Good whisky/whiskey

[biodork]

While in the Watkins Glen area last week I also had a chance to get back to Finger Lakes Distilling. My mom and I did a tasting, and I decided to give the whiskeys a try:

 

Glen Thunder

McKenzie Pure Pot Still Whiskey

McKenzie Bourbon Whiskey

 

The first two were pretty smooth, but not terribly complicated. Another taster compared the Pot Still to Tullamore Dew, which I haven't yet tried. The Bourbon was a little hotter, but I liked the flavor better so I took a bottle home.

 

Also picked up a bottle of Eagle Rare 10 year old at the store last night and tried that tonight. With just a few drops of water, this was very enjoyable to sip. I thought the name sounded familiar, and after looking online I had forgotten it's bottled by the Buffalo Trace Distillery. Good stuff.

[nfreeman]

Here's something on this: I've never particularly liked Glenlivet 12-year-old -- always thought it didn't have enough body. I recently tried Glenlivet 18-year-old and the difference is a very pleasant surprise. It's rich, smooth and very mellow. Not particularly smoky or peaty, if that's your cup of tea, but I'm really enjoying this bottle.

 

It sure would be nice to have one some night while watching a Sabres game.

[Weave]

While in the Watkins Glen area last week I also had a chance to get back to Finger Lakes Distilling. My mom and I did a tasting, and I decided to give the whiskeys a try:

 

Glen Thunder

McKenzie Pure Pot Still Whiskey

McKenzie Bourbon Whiskey

 

The first two were pretty smooth, but not terribly complicated. Another taster compared the Pot Still to Tullamore Dew, which I haven't yet tried. The Bourbon was a little hotter, but I liked the flavor better so I took a bottle home.

 

Also picked up a bottle of Eagle Rare 10 year old at the store last night and tried that tonight. With just a few drops of water, this was very enjoyable to sip. I thought the name sounded familiar, and after looking online I had forgotten it's bottled by the Buffalo Trace Distillery. Good stuff.

 

Bio, what did they hit you for the McKenzie bourbon? Last time I was there they had the Thunder and Rye. I thought Thunder had promise but I have no idea what I would do with an entire bottle of corn whiskey. The rye was just OK. It was a bit "green" and seemed like it needed more time in barrel. And a bit hot. I would have bought a bottle anyway, but it was like $45/750ml. I can get some damned fine bourbon/rye for $45 that has plenty of age on it and lots of complexity.

 

Here is a pretty decent blog I read often, the latest issue is reviewing McKenzie's stuff. It is sort of back-handed praise but it pretty much matches my impressions from last year. http://www.recenteats.blogspot.com/2012/09/craft-whiskey-week-mckenzie-bourbon-rye.html

[biodork]

Bio, what did they hit you for the McKenzie bourbon? Last time I was there they had the Thunder and Rye. I thought Thunder had promise but I have no idea what I would do with an entire bottle of corn whiskey. The rye was just OK. It was a bit "green" and seemed like it needed more time in barrel. And a bit hot. I would have bought a bottle anyway, but it was like $45/750ml. I can get some damned fine bourbon/rye for $45 that has plenty of age on it and lots of complexity.

 

Here is a pretty decent blog I read often, the latest issue is reviewing McKenzie's stuff. It is sort of back-handed praise but it pretty much matches my impressions from last year. http://www.recenteat...ourbon-rye.html

 

Thanks for the blog link. Your memory is correct on the pricing, too ($45 for 750 ml)... I debated since I liked but didn't love it, but I figured it'd something I can't get around here and I can work with it at home. Probably better for mixing than sipping, but that's fine, too. I'm actually happier with the Eagle Rare, which was surprisingly inexpensive (I think it was $23 on sale, but maybe normally only $27 or so?). The Finger Lakes Distilling email newsletter recently had a bit on the small vs. large barrel debate... I tried to find a link for the newsletter but only located older ones, so apologies for the long copy and paste:

 

Recently, Buffalo Trace Distillery released their outcomes from an experiment; Can quality whiskey be aged in small, 10 gallon barrels in only 6 years? The end result was deemed unsuccessful.

