point buzzer beater.......you go, whoa!....that is what it's all about.

 

There is no time to reflect on what is amazing or what should be the standard anymore. Any schmuck can bombard you with "opinions" on twitter, tv, this message board....and the whole world of sports has been watered down. For someone under 25 to really become a true student of the game.....it is much harder now. People are too busy checking their Iphone for fantasy scores or text messages to sit back and EXPERIENCE something in it's pure form. Sure....you can still have fun and learn and appreciate, but it is so adulterated with nonsense now.....you have to be a pro at tuning it out.

 

Buffalo still has tons of educated fans, but it is much harder to get everyone at the arena on the same zen level because 3 milliseconds after the whistle we have to hear about going green, or watch Kevin Sylvester eat pickled herring. Maybe Ted Black should have a throwback game where they shut down the ribbon board, dim the advertising lights, put a simulation of the old aud scoreboard on the current one through a 2 hour programming job of a computer graphic, and only announce lineups, goals, and penalties. I'd pay an extra $10 a ticket NOT to be bombarded with crap all game.

[LabattBlue]

Here's hoping for a "vocal" crowd tonight...and even more so on Friday when I will be there(last Friday against Detroit was one of the quietest games I have attended in recent memory).

 

GO SABRES!

[dEnnis the Menace]

Here's hoping for a "vocal" crowd tonight...and even more so on Friday when I will be there(last Friday against Detroit was one of the quietest games I have attended in recent memory).

 

GO SABRES!

 

I'll be at Friday and Saturday's game. The last game I went to (Washington game) was pretty loud.

[Supersabre]

Why do some of you people hate on the Buffalo crowds at Sabres games? Why do you equate fan-dom with crowd noise/activity? Why is it important to you that the crowds act like obnoxious fools, and when they don't, then you hate on them?

 

I've been going to Sabres games since I was a kid. Since I can remember, I don't recall Buffalo crowds ever getting outrageous like European crowds. I don't go to games to act stupid, I go to games to see the things in the game I can't see/hear/experience with TV feeds.

 

At home, when I watch games, I WATCH games. I do not like to chit-chat with people in the room, except, of course, during TV time outs. When they score, I usually yell, put my arms up, and yammer about the play, then I'm back to watching the game intently. I am no different at games. Does that make me a bad man to you; a poor example of a Sabres fan?

 

I'm a musician; been playing in front of people since I was a teenager. When I go to concerts, I like to watch and listen, not fight jerks who are there to get obnoxious, or dance around like a fool. Just like I like to LISTEN to music like people watch movies; it's not background, or ambiance, rather it's the primary focus. I study it and pay attention like old-skool audiences from the early 60's and earlier. Used to be, and it is still true for a lot of bands, that the music is supposed to be focus, not the "party" in the audience, and a lot of musicians find attention-deprived audiences offensive. Unless you're talking about mind-less, shallow music that is built around the idea of an attention-deprived audience, which, of course, only serves to distract from the fact that the music is mind-less, shallow, and of poor quality.

 

Back to the Sabres, when I'm at games, I notice the "dead" crowds are very similar to me - they WATCH the games. They're following the play, judging what's going on, reacting to stupid things, laughing or otherwise enjoying good play. They stand up and cheer during fights and goals, bitch and moan for bad calls. The crowds aren't stupid - the Sabres aren't brilliant enough to warrant the excited agitation of a crowd for an entire game. They blew the last two games with Tampa, after all.

 

I don't get this crowd noise = fan-dom equation. If the crowds were raucous for an entire game, for no reason other than to "party on", then I wouldn't go - and I'm sure a lot of other people wouldn't, either.

 

That is the exact reason that I attend local hockey games here in Kansas. More specifically CHL games. I don't go to be an obnoxious unruly fan. But to enjoy the sport for the skill and athleticism it takes to play the sport and to watch the home team win.

[elcrusho]

I have a Slayer ornament on my tree........do you....

[Iron Crotch]

I'll be at Friday and Saturday's game. The last game I went to (Washington game) was pretty loud.

 

I'll be at those games too... Checked the calendar for back-to-back home games and this coming weekend did the trick. Cost of flights, hotel rooms, and tickets to two games is obscene, but I digress.... Anyway, I'll be as loud as I can... I'll try to rally Chet & Muffy if I see them! B-)

[dEnnis the Menace]

I'll be at those games too... Checked the calendar for back-to-back home games and this coming weekend did the trick. Cost of flights, hotel rooms, and tickets to two games is obscene, but I digress.... Anyway, I'll be as loud as I can... I'll try to rally Chet & Muffy if I see them! B-)

 

Yeah, going to Friday's game was a surprise. My friend sprang the tickets on me for my sister and me to go with her and her dad. I said sure lol.

