wjag Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 he snapped the player's stick like a twig. that call is automatic. I had no problem with the call. It couldn't have been more obvious or blantant.
PromoTheRobot Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 The king of hyperbole has spoken W I'm not the guy suggesting we trade Miller after one game by a call-up goalie. Obviously you suffered some unfortunate head trauma that caused you to lose your short term memory. PTR
X. Benedict Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 I doubt NHL GMs overvalue Miller the way Sabre fans tend to do, but still Miller could be a big piece of the puzzle as the Sabres try to find that elusive number one center of top pair defenseman. Sure, there will be a learning curve with Enroth, but if he's the starter, he and the other youngsters can grow together. Miller's the annoying 30-something guy who's hanging around college parties too long. Boy, this tune plays in your jukebox alot. Most GM's would love to have a franchise goaltender. How much is that worth? (Just being rhetorical, you don't need to answer).
Eleven Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 he snapped the player's stick like a twig. that call is automatic. Did he? Looked to me like he got tied up with the guy and couldn't get out. I didn't see the stick snap and did not see a replay.
shrader Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 5) Enroth is a RFA so we are probably spending a bit more than his 866k salary next year, which will impact our cap. He hasn't spent enough time at the NHL level to bring on too much of a raise. He could be a prime candidate for being one of the guys that accepts is qualifying offer (a 5% raise). Since we're running with the Schneider example in this thread today, I'll continue with it as they are a good comparison career-wise. After his entry level deal expired last year, he signed a 2 year deal that was actually cheaper than his entry level deal. Enroth is not going to be an expensive signing at all, $1 million tops.
will Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Did he? Looked to me like he got tied up with the guy and couldn't get out. I didn't see the stick snap and did not see a replay. yeah, the player immediately put his hands up like "wtf?" and then came the whistle. it didn't look like much, but when a broken twig is the result, there's really no leverage for the ref.
Weave Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 I'm not the guy suggesting we trade Miller after one game by a call-up goalie. Obviously you suffered some unfortunate head trauma that caused you to lose your short term memory. PTR You still haven't gotten the hang of that "context" thing, have you? Or did you conveniently miss the "for the right price" part?
Robviously Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 I wouldn't say it's time yet. We're at least one year premature on all of this. Enroth needs at least one full year at the NHL level before this discussion should be happening. This is probably right. I'm probably not ready to ask Enroth to play 60+ games in 2011-2012 and then lead us to the Cup. The best case scenario would be to let him spend all of next season with the Sabres and get a feel for the league with ~25 starts. I wish I had faith in Ruff to split the games 57/25 between Miller and Enroth. One more thing to consider is that Miller is 30 now. Unless he's a freak like Brodeur or Hasek, he'll be on the downside of his career when guys like Myers, Sekera, Ennis, Gerbe, Weber, Butler, etc. are hitting their prime. Those guys make up a lot of our core right now. Plus we have Foligno, Kassian, McNabb, etc. turning pro after this season and Luke Adam possibly on his way to AHL Rookie of the Year this year. Also, Vanek, Roy, and Pominville are 27, 27, and 28 now. So if you project all these guys out and maybe the best time for our team to win the Cup is 2013-2014 -- which would be when Enroth is hitting his prime and Miller is slowing down (probably). So if we're trying to win the Cup and not just be "good" from year to year, maybe we bet on Enroth and play the long game. Again, this is all speculation and everything hinges on Enroth actually being as good as he's been this season. Maybe the league will adjust and pick him to pieces. Maybe it will turn out he's not big or strong enough to handle 60 games a year and the playoffs. Or maybe the pressure of being a no.1 in the NHL gets to him. He's still far from a sure thing. I just hope the Sabres are thinking about all this stuff as part of their "sole reason for existence is to win the Stanley Cup." I don't want Regier on auto-pilot. Miller is good but there might be a better way to win a championship and I hope we're exploring that.
inkman Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Most GM's would love to have a franchise goaltender. I don't disagree with this sentiment, as most NHL GM's are dinosaurs, but how many franchise goalies have won a cup since 2003? Fluery, maybe? But it wasn't really him now was it. I'd like to see a forward thinking GM move Miller for a cheaper goalie and a skater is a difference maker. This line f thinking is completely independent of Enroths performance.
Stoner Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Boy, this tune plays in your jukebox alot. Most GM's would love to have a franchise goaltender. How much is that worth? (Just being rhetorical, you don't need to answer). Sorry, you're not going to convince me that Miller is great, elite or franchise. Or that you even need one of those to win a Cup. I hope you're right and Darcy can fleece someone.
