beerme1 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Holy crap today was fun. :clapping: Last Friday too. Tomorrow also. Next season as well. Actually forevermore if you're a Sabres fan Thank you Pegula! :thumbsup:
thesportsbuff Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Tomorrow is going to be a LOT of fun, but besides Richards (who may not even make a decision tomorrow) there aren't too many names to be excited about. I mean we'll sign a third line center which will be cool (unless it's connolly -- some may jump off a bridge) but it might be a reeeaaaalllly long day waiting on Richards.. :lol:
Chuck Norris Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 I see other hockey fans in other cities are screaming of us circumventing the cap ala NJ
Punch Posted July 1, 2011 Author Report Posted July 1, 2011 This thread is about Ehrhoff, not you. :nana: That was exactly my first thought--- DeLuca, I'm not complaining about you I just thought Hradek had shifted his stance somewhat. Of course you're right, he's not "worth" $18mil for 2 years, but that's not the contract. It's front loaded so as to avoid a potential new CBA, right? The total dollar figure and the cap hit are the only significant numbers--- the way the contract is paid out is only creative accounting to allow for a more acceptable buyout in the final few years.
Taro T Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 He can be all what was said about him and still not worth $18 mil over two years. For the record, I love the signing and the contract. I have been banging the drum about adding top end talent for a while. I guess that gets lost in the madness. Almost nobody in the league is worth $18MM over 2 years. That's not the deal; the deal is $37MM over 7 years ($5.28MM/yr). Considering what happened to the cap this year and the general quality of this year's UFA class, I'd say he's worth that. The beauty part is, as far as the cap is concerned the Sabres personalized effective salary cap is $65.59MM when everybody else's is $64.3MM. I expect they'll put that money to use. Which is sweet. And because the Sabres' owner has more money than God and isn't afraid to use it, at the end of the deal when his cap hit ($4MM) would be greater than his salary ($1MM) (and possibly his value to the Sabres) Ehrhoff can retire and save the Sabres the cap hit (assuming the retirement glitch in the cap hasn't been corrected - a huge assumption and most likely a poor one) or can get traded to a low revenue / small market club and that club can have the personalized lower cap that they need and the Sabres can save the cap hit and continue on in their Filly imitation if that's what they want to do; though by then I'm sure it'll be more of a Detroit imitation. (Wouldn't it be cool if by then, the Wings are trying to emulate the Sabres?)
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Almost nobody in the league is worth $18MM over 2 years. That's not the deal; the deal is $37MM over 7 years ($5.28MM/yr). Considering what happened to the cap this year and the general quality of this year's UFA class, I'd say he's worth that. The beauty part is, as far as the cap is concerned the Sabres personalized effective salary cap is $65.59MM when everybody else's is $64.3MM. I expect they'll put that money to use. Which is sweet. And because the Sabres' owner has more money than God and isn't afraid to use it, at the end of the deal when his cap hit ($4MM) would be greater than his salary ($1MM) (and possibly his value to the Sabres) Ehrhoff can retire and save the Sabres the cap hit (assuming the retirement glitch in the cap hasn't been corrected - a huge assumption and most likely a poor one) or can get traded to a low revenue / small market club and that club can have the personalized lower cap that they need and the Sabres can save the cap hit and continue on in their Filly imitation if that's what they want to do; though by then I'm sure it'll be more of a Detroit imitation. (Wouldn't it be cool if by then, the Wings are trying to emulate the Sabres?) How much money does he pocket over the next two years?
Eleven Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 How much money does he pocket over the next two years? Were you complaining about this with Kovy? Of course not. For once, the Sabres are doing what YOU wanted them to do! They're gaming the system just like the rich teams did--oops--they are one of the rich teams now. It's a great signing, and I really don't care how much the guy makes in the next two years as long as there's room for other players (Myers and maybe a FA come to mind). And there is, because of the structure that YOU admired last year. Yes, I'm making it about you.
Taro T Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 I see other hockey fans in other cities are screaming of us circumventing the cap ala NJ Though I expect that in the next CBA there will be some measures undertaken to reduce cap "circumvention," some of which could bite back a little; after going through 6 years of watching others push the limits and watching the Sabres take it hard, I'm kind of relishing that sentiment. It's nice to be on the other side for once. Let's hope TP never gets tired of his toy and that by the time he passes it down to the kids they've maintained the same enthusiasm and maturity that he brings to it.
thesportsbuff Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 How much money does he pocket over the next two years? Who cares? Does it really bother you that we overpaid for a top tier UFA dman? The cap hit is still very manageable. I love the deal. I for one am happy they're throwing money around.