 

As you know, our whiskey does spend some time in small barrels. We would like to state our position on small barrel aging and share why, at FLD, we think this approach can work. A New York Times article recently stated that Finger Lakes Distilling was an exception to typical small barrel aged whiskey.

 

There are 4 key steps we take when adding our whiskey spirits to small barrels.

First, unlike many other micro distilleries, we make old fashioned style sour mash bourbon and rye whiskeys. This process uses some of the spent grains from the previous whiskey run and adds it to the next. We also use high quality, locally-grown grains for our mash. We only use barley malt for our starch conversions, not commercial enzymes. We feel these steps give the whiskey a great flavor to start and an even more delicious end product.

 

Second, we distill the mash at a lower proof, allowing for more flavors of the mash to pass through to the "white dog". If you distill the mash at a higher proof, all the flavor escapes. We want to keep as much character of our tasty, local grain as possible. This allows for more intense flavors to enter the barrel.

 

Then, we add distilled water to the McKenzie Rye and Bourbon to lower to 100 proof before putting them into 10 gallon barrels. We believe a higher percentage of water in the whiskey allows it to absorb a different range of flavors from the wood (think vanilla, toffee, maple, etc). Our barrel proof is more in line with what the commercial distillers did 25-30 years ago.

 

Contrary to the Buffalo Trace experiment, we never age in 10 gallon barrels for more than 2 years. Leaving the whiskey in the small barrels for extended aging will result in bitter, overly-tannic flavors. We also finish our whiskeys in larger barrels for 30-45 days before bottling. The larger barrel allows for greater oxidation of the whiskey. Oxidation is important to allow the spirit to mellow and develop into the flavors you have come to recognize in bourbon and rye. Another thing to note, is that our small barrels are made from premium air dried and aged wood. We also use different char levels in our barrels than in the study, that work better for us.

 

What does the future hold for our barrel aged products? While we are very proud of the whiskey we are pulling out of the 10 gallon barrels, we are even more excited for what is expected from additional aging in standard size barrels. We will begin bottling from our 53 gallon barrels exclusively in the next 6-12 months. For over 3 years we have been aging rye, bourbon and a wheated bourbon in standard whiskey barrels made from the same wood as our 10 gallon casks. All are showing fine flavors, similar to our whiskey currently on the market.

 

Will small barrel aging replace aging in larger barrels? Not likely. Does small barrel aging have it's place? You bet it does. Just ask the whiskey drinkers that are visiting FLD, and the bartenders in the high-end bars and restaurants that are utilizing our products. Many of our guests and fans will agree that we are creating some fine McKenzie whiskey! But that is not to say it is the barrel alone that makes a great product, we believe it is our hand-crafted process that makes all the difference.

 

At FLD, we believe the proof is in the whiskey!

[Weave]

Thanks for the blog link. Your memory is correct on the pricing, too ($45 for 750 ml)... I debated since I liked but didn't love it, but I figured it'd something I can't get around here and I can work with it at home. Probably better for mixing than sipping, but that's fine, too. I'm actually happier with the Eagle Rare, which was surprisingly inexpensive (I think it was $23 on sale, but maybe normally only $27 or so?). The Finger Lakes Distilling email newsletter recently had a bit on the small vs. large barrel debate... I tried to find a link for the newsletter but only located older ones, so apologies for the long copy and paste:

 

Interesting response by FLD.

 

I read the full release of that experiment by Buffalo Trace about a week ago. It is posted somewhere on Straightbourbon.com. I guess my only thought is, among the bourbon drinkers I know the opinion was near unanimous, they all wanted the FLD stuff to be better. And micro distilled whiskey seems to have a common flavor component that isn't appreciated by many. Common denominator? Small barrels is one.