Weave Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 I don't disagree with this sentiment, as most NHL GM's are dinosaurs, but how many franchise goalies have won a cup since 2003? Fluery, maybe? But it wasn't really him now was it. I'd like to see a forward thinking GM move Miller for a cheaper goalie and a skater is a difference maker. This line f thinking is completely independent of Enroths performance. BAG OF PUCKS !!!
That Aud Smell Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 I don't disagree with this sentiment, as most NHL GM's are dinosaurs, but how many franchise goalies have won a cup since 2003? Fluery, maybe? But it wasn't really him now was it. I'd like to see a forward thinking GM move Miller for a cheaper goalie and a skater is a difference maker. This line f thinking is completely independent of Enroths performance. Franchise Goalie? We don't need no ... not even sure who wrote the piece, but the linked CNN-SI.com article on playoff goaltending took the familiar trope for another spin, to wit: Exhibit B: No team in the post-dynasty era has won more championships than the Red Wings. But Ken Holland’s organizational philosophy hasn’t been based on acquiring the best goalie that money can buy. Rather, he’s been comfortable and successful with a good-to-very good netminder playing behind a strong, mobile defense corps, and it’s on the blueline where he chooses to spend his (or, more precisely, Mike Illitch’s) money.
Claude_Verret Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Boy, this tune plays in your jukebox alot. Most GM's would love to have a franchise goaltender. How much is that worth? (Just being rhetorical, you don't need to answer). It's spelled c.r.u.s.a.d.e.
shrader Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Franchise Goalie? We don't need no ... not even sure who wrote the piece, but the linked CNN-SI.com article on playoff goaltending took the familiar trope for another spin, to wit: Exhibit B: No team in the post-dynasty era has won more championships than the Red Wings. But Ken Holland’s organizational philosophy hasn’t been based on acquiring the best goalie that money can buy. Rather, he’s been comfortable and successful with a good-to-very good netminder playing behind a strong, mobile defense corps, and it’s on the blueline where he chooses to spend his (or, more precisely, Mike Illitch’s) money. There's one problem with that statement about Detroit. Earlier in their run of dominance, they definitely went out of their way to get high priced goalies. They brought in Cujo and Hasek at separate points. That idea may have changed, but it was there at one point. And read the description of Rask in the Boston recap. Can anyone say "WTF wave"?
Eleven Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 yeah, the player immediately put his hands up like "wtf?" and then came the whistle. it didn't look like much, but when a broken twig is the result, there's really no leverage for the ref. Did he put up his hands like wtf, or was it a wtf wave?
Stoner Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 It's spelled c.r.u.s.a.d.e. What's wrong with crusades? Pegula is on one, too, or at least says he is. Trading Miller is not that, uh, contrarian. Sorry.
X. Benedict Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Sorry, you're not going to convince me that Miller is great, elite or franchise. this much is apparent. I'm tempted to ask what you think franchise means. For me four hundred and some starts would be a starting point. but anyway, you just don't like him. Never have. Every week is a new opportunity to not like something about him. Stats won't help, examples won't help, nothing will convince you.. I think you've just said it.
Claude_Verret Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 What's wrong with crusades? Pegula is on one, too, or at least says he is. Trading Miller is not that, uh, contrarian. Sorry. From my perspective, it seems like most of the other anti-Miller folks here are approaching it from a cost benefit perspective. Advocating keeping the option of a trade open in order to improve the team while going with a cheaper option in goal. I don't necessarily agree with that line of thinking, but I understand it. You and a few others on the other hand seem to want Miller gone no matter what. Maybe thats not so contrarian of you in this case, but it is complete lunacy. Miller is a known commodity. If you polled NHL GM's and coaches I'd be shocked if even one believed that Ryan Miller couldn't land you a Stanley Cup. Whether or not you pay a premium for that known commodity is again subject to debate. Between Miller and Ruff there can't be one poster that's been here more than a few weeks that isn't completely aware of your stance on each of them, as your views on one or the other seems to find it's way into nearly every post. I don't know about here, but I know crusading violates the terms of service over on TSW, or at least it did at one point in time.
