The Bottom Line

[thesportsbuff]

Vanek gets paid more than Briere and Richards and isn't half the player, or half the leader that they are. Never will be. #RealTalk

[K-9]

Vanek gets paid more than Briere and Richards and isn't half the player, or half the leader that they are. Never will be. #RealTalk

 

Next.

 

GO SABRES!!!

[carpandean]

Actually, both get paid as much or more (Richards was same this year, but will be more next year; Briere was/will be more in both), but he does have the higher cap hit. That didn't matter to the Sabres this year (they had several million free), but will mean more going forward.

[shrader]

Actually, both get paid as much or more (Richards was same this year, but will be more next year; Briere was/will be more in both), but he does have the higher cap hit. That didn't matter to the Sabres this year (they had several million free), but will mean more going forward.

 

But let's not let facts get in the way of starting yet another thread on this board.

[thesportsbuff]

Actually, both get paid as much or more (Richards was same this year, but will be more next year; Briere was/will be more in both), but he does have the higher cap hit. That didn't matter to the Sabres this year (they had several million free), but will mean more going forward.

 

It mattered this year. Not in term of salary but that Vanek was STILL inexplicably depended on to be a leader. I don't care if he gets 30 tap in goals a year, he's no where near the level of Briere and Richards, and they're nowhere near the level of a Crosby or Toews... so that's how far away we are from having an actual star on the team.

[carpandean]

My point was more of clarification than a counterargument. This year, as far as the Sabres were concerned, salary was the limiting factor; next year, cap may be the limitation.

 

Your point is an arguably valid part of a bigger argument. Teams can only have a limited number of big-$ contracts. Miller, Vanek, and to a lesser extent Pominville are the Sabres' at this point. That's $18M+ (about 30% of next year's expected cap) in three players, each of which there are questions about. Some teams (e.g., Chicago, Pittsburgh) have benefited from a string of bad seasons to get top quality players in those slots through high draft picks. Others have found them through good draft choices (e.g., Richard at 24th or half of Detroit's roster.) The Sabres have relied and/or will have to rely on the latter or good trades to get theirs. Your question about whether Vanek (similar questions have been raised for Pommer and Miller, too) should be one of those guys is valid.

[Knightrider]

Let's try this again.

[LGR4GM]

If Vanek was traded... I could live with that.

PS> miller was the reason this series went to game 7 so I was right about the miller hating starting woot woot!

 

now off for vacation have fun see you guys around july

[Punch]

We all know Vanek's contract is a result of the front office being backed into a corner after the 6/1/07 fiasco. I like Vanek a lot, perhaps even love--- but he's probably not "worth" that contract. How many players are? A large swath of Flyers' fans complained about Briere being overpaid before last year's postseason, too.

 

Vanek can excel with a better supporting cast, but his contract makes building that cast much more difficult. Hopefully the Sabres can be creative in rebuilding the forward group under the cap.

 

Definitely not bashing Vanek--- I'm glad he's a Sabre. I only wish had been locked up prior to the end of 2006-07...and not only him.

[deluca67]

We all know Vanek's contract is a result of the front office being backed into a corner after the 6/1/07 fiasco. I like Vanek a lot, perhaps even love--- but he's probably not "worth" that contract. How many players are? A large swath of Flyers' fans complained about Briere being overpaid before last year's postseason, too.

Vanek can excel with a better supporting cast, but his contract makes building that cast much more difficult. Hopefully the Sabres can be creative in rebuilding the forward group under the cap.

 

Definitely not bashing Vanek--- I'm glad he's a Sabre. I only wish had been locked up prior to the end of 2006-07...and not only him.

Vanek's best role may is as the supporting cast. He is not a #1 go to guy. He is a talented goal scorer that rarely dominates games. This team needs that go to guy.

[DumbPuck]

Vanek's best role may is as the supporting cast. He is not a #1 go to guy. He is a talented goal scorer that rarely dominates games. This team needs that go to guy.

 

 

I agree. How do other teams get their biggest goal scoring stars though? Are they bought? Are they raised through their farm-team systems? Are they drafted? Or is it a mix?

[nfreeman]

Vanek's best role may is as the supporting cast. He is not a #1 go to guy. He is a talented goal scorer that rarely dominates games. This team needs that go to guy.

 

This is where I am as well. Ideally, Vanek is your #3 forward on a killer top line, like a Heatley. In that role I think he could score in bunches.

[Punch]

Vanek's best role may is as the supporting cast. He is not a #1 go to guy. He is a talented goal scorer that rarely dominates games. This team needs that go to guy.

 

That's probably true. And when I say supporting cast I'm really just referring to the rest of the team in general, not that Vanek is the main man. I do think the more that Vanek matures it is possible he can become that guy, but he's not there yet.

[Campy]

Vanek is a talented player with good hands which he puts to good use around the net. My biggest gripe with him is that for a guy of decent size, he plays remarkably soft. I don't mean an unwillingness to go to the front of the net, he obviously does that. I mean that there's no aggression or edge to his game. If he had that, he'd be awesome...