 

Bio, you may be right about that bottle being good for mixers. An Old Fashioned or Julep may be just the ticket.

 

Oh, and the Eagle Rare, I bought a bottle for a good friend for his birthday. He says he really enjoys it. Heavy on the caramel according to him. I'm hoping he returns the favor soon. :angel:

Edited September 20, 2012 by weave

[biodork]

 

 

Interesting response by FLD.

 

I read the full release of that experiment by Buffalo Trace about a week ago. It is posted somewhere on Straightbourbon.com. I guess my only thought is, among the bourbon drinkers I know the opinion was near unanimous, they all wanted the FLD stuff to be better. And micro distilled whiskey seems to have a common flavor component that isn't appreciated by many. Common denominator? Small barrels is one.

 

Bio, you may be right about that bottle being good for mixers. An Old Fashioned or Julep may be just the ticket.

 

Oh, and the Eagle Rare, I bought a bottle for a good friend for his birthday. He says he really enjoys it. Heavy on the caramel according to him. I'm hoping he returns the favor soon. :angel:

 

I respect FLD for being able to argue their position, but you (and everyone else) are probably right that their whiskey will improve once they've been around long enough to age longer and in larger barrels. Their vodka and fruit liquors are quite good, so it seems they use quality ingredients and techniques and just need more time to perfect their whiskeys.

 

Funny you mentioned the Julep... I never had gotten around to trying one, but now that my mint plant is done for the season I was thinking Manhattan and picked up sweet vermouth and bitters on the way home. Looks like I can put the bitters to use in an Old Fashioned, too. Good idea!

[Weave]

Yet another new pour for me today. Tonight I was introduced to Bowmam Brothers Straight Virginia Bourbon. Had a very sweet, caramelly nose. It was a touch hot, but still smooth. Initially sweet on the tongue but had a cinnamon-pepper finish. Not overly complicated, but a nice pour overall. Old school hard candy and spice. Interesting sample if you get a chance to try it.

[spndnchz]

Yet another new pour for me today. Tonight I was introduced to Bowmam Brothers Straight Virginia Bourbon. Had a very sweet, caramelly nose. It was a touch hot, but still smooth. Initially sweet on the tongue but had a cinnamon-pepper finish. Not overly complicated, but a nice pour overall. Old school hard candy and spice. Interesting sample if you get a chance to try it.

 

Have you tried joining a scotch club at a local liquor store?

[Eleven]

Have you tried joining a scotch club at a local liquor store?

 

That won't help him with bourbon.

[Weave]

Have you tried joining a scotch club at a local liquor store?

 

I live in a small community in a predominately rural area. I am fortunate to even have a local bar with a decent bourbon selection. the liquor stores in town are small and have little selection. Fortunately one of them is willing to order bottles that they don't stock.

 

That won't help him with bourbon.

 

LOL

 

There is this too. I am dabbling in whisky but my preference still runs towards bourbon and rye.

[That Aud Smell]

And rye makes a fantastic Manhattan too.

I've heard alot about Templeton Rye.

the tattooed kid made me a manhattan with something called redemption rye. i assumed it was canadian. turns out it's made in indiana from 95% rye. zoinks. with rye content that high, i assume that it's meant to be a mixer only. the drink was outstanding.

Sweet, I'm a fan of ryes. I'm a bit of a wimp with straight liqour, but Canadiens/ryes are very smooth even to me.

There is this too. I am dabbling in whisky but my preference still runs towards bourbon and rye.

 

pardon the long multiquote. with the weather turning, i have a renewed interest in sampling a couple of true ryes -- not the canadian blend varietals (good though they are, they aren't really even ryes, evidently (well, at least not any more)).

 

any recommendations? full disclosure: i work on a budget when it comes to spirits -- i.e., there's not a ton of discretionary coin for me to throw at this stuff -- so i appreciate any reco's being in the entry-level/moderate price ranges (not well-drink level, mind you -- but on par with a bottle of standard wedding top shelf stuff (crown, etc.)).