 

Saturday, I'm going with 5 other people, and only half of our group has ever been to an NHL game. It'll be interesting to say the least. My sister's boyfriend's dad watches the games with us on TV, and has been to Cornell games, and some AHL games, but never a NHL game. hopefully it'll be a good game to go to (he used to be a Rangers fan, but since his son started dating my sister, and we're all Sabres diehards...he's started to convert... :devil: )

[beerme1]

I do miss the seemingly organic crowd reactions we used to get at the Aud.

 

1.... 2.... 3.... WE WANT FOUR!!!!

 

WE WANT RAY !! WE WANT RAY !!!

 

HARRIS IS A BUM !!

 

Goalie taunts

 

[insert name here] SUCKS !!

 

We don't here much of that anymore.

 

We may have more in common than I thought based on what you have written in this thread. I'm 45 and always have to defend the Chet and Muffy's who sit in the club level because thats where I sit. However we are not all Chet and Muffy's and actually am getting rather tired of defending where I choose to sit. My seats are in a corner give me a great view and include parking and cost less than some in 100's I am lucky enough to have row 1 seats in my corner club section 223.

I do get the generalizations about the chets and muffys. I have them beside me and behind me and they drive me nuts. But if you think it's bad here go to Toronto and see what you sit with!

That was not really directed at you Weave just hashing together some thoughts from various posts in this thread including a couple of yours.

I cheer loud. I trey to embarass my section into getting into it but there are always a lot of visitors in the section and not all that many season ticket holders. I don't care so much because you cant beat my seats. Nobody in front of me and feels like im in the lower bowl.

 

As far as the generic chants you mention, You will hear me starting Lets Go Buffalo chants, you will never hear me say one, we want two but you will hear me start that chant after we have three or four!

My favorite chant that I do is when Toronto or Montreal are in town and their fans think its a positive chant at first and I have to be at the top of my lungs to do it well.

Toronto!!!!!!!!!!

pause

pause

YOU SUCK!

 

Their fans are ridiculous and after going to the Montreal game a few weeks ago in Montreal let me just say I will always, always give their loser fans everything I can! It's amazing how much we have to take from them when they come to our rink and when we were there I counted 8 Sabre jerseys including the four of us! Almost had to fight after the game and was told to F Off during the game because I was chanting Lets Go Buffalo. Amazingly while no one had a problem with the guy who told me to f off, when we tied the game and I turned back and said f who? F you!! there was an insatnt look of shock all around us. And when we won the game in the shootout my friend was gone before my head turned around to say thanks.

I will not be courteouus to jerk fans from MTL or TOR. Civilized ones no problem. Jerks, no.

The very week after our game in Montreal there was a rather nasty fight in the stands during a Boston game there. Dont know if it was a Boston fan or not but some dude got pounded on pretty bad. No arrests just four people kicked out lol.

I will say though the noise and atmosphere in the rink in Montreal was awesome. The best I have ever experienced. It was a mid November game and they cheered as loud as we get for a playoff game at least 12 times. It was impressive.

 

Tonight should be raucous and I am getting a cold. So what. I'll be loud, proud and sometimes likely even obnoxious!

Lets Go Buffalo!

[DumbPuck]

I think a lot of it has to do with technology and the dumbing down of the casual fan. Be it at the arena or on TV, they are spinning you around with pretty graphics, pimping products, and cramming you with useless information the whole time. The whole beauty about sports is that it is supposed to be poetic and an art form. You appreciate when something happens in 100% symmetry to the absolute standard.....a crazy deke for a goal, the perfect hip-check, a toe tapping sideline catch, a giant hit from a safety, a 3 point buzzer beater.......you go, whoa!....that is what it's all about.

 

There is no time to reflect on what is amazing or what should be the standard anymore. Any schmuck can bombard you with "opinions" on twitter, tv, this message board....and the whole world of sports has been watered down. For someone under 25 to really become a true student of the game.....it is much harder now. People are too busy checking their Iphone for fantasy scores or text messages to sit back and EXPERIENCE something in it's pure form. Sure....you can still have fun and learn and appreciate, but it is so adulterated with nonsense now.....you have to be a pro at tuning it out.

 

Buffalo still has tons of educated fans, but it is much harder to get everyone at the arena on the same zen level because 3 milliseconds after the whistle we have to hear about going green, or watch Kevin Sylvester eat pickled herring. Maybe Ted Black should have a throwback game where they shut down the ribbon board, dim the advertising lights, put a simulation of the old aud scoreboard on the current one through a 2 hour programming job of a computer graphic, and only announce lineups, goals, and penalties. I'd pay an extra $10 a ticket NOT to be bombarded with crap all game.

 

Wow ... as close to hitting a nail on the head as they get. I would pay a LOT more for a ticket if we could get rid of all the marketing crap throughout the game. I know this won't happen.... but it's a pleasant dream.

[LabattBlue]

Wow ... as close to hitting a nail on the head as they get. I would pay a LOT more for a ticket if we could get rid of all the marketing crap throughout the game. I know this won't happen.... but it's a pleasant dream.

