Around the NHL 2011-2012

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Whoops, I thought they made him GM. You're right. Either way he's unproven and is being given too much credit simply because he's not Darcy.

Dudley takes partial credit at best for those cups. His predecessors set him up pretty well in both places and he just got to makes some tweaks and ride it out.

 

I'm not buying the hype. His failures don't seem to be relevant to anyone.

 

You mean like taking over the management and coaching of a team that was awarded the Jack Adams and Executive of the year? :angel:

[darksabre]

 

 

 

You mean like taking over the management and coaching of a team that was awarded the Jack Adams and Executive of the year? :angel:

 

Your point?

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Your point?

 

If you want to dismiss Dudley's role on WINNING TWO STANLEY CUPS as simply "tweaking" what came before him, then am I to assume that you feel the same way about Darcy and Lindy since they simply "tweaked" what was handed to them by the Coach and GM of the Year in the NHL in order to LOSE ONE STANLEY CUP?

[TrueBlueGED]

Tampa and Chicago both won Cups with him at the top of the talent evaluation position.

 

I love what Winnipeg looks like going forward. I think they are playing for a Cup within 3 years. Next year they are in the playoffs.

 

Dudley has also been a coach and can buffer between the front office and locker room.

 

You can do a lot worse than Dudley.

 

I like Dudley a lot and would have loved to see him with the Sabres in some capacity. That said, Winnipeg isn't sniffing a Cup unless they fill the black hole they have at center. Scheifele could end up being a good #2, maybe even a lower end #1, but outside of him, they have absolutely nothing either on the team or in the system.

[darksabre]

 

 

If you want to dismiss Dudley's role on WINNING TWO STANLEY CUPS as simply "tweaking" what came before him, then am I to assume that you feel the same way about Darcy and Lindy since they simply "tweaked" what was handed to them by the Coach and GM of the Year in the NHL in order to LOSE ONE STANLEY CUP?

 

Ah so it's okay for Dudley to ride other people's coat tails but not Darcy, I see.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Ah so it's okay for Dudley to ride other people's coat tails but not Darcy, I see.

 

If you feel he rode the coat tails in WINNING 2 STANLEY CUPS for different organizations, then I assume you also feel Darcy and Lindy did also in LOSING 1 STANLEY CUP, then missing the playoffs as many times as making it in the decade plus afterwards when left to their own abilities.

 

I guess we don't know what Dudley is capable of as a personnel man long term since he only stays around long enough to win a Stanley Cup or move on if he doesn't in a short period of time because it is considered failure by the majority of logical people.

 

I make the agreement.

 

Darcy was great in losing a Stanley Cup then making it to the playoffs 6 of the next 12 years.

 

Dudley was great in WINNING 2 Stanley Cups then moving on after short stints in Winnipeg and Toronto.

 

I didn't say Dudley was great......all I did was correct you when you asked "What Stanley Cup" and said you could do worse than Dudley.

 

You can do worse than Darcy as well. Maybe my Grandmother would like a crack at assembling the roster. Although to be fair, she thinks that the little Ennis kid is "cute as a button", and that my Grandfather would have been CEO of Exxon if he didn't have that hood slammed on his hand in the repair bay that one day and had to miss 2 weeks of work. I hear injuries really have a way of derailing greatness.

[darksabre]

If you feel he rode the coat tails in WINNING 2 STANLEY CUPS for different organizations, then I assume you also feel Darcy and Lindy did also in LOSING 1 STANLEY CUP, then missing the playoffs as many times as making it in the decade plus afterwards when left to their own abilities.

 

I guess we don't know what Dudley is capable of as a personnel man long term since he only stays around long enough to win a Stanley Cup or move on if he doesn't in a short period of time because it is considered failure by the majority of logical people.

 

I make the agreement.

 

Darcy was great in losing a Stanley Cup then making it to the playoffs 6 of the next 12 years.

 

Dudley was great in WINNING 2 Stanley Cups then moving on after short stints in Winnipeg and Toronto.

 

I didn't say Dudley was great......all I did was correct you when you asked "What Stanley Cup" and said you could do worse than Dudley.

 

You can do worse than Darcy as well. Maybe my Grandmother would like a crack at assembling the roster. Although to be fair, she thinks that the little Ennis kid is "cute as a button", and that my Grandfather would have been CEO of Exxon if he didn't have that hood slammed on his hand in the repair bay that one day and had to miss 2 weeks of work. I hear injuries really have a way of derailing greatness.

 

Good, then we're in agreement.

 

I simply have an issue with the Dudley move being touted as making Montreal significantly better. Yes it appears to be a good move, but the amount of value added is being wildly exaggerated for the sake of making a point.

