bunomatic Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Anyone that will stand up and defend a team mate or pick a fight to try and change the momentum of a game for his team mates is a bigger man that most of us posters on this board. Its easy to pick apart a guy from the comfort of a keyboard and say he wasn't tough as a player or that he was on the receiving end in most of his fights. The only thing I'll ever say about Lindy as a hockey player is he was a bad skater but he made up for it in desire.
X. Benedict Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 A few you tube clips provide nothing more then anectdotal evidence. You referred to his fight record. Where is that recorded. I have no problem with the Montador comparisons. I have a problem with the last line in your first post. On a related note, I'm still trying to find a correlation where any Cup winner in recent memory other then Anaheim was knowm for its toughness. Probably not recent memory but Bruins in 78 were a tough team. Colorado was a feisty bunch in the mid-90's Lemieux, Simon, Deadmarsh. Detroit teams were certainly never built to fight.
tom webster Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Speaking of fights and Islander goalies http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/GARTH/CONNOLLY-RETURNS-DI-PIETRO-HAMMERED/6/33352
X. Benedict Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Anyone that will stand up and defend a team mate or pick a fight to try and change the momentum of a game for his team mates is a bigger man that most of us posters on this board. Its easy to pick apart a guy from the comfort of a keyboard and say he wasn't tough as a player or that he was on the receiving end in most of his fights. The only thing I'll ever say about Lindy as a hockey player is he was a bad skater but he made up for it in desire. He sorta looked like a chicken trying to fly at times. He never had a graceful stride.
SwampD Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 He sorta looked like a chicken trying to fly at times. He never had a graceful stride. Dare I say, like Gaustad?
tom webster Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Probably not recent memory but Bruins in 78 were a tough team. Colorado was a feisty bunch in the mid-90's Lemieux, Simon, Deadmarsh. Detroit teams were certainly never built to fight. While the Bruins were tough, they were also the highest scoring team of their time. No doubt Colorado had some grit, but again Forsberg and Sakic were more the story.
Weave Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 A few you tube clips provide nothing more then anectdotal evidence. You referred to his fight record. Where is that recorded. I have no problem with the Montador comparisons. I have a problem with the last line in your first post. On a related note, I'm still trying to find a correlation where any Cup winner in recent memory other then Anaheim was knowm for its toughness. What we have here, is a failure to communicate. When I said fight record I was referring to who he fought and when. And any "win/loss" record is going to be purely subjective, much like my assertion that Lindy's toughness rep is overblown. Subjective opinion. It ain't gonna be an argument you can win with data. I'm not basing my opinion on just a handful of vids. I watched Lindy play from a corner section of the oranges for about 6 of the 8 or so years he was in Buffalo. He was game. But he wasn't a badass by any stretch. For some reason his rep in Buffalo has become one of a genuine tough guy. I assume it is because the Sabres have had a dearth of tough guys over their history so Lindy stood out some.
X. Benedict Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 While the Bruins were tough, they were also the highest scoring team of their time. No doubt Colorado had some grit, but again Forsberg and Sakic were more the story. Absolutely.
tom webster Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 What we have here, is a failure to communicate. When I said fight record I was referring to who he fought and when. And any "win/loss" record is going to be purely subjective, much like my assertion that Lindy's toughness rep is overblown. Subjective opinion. It ain't gonna be an argument you can win with data. I'm not basing my opinion on just a handful of vids. I watched Lindy play from a corner section of the oranges for about 6 of the 8 or so years he was in Buffalo. He was game. But he wasn't a badass by any stretch. For some reason his rep in Buffalo has become one of a genuine tough guy. I assume it is because the Sabres have had a dearth of tough guys over their history so Lindy stood out some. Maybe we have a problem with semantics. If you consider genuine tough guy to be guys like Probert and Playfairt who other players feared, then you are right he wasn't that. I consider tough guy to be a guy who never backed down and was always willing to come to defense of a teammate. Hell, Keith Magnuson was the ultimate punching bag but I would include him in any list of all time tough guys.