I probably already said it once in this thread, but who cares.....

 

Thommmmaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaassssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnnneeeeeeeeeeeeeekkk.

 

I want to punch that guy in the mouth!!! I was watching an NHL game recently where the PA announcer was old school instead of being the center of attention. What a joy it would be to have that back at the FNC for Sabres games, and let this joker or the guy who does the same shtick limit it to the Bandit games.

[X. Benedict]

I probably already said it once in this thread, but who cares.....

 

Thommmmaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaassssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss Vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnnneeeeeeeeeeeeeekkk.

 

I want to punch that guy in the mouth!!! I was watching an NHL game recently where the PA announcer was old school instead of being the center of attention. What a joy it would be to have that back at the FNC for Sabres games, and let this joker or the guy who does the same shtick limit it to the Bandit games.

Every time I hear that Motivational goal voice.... I re-run it as Milt Ellis in my head........Every time.

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

the sabre fans that went to game in carolina a few weeks back were much louder than the crowd at FirstNiagara last friday night

[beerme1]

the sabre fans that went to game in carolina a few weeks back were much louder than the crowd at FirstNiagara last friday night

 

They were of course all primed and I'll bet there were no Mitt and Muffy types there either! I don't think they travel for games.

[spndnchz]

the sabre fans that went to game in carolina a few weeks back were much louder than the crowd at FirstNiagara last friday night

 

Agreed. But last Friday's game was over before the first beer was downed. U could tell we would lose way too soon. Kinda an O ###### we ain't winning this one and switch to "at home mode".

 

Fans get pretty load when they fell 'it'. Last Friday had no feeling.

[LaFontaineToMogilny]

I will jump into this thread with my first ever post on this forum because this is a subject close to my heart. This will probably run a little long, so be forewarned.

 

First of all, I am a European expat living in California, so I don't go to games at FNC. I comment based on what I experience through the screen. I have to agree that hockey fans in general are not very loud and the atmosphere at games could be a lot better. I noticed it when I was watching the Predators game, the crowd was very quiet for extended parts of the game. In my opinion way too quiet.

 

I think Buffalo has a very real opportunity to really distinguish itself as a top tier hockey town by taking fan participation very seriously. A highly energized and vocal crowd can be a HUGE benefit for the entire organization. Not only does it serve as a huge motivation for the players to have the crowd constantly urge them on, it also makes the games a lot more marketable for TV audiences throughout the entire league.

 

So, how does one go about promoting a more European style fan atmosphere at the games?

 

It's already been pointed out that not everyone wants to be rowdy or vocal. That is perfectly fine, most fans wants to just go to the game, sit down and watch, cheer for goals and the odd hit or fight and go home. That is true for European soccer crowds as well, the reason why they are so much louder are that the fans who do want to create a more vocal experience join together and make it happen. This is typically handled by independent supporter groups, something akin to what I imagine the Sabres booster club could be. By organizing fans, making a section of the stands available for 'standing supporters' and getting a coordinated effort going the Sabres could easily have the best fans in hockey, and probably in all of professional sports in the US at least.

 

The electric atmosphere generated by European style soccer crowd (please don't confuse this with the semi related violence culture in some clubs) is not a result of more dedicated and rabid fans than what the Sabres have. It's a simple function of organized and coordinated effort. These booster clubs discuss chants and songs online between games, designate specific people responsible for starting cheers and songs at specific times etc. They also create specific songs or chants for the individual players and events so that whenever Tomas Vanek for example scores a goal, everyone knows that the crowd sings the Buffalo Goal song, followed by Tomas Vanek's personal song.

 

In this model, people who don't want to 'get up and go' at games can still enjoy the games as they want, while everyone gets the added bonus of an absolutely fantastic fan experience. I think it would be a huge competitive advantage for the Sabres, both in attracting fans, and players to the team, and for getting more national exposure. The question is of course if there is the will or even desire to get something like this started in Buffalo.

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

it wasnt just detroit this year lst year I was up for Tampa game in Nov and it was like silence city. Not sure many Mitt and Muffys here except for those wine sipping caniacs :-)

[BuffaloFansR_Crazy]

I'm sure the crowd will pick them up for this very important period.............NOT! ( I'm bring that back like Shawn Spencer)

[Eleven]

FWIW, that crowd came through on TV loud and clear tonight.

[beerme1]

I will jump into this thread with my first ever post on this forum because this is a subject close to my heart.

These booster clubs discuss chants and songs online between games, designate specific people responsible for starting cheers and songs at specific times etc.

 

Hey welcome to you!

The game in Motreal I went to recently did exactly this. They had a dedicated section with cheerleader girls to raise hell. Of course they're all cuties and in the farthest up nosebleeds and giving away t shirst and such. What else do you do except look at the hotties and raise hell up there anyway? We have our version of that in the 300's in the corners. They make the most noise but without encouragement. They are the encouragement on nights like tonight. Well after the frist period at least.