[deluca67]

I think the question is can Dudley actually build a team? He's shown he's okay in secondary roles and coaching at lower levels (IHL), but can he be the main man? If he's that kind of exec why didn't Toronto try to keep him instead of Burke, who hasn't done the best job ever in his tenure?

 

Lots of questions to be answered before there can be any true opinion of Dudley as a GM. Montreal will me much harder than Tampa, Florida and Atlanta. He's going to be the whipping boy there if he doesn't absolutely kill it.

 

Deluca seems to want to give him the key to Montreal already.

What is this based on? I simply said he makes the Canadians better. Here is a guy who has been part of building Cup winners, he should help the Canadians. They are better with him they they are without him.

 

There seems to be a trend developing where posters feel the need to embellish my comments in an attempt to fit what they want their responses to be. It's very odd.

[darksabre]

 

What is this based on? I simply said he makes the Canadians better. Here is a guy who has been part of building Cup winners, he should help the Canadians. They are better with him they they are without him.

 

There seems to be a trend developing where posters feel the need to embellish my comments in an attempt to fit what they want their responses to be. It's very odd.

 

Bull. You know what you're saying when you make your posts. Let's see how many times over the next year you bring Dudley up regardless of what he does for the Habs. We'll never hear the end of it if they make the playoffs. I bet you've already got a folder in your "Anyone But Regier" filing cabinet waiting for newspaper clippings.

[SwampD]

Bull. You know what you're saying when you make your posts. Let's see how many times over the next year you bring Dudley up regardless of what he does for the Habs. We'll never hear the end of it if they make the playoffs. I bet you've already got a folder in your "Anyone But Regier" filing cabinet waiting for newspaper clippings.

Is everything okay, d4rk? You seem extra angry lately.

 

Is it because, deep down, you actually agree with everything DeLuca says?

[deluca67]

Bull. You know what you're saying when you make your posts. Let's see how many times over the next year you bring Dudley up regardless of what he does for the Habs. We'll never hear the end of it if they make the playoffs. I bet you've already got a folder in your "Anyone But Regier" filing cabinet waiting for newspaper clippings.

Your Pro-Regier paranoia is getting the best of you. It's the same type of paranoia, IMO, Regier himself has, which may be why he doesn't bring in hockey people like Rick Dudley to work in the front office.

 

I will admit, I do have a folder called 'People Named Dudley I'd Rather Have As GM other than Regier', which includes:

 

Rick Dudley

Chris Dudley (former NBA player)

Dudley Moore

Dudley Do-Right

Bubba-Ray & Devon Dudley

[millbank]

[Weave]

Is everything okay, d4rk? You seem extra angry lately.

 

Is it because, deep down, you actually agree with everything DeLuca says?

 

 

I think they changed the recipe for Raisin Bran and are adding extra angry now. I know I've been angrier since I've opened my most recent box. Maybe it's in all of the Kellog's cereals now?

[apuszczalowski]

I think they changed the recipe for Raisin Bran and are adding extra angry now. I know I've been angrier since I've opened my most recent box. Maybe it's in all of the Kellog's cereals now?

So they listened to consummers and added more Raisins then Bran?

The Bran may have been the secret to keeping people less angry...........

[deluca67]

So they listened to consummers and added more Raisins then Bran?

The Bran may have been the secret to keeping people less angry...........

Are you saying that d4rk may be full of :rolleyes:

[darksabre]

Your Pro-Regier paranoia is getting the best of you. It's the same type of paranoia, IMO, Regier himself has, which may be why he doesn't bring in hockey people like Rick Dudley to work in the front office.

 

I will admit, I do have a folder called 'People Named Dudley I'd Rather Have As GM other than Regier', which includes:

 

Rick Dudley

Chris Dudley (former NBA player)

Dudley Moore

Dudley Do-Right

Bubba-Ray & Devon Dudley

 

I'm not pro-Regier.

[JJFIVEOH]

Your Pro-Regier paranoia is getting the best of you. It's the same type of paranoia, IMO, Regier himself has, which may be why he doesn't bring in hockey people like Rick Dudley to work in the front office.

 

I will admit, I do have a folder called 'People Named Dudley I'd Rather Have As GM other than Regier', which includes:

 

Rick Dudley

Chris Dudley (former NBA player)

Dudley Moore

Dudley Do-Right

Bubba-Ray & Devon Dudley

I'm not pro-Regier.

 

Is that like when people label somebody a socialist Obama lover if they say one bad thing about Bush? :rolleyes:

 

Sorry, I'll shut up now.