[deluca67]

I agree. How do other teams get their biggest goal scoring stars though? Are they bought? Are they raised through their farm-team systems? Are they drafted? Or is it a mix?

It's all about timing and being able to recognize opportunities when they present themselves. That is a big criticism of Regier. He has been too busy writing love letters to his own players to seriously consider any of the top end talent that was made available over the past few seasons.

 

What may hurt the Sabres this off-season is a lack of top end quality talent being available.

[deluca67]

Vanek is a talented player with good hands which he puts to good use around the net. My biggest gripe with him is that for a guy of decent size, he plays remarkably soft. I don't mean an unwillingness to go to the front of the net, he obviously does that. I mean that there's no aggression or edge to his game. If he had that, he'd be awesome...

Great point! :clapping:

 

To stay with the comparison which the thread is based on, Richards and Briere are both willing to give a shot, legal or not, if need be. As much crap as Crosby takes he does have an edge to his game. I wish Vanek would be developing an edge similar to the edge Myers sees to be developing. Vanek is a big physical presence on the ice, I would hate to see him go the way of Paul Gaustad.

[shrader]

Vanek's best role may is as the supporting cast. He is not a #1 go to guy. He is a talented goal scorer that rarely dominates games. This team needs that go to guy.

 

Does it have to be just that one guy or can a pair combine to be that go to unit? Let's face it, there aren't enough of those #1 go to guys to go around the entire league. If they can find that right center who can consistently setup up Vanek, that's a combination I would love to have on this team and it could take them somewhere.

[Weave]

Great point! :clapping:

 

To stay with the comparison which the thread is based on, Richards and Briere are both willing to give a shot, legal or not, if need be. As much crap as Crosby takes he does have an edge to his game. I wish Vanek would be developing an edge similar to the edge Myers sees to be developing. Vanek is a big physical presence on the ice, I would hate to see him go the way of Paul Gaustad.

 

 

Thank you. This is the point that's sticking in my craw right now. Noone has shown the desire to do what needs to be done, morality set aside. Vanek is a big guy with a tabby cat personality. I think he can be a star. But it'll need to be on a line with a guy or two that plays dirty when need be to make room and take the attention off of Vanek. I bet Vanek could be a real beast on Philly's team. He'd have lots of room and little attention paid to him.

[Knightrider]

Vanek's best role may is as the supporting cast. He is not a #1 go to guy. He is a talented goal scorer that rarely dominates games. This team needs that go to guy.

 

Yup. It seems like it is a mental thing for him. I'd love to just see him drop the gloves with someone.

 

Edit: should have read the whole thread, first.

[Derrico]

Vanek gets paid more than Briere and Richards and isn't half the player, or half the leader that they are. Never will be. #RealTalk

 

Come on sportsbuff you're better than this. Why is this thread called 'the bottom line'? Just trying to get more ppl looking at the thread? Not sure what Realtalk means either.

[Derrico]

Thank you. This is the point that's sticking in my craw right now. Noone has shown the desire to do what needs to be done, morality set aside. Vanek is a big guy with a tabby cat personality. I think he can be a star. But it'll need to be on a line with a guy or two that plays dirty when need be to make room and take the attention off of Vanek. I bet Vanek could be a real beast on Philly's team. He'd have lots of room and little attention paid to him.

 

Not sure what Tabby Cat personality means but the guy stands in front of the net and continually gets chopped at. Vanek's game is not going in the corners and throwing the big hit but he goes to the front of the net and takes on abuse. I admit I haven't read this whole thread but I'd defend Vanek's game over SEVERAL other players on the current roster.

[PromoTheRobot]

Vanek gets paid more than Briere and Richards and isn't half the player, or half the leader that they are. Never will be. #RealTalk

You just blew up your own point. Briere AND Richards!! Vanek and ????? Maybe good teams need more than one player?

 

PTR

[Knightrider]

FWIW, Ennis and Gerbe certainly seem to have that edge. Stafford shows flashes, and I suppose Roy has it, but that seems about it for the top 6.

[Sabre_fan_from_SriLanka]

It's all about timing and being able to recognize opportunities when they present themselves. That is a big criticism of Regier. He has been too busy writing love letters to his own players to seriously consider any of the top end talent that was made available over the past few seasons.

 

What may hurt the Sabres this off-season is a lack of top end quality talent being available.

 

Pegula had stated that he's increasing the budget on scouting - so maybe that will help the Sabres get better talent from all over....just a thought. Yea it def. does look slim when it comes to quality talent being available in FA this yr. Maybe we can pull a great trade.

[Sabre_fan_from_SriLanka]

What about trading Miller + draft pick to the Stars for Brad Richards? I know Miller is a big time goalie, but what if the Sabres go the route of getting some good D and some leadership into the team - wouldn't that take them further than a superstar goalie?