X. Benedict Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Maybe we have a problem with semantics. If you consider genuine tough guy to be guys like Probert and Playfairt who other players feared, then you are right he wasn't that. I consider tough guy to be a guy who never backed down and was always willing to come to defense of a teammate. Hell, Keith Magnuson was the ultimate punching bag but I would include him in any list of all time tough guys. Lindy wasn't in the super-heavyweight division. But he did square off against a lot of tough guys, and always stuck up for teammates. It's all about showing up in my book, as well.
korab rules Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Maybe we have a problem with semantics. If you consider genuine tough guy to be guys like Probert and Playfairt who other players feared, then you are right he wasn't that. I consider tough guy to be a guy who never backed down and was always willing to come to defense of a teammate. Hell, Keith Magnuson was the ultimate punching bag but I would include him in any list of all time tough guys. Now we are getting somewhere! My definition is the same as yours, TW. Ruff was not a goon, or a legit heavyweigt fighter, but he was plenty tough.
Eleven Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Who the hell said he did? He stood up to him; he didn't fight him. Smith had no interest in actually fighting; he was a Kaleta in goalie pads.
Weave Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Maybe we have a problem with semantics. If you consider genuine tough guy to be guys like Probert and Playfairt who other players feared, then you are right he wasn't that. I consider tough guy to be a guy who never backed down and was always willing to come to defense of a teammate. Hell, Keith Magnuson was the ultimate punching bag but I would include him in any list of all time tough guys. Agreed. Dammit. If we agree then we can't argue about it. :wallbash:
nfreeman Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 Maybe we have a problem with semantics. If you consider genuine tough guy to be guys like Probert and Playfairt who other players feared, then you are right he wasn't that. I consider tough guy to be a guy who never backed down and was always willing to come to defense of a teammate. Hell, Keith Magnuson was the ultimate punching bag but I would include him in any list of all time tough guys. Lindy wasn't in the super-heavyweight division. But he did square off against a lot of tough guys, and always stuck up for teammates. It's all about showing up in my book, as well. Now we are getting somewhere! My definition is the same as yours, TW. Ruff was not a goon, or a legit heavyweigt fighter, but he was plenty tough. These are spot on.
Sabre Dance Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 I hate Bill Smith always did than and still now. Same here, but I wish Ryan Miller would take a few lessons from Smith regarding protecting the crease for himself. Nobody crowded Smith like they do Miller. He had all kinds of little tricks, like chopping the ankles of opposing forwards. Of course, the butt end that he delivered to Lindy was over the line (if you notice, Smith had the knob of tape on the end of his stick that was prescribed by the rules, but it was located about an inch lower than the end of the stick. This left the hard, wooden end protruding. When this incident occurred with Ruff, I was afraid that Smith may have actually blinded Ruff. Yes, Smith was that dirty. (And yes, I saw this when it happened, happily watching the game on TV. Yes, I am that old.)
That Aud Smell Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 I had just finished TAS's post when I thought, "he was Steve Montador before there was a Steve Montador..." that gave me a chuckle. But his rep is alot more bloated than footage justifies. For some reason his rep in Buffalo has become one of a genuine tough guy. your references to his rep confused me. i've never gotten the sense that there's a widely-held (heck, even narrowly-held) belief that lindy was a fearsome light-heavyweight in the mold of, say, brad may. I consider tough guy to be a guy who never backed down and was always willing to come to defense of a teammate. But he did square off against a lot of tough guys, and always stuck up for teammates. It's all about showing up in my book, as well. Ruff was not a goon, or a legit heavyweigt fighter, but he was plenty tough. in any event, it looks like this has wound up being the consensus. now if only PA would come back in to kick up some more dust.
wnyguy Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 I agree Aud, I don't know anyone who claims Ruff was a heavyweight tough guy. He did give all he had and I remember being disappointed when he didn't just pound the tar out of Billy Smith but I thought it was great that he went after him in the first place.
Stoner Posted February 3, 2011 Author Report Posted February 3, 2011 I agree Aud, I don't know anyone who claims Ruff was a heavyweight tough guy. He did give all he had and I remember being disappointed when he didn't just pound the tar out of Billy Smith but I thought it was great that he went after him in the first place. That's the point. He didn't really go after Smith. People just want to remember it that way.
X. Benedict Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 That's the point. He didn't really go after Smith. People just want to remember it that way. Nor was he credited with a sack. That was before the NHL kept sacks as an official statistic.
Eleven Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 That's the point. He didn't really go after Smith. People just want to remember it that way. He went after him. He didn't fight him.
nobody Posted February 3, 2011 Report Posted February 3, 2011 He went after him. He didn't fight him. Of course he did just get speared in the face with the butt end of a goalie stick so fighting may not have been fully at the top of his list.
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