[darksabre]

Is everything okay, d4rk? You seem extra angry lately.

 

Is it because, deep down, you actually agree with everything DeLuca says?

 

Extra angry? Not at all. Time and time again I see support lobbied for individuals from players to coaches to GMs to owners via the argument that "anyone is better than _____", and it's very silly.

 

My bad for not being "enlightened" by that perspective.

 

Is that like when people label somebody a socialist Obama lover if they say one bad thing about Bush? :rolleyes:

 

Sorry, I'll shut up now.

 

That appears to be the situation. Quite a bit of hypocrisy floating around these days.

[SwampD]

Extra angry? Not at all. Time and time again I see support lobbied for individuals from players to coaches to GMs to owners via the argument that "anyone is better than _____", and it's very silly.

 

My bad for not being "enlightened" by that perspective.

 

II don't think it's silly at all. It points out the very argument used to justify keeping _____ and _____. We are told time and time again how there is nobody else out there who could posibly coach or GM the Sabres. We're always asked, "Well, who else is out there? Give me a name." Like it's our job to find them. Dudley is just one more example that there are qualified people out there (Sutter being another). And I am convinced that we will be here next year having the same exact arguments after having watched the same exact season that we have watched for the past five years. That's why I'm angry.

[darksabre]

II don't think it's silly at all. It points out the very argument used to justify keeping _____ and _____. We are told time and time again how there is nobody else out there who could posibly coach or GM the Sabres. We're always asked, "Well, who else is out there? Give me a name." Like it's our job to find them. Dudley is just one more example that there are qualified people out there (Sutter being another). And I am convinced that we will be here next year having the same exact arguments after having watched the same exact season that we have watched for the past five years. That's why I'm angry.

 

I see that argument made and it's equally silly. So we're agreed on that point.

 

As far as making the claim Dudley is qualified, that is where I take issue. The scales balance about 50/50 on his record. Some would like to ignore that for the sake of their argument, but would like to criticize Regier for every little thing he's done wrong over his tenure. It's madness.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Is that like when people label somebody a socialist Obama lover if they say one bad thing about Bush? :rolleyes:

 

Sorry, I'll shut up now.

 

The hatred is the worst in mixed states.

[deluca67]

I see that argument made and it's equally silly. So we're agreed on that point.

 

As far as making the claim Dudley is qualified, that is where I take issue. The scales balance about 50/50 on his record. Some would like to ignore that for the sake of their argument, but would like to criticize Regier for every little thing he's done wrong over his tenure. It's madness.

Regier has been here for 15 friggin' years'. To say some "criticize Regier for every little thing he's done wrong over his tenure" is ridiculous. Regier gets criticized because it is justified. You know his record just as well as everyone else. If you wanted to write a book about Regiers tenure as Sabres GM you shoudl title it "Just not good enough." The idea that Regier gets nitpicked about the job he has done is asinine. "every little thing he's done wrong", are you serious? Really?

[darksabre]

Regier has been here for 15 friggin' years'. To say some "criticize Regier for every little thing he's done wrong over his tenure" is ridiculous. Regier gets criticized because it is justified. You know his record just as well as everyone else. If you wanted to write a book about Regiers tenure as Sabres GM you shoudl title it "Just not good enough." The idea that Regier gets nitpicked about the job he has done is asinine. "every little thing he's done wrong", are you serious? Really?

 

So you've never nitpicked Regier?

[TrueBlueGED]

Regier has been here for 15 friggin' years'. To say some "criticize Regier for every little thing he's done wrong over his tenure" is ridiculous. Regier gets criticized because it is justified. You know his record just as well as everyone else. If you wanted to write a book about Regiers tenure as Sabres GM you shoudl title it "Just not good enough." The idea that Regier gets nitpicked about the job he has done is asinine. "every little thing he's done wrong", are you serious? Really?

 

Of course there's plenty of legitimate criticisms of Regier which are reasonably argued based on the merits of a particular move or sets of moves. But there's also a bunch of BS that gets tossed around with lazy or nonexistent analysis. It's gotten to the point where it's like making fun of Nickelback....plenty of people have legitimate reasons to dislike/hate/mock Nickelback and the music they make, but a lot of people just mock them because it's fashionable to do so without actually being able to present a logical "why". An example of the former would be arguing against the Kassian-Hodgson trade based on a prospect comparison, analysis of team need and organizational depth. An example of the latter would be "I hate this trade because it was made with a winning organization, and that means Regier couldn't possibly have gotten the better of it".

[deluca67]

So you've never nitpicked Regier?

After 15 years it's not "nitpicking", it's an accumulation of evidence that it's just not working.