carpandean Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 I see other hockey fans in other cities are screaming of us circumventing the cap ala NJ It is circumvention of the real idea behind the cap, but it's not on an egregious level like Kovy's contract was. That contract had 10 years at an average of $9.5M, but used seven years, going until he would be 44, to get that hit down to $6M. Ehrhoff's contract is basically a 6 x $5.5M contract with four years added, taking him to about 39, to get it down to $4M. So, instead of using extra years that he won't likely play to get 10 yrs of $9.5M reduced by $3.5M per year, they're using extra years that he will possibly play to get 6 years of $5.5M down by $1.5M per year. Big difference. They re-wrote the rules and this doesn't violate any of them. I have a feeling that this contract will be "yesterday's news" (literally) when the terms of Richard's contract come out. Of course, if it is the Sabres, then the combination might cause some uproar.
deluca67 Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Were you complaining about this with Kovy? Of course not. For once, the Sabres are doing what YOU wanted them to do! They're gaming the system just like the rich teams did--oops--they are one of the rich teams now. It's a great signing, and I really don't care how much the guy makes in the next two years as long as there's room for other players (Myers and maybe a FA come to mind). And there is, because of the structure that YOU admired last year. Yes, I'm making it about you. You missed the point. I'm not complaining. I'm just saying the $18 mil over two years is a big reason Ehroff signed.
Eleven Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 It's nice to be on the other side for once. Amen.
Eleven Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 You missed the point. I'm not complaining. I'm just saying the $18 mil over two years is a big reason Ehroff signed. So what? Was the $X mil over 2 years a big reason your underachiever signed in Jersey? Yes.
scottnc Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 You missed the point. I'm not complaining. I'm just saying the $18 mil over two years is a big reason Ehroff signed. Of course it was. They had to make it a sweet deal to keep him from waiting to see what other offers would come in on Friday.
Taro T Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 How much money does he pocket over the next two years? Why worry about it. He's not quitting in '13, but if he does the Sabres get a lot of additional cap space (again, assuming the rules are similar to what they are today). Are you trying to state that he'll only be worth $3.8MM over the next 5 years of the deal? I'm really not understanding what the complaint is. Are you now opposed to making the rules work for the Sabres?
Jerry Jabber Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 All I can say is "WOW!!!!" I can't believe Ehrhoff got a 10 year deal at those prices. I know he's getting a nice signing bonus, but that is truly some great work by Regier. First, the length of the contract, is Ehrhoff's 10 year contract the longest in modern Sabres history? Second, the amount Ehrhoff will be getting, puts the Sabres in great position to be under the salary cap to get more UFA's. So far, this is wiping out the horrible off season of years past. Thank you Mr. Pegula for this!! :worthy: :clapping: :thumbsup:
nfreeman Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 I think Darcy put the structure of this deal in place, but this absolutely smells of Pegula playing with the big boys. I can't believe I'm a Sabres fan. It's like we are the Red Wings or Flyers. This is so much fun. Ah, yes. This very specifically follows the salary cap rules set forth by the league after the kovalchuk debacle. No years after he turns 40 and the 36-39 year old rule only applies to contracts that average more than $5.75M. And those rules were part of a legally binding settlement, so there is nothing anyone can do. Good info, and reported timely. Thanks. Now that's "Hockey Heaven" to a player. No other team in the league would be willing to pony up $18mil over the next two season for Errhoff. Perhaps, but quite a few would have been happy to pony up $5.5MM x 6 years, which as stated below is what the deal really is. I sure hope Ehrhoff is good. I know he must be because there are already 27 pages on him, but I can honestly say that I have absolutely no opinion of him. I can't remember ever having seen him on the ice. I know I have, but I can't remember it. Well, he was a top pairing defenseman, with 50 pts and 28 PP pts, for the team with the best offense, defense and PP in the league. He was second on the team in ice time and 2nd among their defensemen in PP ice time. No one should kid himself -- he's not as good as Pronger, Chara, Lidstrom, etc. But he's much better than Tallinder, he knows how to play the game at both ends and he can play plenty of minutes. I think he'll be partnered with Myers and will be a mainstay on the top PP unit. between the contracts and the amerks and the renovations, he might end up losing like 30 million next year. He can only do that for like 100 more seasons, then he'll be out of cash. 5% interest on his $3B alone is $150M annually... he'll be fine for a long time Good call DD. How much money does he pocket over the next two years? Completely irrelevant since he's going to play quite a bit more than 2 years. Of course it was. They had to make it a sweet deal to keep him from waiting to see what other offers would come in on Friday. Good call.