Stoner Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 From my perspective, it seems like most of the other anti-Miller folks here are approaching it from a cost benefit perspective. Advocating keeping the option of a trade open in order to improve the team while going with a cheaper option in goal. I don't necessarily agree with that line of thinking, but I understand it. You and a few others on the other hand seem to want Miller gone no matter what. Maybe thats not so contrarian of you in this case, but it is complete lunacy. Miller is a known commodity. If you polled NHL GM's and coaches I'd be shocked if even one believed that Ryan Miller couldn't land you a Stanley Cup. Whether or not you pay a premium for that known commodity is again subject to debate. Between Miller and Ruff there can't be one poster that's been here more than a few weeks that isn't completely aware of your stance on each of them, as your views on one or the other seems to find it's way into nearly every post. I don't know about here, but I know crusading violates the terms of service over on TSW, or at least it did at one point in time. Crusading! It's against the law! :D These boards wouldn't exist without it. Many have crusaded against Quinn. Connolly. Hell, half of the owner's posts are bashing Montador. Get real.
Stoner Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 this much is apparent. I'm tempted to ask what you think franchise means. For me four hundred and some starts would be a starting point. but anyway, you just don't like him. Never have. Every week is a new opportunity to not like something about him. Stats won't help, examples won't help, nothing will convince you.. I think you've just said it. You could convince me he's good to very good, but you wouldn't have to. Stats most certainly will not help. :) The dude is 24th and 23rd in GAA and save percentage -- not sure which. I looked it up today.
nfreeman Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 My 2 cents: 1. I've been on vacation since Friday and have missed the last 4 games. I'm in withdrawal. 2. The NHL.com highlights come in with great picture and sound quality. 3. While I am a Miller fan, I could see trading him for the right return. However, (i) it's highly unlikely the right return will be available in trade and (ii) there is NFW this will happen before we see a full season of Enroth in Buffalo. It's much more likely that Enroth will be dealt in a package (ideally with Pommer) for a true top-line forward. 4. Speaking of Enroth, I think DR deserves some credit for his general go-slow approach with developing the Sabres' young prospects. Ennis, Enroth, Gerbe and Weber all seem to have benefited from spending a good amount of time learning the trade in the AHL. I expect we'll see the same from Adam, Kassian and hopefully Foligno and Byron. 5. Hard to believe Morrisonn is healthy-scratched in favor of Gragnani. Still, give the Sabres credit for being flexible and not married to a guy they gave a FA contract to. 6. Prediction: the Sabres will finish #6 in the EC and meet Boston in the 1st round with payback on their minds.
K-9 Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Crusading! It's against the law! :D These boards wouldn't exist without it. Many have crusaded against Quinn. Connolly. Hell, half of the owner's posts are bashing Montador. Get real. Show me a post from Pegula bashing Montador. And, while you're at it, would you tell me under which moniker he posts? Gotta love that Pegs is a regular here at the ole' Aud Club. GO SABRES!!!
Stoner Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 this much is apparent. I'm tempted to ask what you think franchise means. For me four hundred and some starts would be a starting point. but anyway, you just don't like him. Never have. Every week is a new opportunity to not like something about him. Stats won't help, examples won't help, nothing will convince you.. I think you've just said it. Brodeur is franchise. Luongo is getting there. I'm sure rickshaw would say he's already there. Osgood? Hasek was one. Through either greatness or longevity, a franchise goalie is one who is seemingly irreplaceable, the face of the franchise in many cases. It's hard to imagine a team without its franchise goalie. Devils without Brodeur. There aren't many. Words have to have meaning. Miller might have been nearing it through the first half of last season. Then he regressed to his career standard. He has shown bursts of getting there this season and could still save his season with a great playoff run. Sorry, I can envision the Sabres without Miller. And being better for it.
nfreeman Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Brodeur is franchise. Luongo is getting there. I'm sure rickshaw would say he's already there. Osgood? Hasek was one. Through either greatness or longevity, a franchise goalie is one who is seemingly irreplaceable, the face of the franchise in many cases. It's hard to imagine a team without its franchise goalie. Devils without Brodeur. There aren't many. Words have to have meaning. Miller might have been nearing it through the first half of last season. Then he regressed to his career standard. He has shown bursts of getting there this season and could still save his season with a great playoff run. Sorry, I can envision the Sabres without Miller. And being better for it. Miller is better than Luongo now and for the duration of their careers.
wjag Posted March 31, 2011 Report Posted March 31, 2011 Miller is better than Luongo now and for the duration of their careers. Let's face them off in a seven game series and see what happens. Right now, on the big stage, it's Luongo 1, Miller 0 thanks to Sid.
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