[Weave]

TAS, see if you can find Russel's Reserve Rye (not their bourbon). Sometimes you can find it at Premiere. It is almost always in my cabinet and is usually under 35 bucks a 750. Sometimes you can find it under 30.

[darksabre]

If you're on a budget, there's no beating Old Overholt Rye.

 

Also, Bulleit Rye is pretty tasty, if not a little too raw.

[Eleven]

If you're on a budget, there's no beating Old Overholt Rye.

 

Also, Bulleit Rye is pretty tasty, if not a little too raw.

 

Bulleit is wholly underrated. Fortunately, it's also underpriced.

[Weave]

Rittenhouse is another good value rye, but harder to find.

[That Aud Smell]

TAS, see if you can find Russel's Reserve Rye

If you're on a budget, there's no beating Old Overholt Rye.

 

Also, Bulleit Rye is pretty tasty, if not a little too raw.

Bulleit is wholly underrated. Fortunately, it's also underpriced.

Rittenhouse is another good value rye, but harder to find.

 

thanks, all.

[biodork]

Maybe a little pricier than you're looking for, Aud, but what about Sazerac? Saw this in an email newsletter from the PLCB, and the description sounds good:

 

 

Sazerac Rye Straight Bourbon 18 Years Old

 

Price $59.99

 

"Amber chestnut color. Huge, spicy aroma. Very mature, with notes of oak, leather, and molasses. Enormous in every respect, from its thick, chewy texture to its unbelievably spicy and very powerful flavors. The long, warm finish is preceded by notes of mint, eucalyptus, cinnamon, vanilla, molasses, oak, leather, and lingering pepper."

-Distiller's Notes

 

"This is an amazing, truly unique whiskey. There is no rye whiskey on the market that is as old or perfectly balanced as this one. For all who can't get enough flavors and intensity in your whiskey, your search has ended."

--Malt Advocate Magazine

[Weave]

Maybe a little pricier than you're looking for, Aud, but what about Sazerac? Saw this in an email newsletter from the PLCB, and the description sounds good:

 

 

Sazerac Rye Straight Bourbon 18 Years Old

 

Price $59.99

 

"Amber chestnut color. Huge, spicy aroma. Very mature, with notes of oak, leather, and molasses. Enormous in every respect, from its thick, chewy texture to its unbelievably spicy and very powerful flavors. The long, warm finish is preceded by notes of mint, eucalyptus, cinnamon, vanilla, molasses, oak, leather, and lingering pepper."

-Distiller's Notes

 

"This is an amazing, truly unique whiskey. There is no rye whiskey on the market that is as old or perfectly balanced as this one. For all who can't get enough flavors and intensity in your whiskey, your search has ended."

--Malt Advocate Magazine

 

Sazerac rye is awesome stuff. They make two bottlings with the Sazerac label, the one you mention is the older and pricier of the two, but there is another refered to casually as Baby Saz, it retails closer to $35 and is also excellent stuff. Not as complex and nuanced as the older Saz but it is the same recipe with less barrel time. I highly recommend either if they are in your budget.

 

ETA- I'm still looking to replace my empty bottle of Baby Saz but I can't find it anywhere.

Edited September 25, 2012 by weave

[biodork]

Sazerac rye is awesome stuff. They make two bottlings with the Sazerac label, the one you mention is the older and pricier of the two, but there is another refered to casually as Baby Saz, it retails closer to $35 and is also excellent stuff. Not as complex and nuanced as the older Saz but it is the same recipe with less barrel time. I highly recommend either if they are in your budget.

 

ETA- I'm still looking to replace my empty bottle of Baby Saz but I can't find it anywhere.