biodork Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Ah, yes. Good info, and reported timely. Thanks. Perhaps, but quite a few would have been happy to pony up $5.5MM x 6 years, which as stated below is what the deal really is. Well, he was a top pairing defenseman, with 50 pts and 28 PP pts, for the team with the best offense, defense and PP in the league. He was second on the team in ice time and 2nd among their defensemen in PP ice time. No one should kid himself -- he's not as good as Pronger, Chara, Lidstrom, etc. But he's much better than Tallinder, he knows how to play the game at both ends and he can play plenty of minutes. I think he'll be partnered with Myers and will be a mainstay on the top PP unit. Good call DD. Completely irrelevant since he's going to play quite a bit more than 2 years. Good call. I missed your recap-style posts, nfreeman... good to have you back. :thumbsup: Man, I left my computer around 3pm or so and still can't believe the Sabres' (Sabres's?) fortunes... somebody pinch me! Really regretting having made lunch plans for tomorrow, but I scheduled a month ago and it's too late to cancel. I have to remember to put my phone on silent for when my phone explodes with text updates from WGR.
nfreeman Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 I missed your recap-style posts, nfreeman... good to have you back. :thumbsup: Man, I left my computer around 3pm or so and still can't believe the Sabres' (Sabres's?) fortunes... somebody pinch me! Really regretting having made lunch plans for tomorrow, but I scheduled a month ago and it's too late to cancel. I have to remember to put my phone on silent for when my phone explodes with text updates from WGR. Thanks! Pretty good week to be a Sabres fan...and to be posting on this esteemed board.
carpandean Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Interesting note: Ehrhoff and Vanek have/had the same combined salary/bonus during their first two respective seasons: Vanek: $5M salary/$5M bonus in year one, $5M salary/$3M bonus in year two Ehrhoff: $2M salary/$8M bonus in year one, $3M salary/$5M bonus in year two
SwampD Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 You missed the point. I'm not complaining. I'm just saying the $18 mil over two years is a big reason Ehroff signed. That's actually not true. As per Bill Hoppe, he agreed to come to Buffalo before he knew the terms (obviously he would not come if they were ridiculous, though).
frissonic Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Holy crap today was fun. :clapping: LOVE the avatar!!! ha ha ha ha ha!!!!
Two or less Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 You missed the point. I'm not complaining. I'm just saying the $18 mil over two years is a big reason Ehroff signed. That's the way he wanted his money, because he's smart. In the new CBA, there may be rollbacks and he wont be as effected. However, it's been said he was sold on Buffalo before Darcy and his agent even discussed any amount of salary. He was sold on the city and the teams commitment to win the cup, all we had to do is figure out how to dish out the money to seal the deal. You will see many deals that are front loaded, like the Marian Hossa deal, because agents are protecting players from the rollbacks that surly are coming in the new CBA. Teams WOULD have paid Ehrhoff $18 mil for first 2 years.
Cereal Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Man, this was great to come home to! I love this: "My goal is to win the Stanley Cup, and after the offer I received from Buffalo, I believe this is the best place to make it happen." -Christian Ehrhoff between the contracts and the amerks and the renovations, he might end up losing like 30 million next year. He can only do that for like 100 more seasons, then he'll be out of cash. :D It is circumvention of the real idea behind the cap, but it's not on an egregious level like Kovy's contract was. That contract had 10 years at an average of $9.5M, but used seven years, going until he would be 44, to get that hit down to $6M. Ehrhoff's contract is basically a 6 x $5.5M contract with four years added, taking him to about 39, to get it down to $4M. So, instead of using extra years that he won't likely play to get 10 yrs of $9.5M reduced by $3.5M per year, they're using extra years that he will possibly play to get 6 years of $5.5M down by $1.5M per year. Big difference. They re-wrote the rules and this doesn't violate any of them. I have a feeling that this contract will be "yesterday's news" (literally) when the terms of Richard's contract come out. Of course, if it is the Sabres, then the combination might cause some uproar. :clapping: Amidst all the excitement, I HAVE been thinking a bit about Myers' getting signed. (Is there not a thread about it yet..?) Boyes, Hecht, Goose, and Morrrrissssonnnnn are our big UFA's a year from now, freeing up $11.5M in salary (not sure about capspace, actually). Anyway, I am thinking, maybe they have told Myers that they will discuss his contract after he shows up for camp in the fall? Maybe work something out with him in October or November after pushing him to earn it by coming back to camp ready to go? Thoughts?
Kristian Posted July 1, 2011 Report Posted July 1, 2011 Well, so far I'll have to say Darcy looked at our blueline in the Philly series and decided it just wasnm't good enough. Props for adressing the problem, swiftly and effectively. I'll probably wake up tomorrow to see Larry explain why we signed Rory Fitzpatrick instead.
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