 

Good to know; I'll keep an eye out for that one. After searching back a bit, I see why Sazerac and Eagle Rare sounded familiar... you and MattPie had each mentioned them back in January! Hard to believe this thread has been going since April 2011. Well done, gentlemen. (Now if only we could get Braedon back in here!)

[darksabre]

I went to the new Whitehouse Liquor store next to Wegmans in Henrietta and they had two Rye brands I'd never seen at other stores, Ri (http://cocktails.about.com/od/whiskeyreviews/gr/rione_whiskey.htm), WhistlePig (which was sold out)(http://cocktails.about.com/od/whiskeyreviews/fr/Whistlepig-Rye-Whiskey.htm).

[Weave]

I went to the new Whitehouse Liquor store next to Wegmans in Henrietta and they had two Rye brands I'd never seen at other stores, Ri (http://cocktails.abo...one_whiskey.htm), WhistlePig (which was sold out)(http://cocktails.abo...Rye-Whiskey.htm).

 

I've seen Ri around but have yet to sample it. I'm dimly aware of Whistlepig but never seen it on a shelf. Whistlepig sounds very interesting. Not very many 100% ryes around.

 

I get into the Henrietta area now and again (McGregor's is the main draw for me, shopping for the wife), I'll have to make a point of stopping into Whitehouse and snoop around. When we make booze runs we usually head into Brockport.

[darksabre]

I've seen Ri around but have yet to sample it. I'm dimly aware of Whistlepig but never seen it on a shelf. Whistlepig sounds very interesting. Not very many 100% ryes around.

 

I get into the Henrietta area now and again (McGregor's is the main draw for me, shopping for the wife), I'll have to make a point of stopping into Whitehouse and snoop around. When we make booze runs we usually head into Brockport.

 

Whitehouse is definitely an interesting feel. It's almost warehouse-y in its layout. Very minimalist. Much more wine than liquor. I bought a bottle of Kraken Rum last night for like $18 though so the prices are right. The benefit of having Wegmans as your benefactor.

 

I just hope it doesn't put Discount Liquor out of business in that same plaza. I like the owner and they stock bigger bottles of Russian Standard. :P

[Weave]

Tonight's pour is WL Weller 12 year. I've been through several bottles of Weller Special Reserve and Weller Antique, but the 12 year is new to me. Soft and easy on the palate like its brothers, but much more interesting finish than the Special Reserve. A touch too sweet, but more like simple sugar than big caramel notes like some older bourbons get, good vanilla notes without being overpowering. A bit of fruit on the finish as well. Smooth as silk. Really nice pour but could use the heat and spice of a higher bottling proof.

 

Overall, I prefer Weller Antique but this was a nice pour. And Premier is selling it for $22/750mL. Hard to improve upon it at that price.

[Weave]

I cannot believe I have gone this long without trying an Old Fashioned.

 

2oz bourbon

1 Marachino Cherry

1 Orange slice

1 Tbls sugar

Top off w/ Seltzer

Muddle the cherry, orange, and sugar. Add bourbon and ice. Top w/ seltzer.

 

OMFG so tasty. I ordered mine with Buffalo Trace. Absolutely delicious. I may never have another Manhattan again. Old Fashioned is feaking delicious.

Edited November 3, 2012 by weave

[biodork]

I cannot believe I have gone this long without trying an Old Fashioned.

 

2oz bourbon

1 Marachino Cherry

1 Orange slice

1 Tbls sugar

Top off w/ Seltzer

Muddle the cherry, orange, and sugar. Add bourbon and ice. Top w/ seltzer.

 

OMFG so tasty. I ordered mine with Buffalo Trace. Absolutely delicious. I may never have another Manhattan again. Old Fashioned is feaking delicious.

 

Lol wait a minute... You expect me to believe that you, bourbon afficionado that you are, hadn't tried an Old Fashioned prior to tonight? (And dammit; I knew there was a reason I meant to get oranges at the store yesterday!) I gotta get back to whisky... being in the Caribbean has put me on a rum kick.