Lindy is flat out embarrassing himself

[theend]

The teams stock won't be high if there is no year to year profits. The higher the annual income the more the stock is worth. One does rely on the other. Herein lies the problem with management. Make a slight profit, keep the team around.

 

They had the room to add a 5.5 million dollar player at the deadline and didn't. How could they believe that the whole team is going to stay healthy, especially a guy that gets beat up in front of the net, game in game out, and that you don't need someone else?

 

I don't think Lindy has let his players or this city down. Management has. If they truly believed that this year was the cup run they would've added that 'special' player, 5 mill and a few 2nd rounders should've done it. Don't tell me it can't be done. If you are as smart and talented as you say you are why didn't you do it? And if you're not that talented get the Fk out.

 

They didn't believe in this team this year.

 

But it's not as simple as adding a 5.5 million dollar player. If that were the case, the Devils would be rolling through the Flyers with Kovalchuk. When you look around at the deadline deals...is there anyone worth 5.5 million that's made an impact on their new team? The teams that are winning right now are winning because of their core players that were already there.

 

Darcy definitely has his faults in building this team...but one area where I've almost always agreed with him is deadline deals for impending UFAs. 95% of them go belly-up, with little to no impact, and you've just traded away youth and draft picks for nothing.

[Sam Williams]

A little far fetched....but isnt Jimbo dying to get his hands on a buffalo franchise? .... heres a group to buy out from LQ, and Golisano.... Jim Kelly, Billy Fucillo , Gilbert P , and / or the Family of Tim Horton... (not meant to be serious)

[Mbossy]

But it's not as simple as adding a 5.5 million dollar player. If that were the case, the Devils would be rolling through the Flyers with Kovalchuk. When you look around at the deadline deals...is there anyone worth 5.5 million that's made an impact on their new team? The teams that are winning right now are winning because of their core players that were already there.

 

Darcy definitely has his faults in building this team...but one area where I've almost always agreed with him is deadline deals for impending UFAs. 95% of them go belly-up, with little to no impact, and you've just traded away youth and draft picks for nothing.

 

It doesn't necessarily need to be one 5 million player. I don't want Kovalchuk on this team. I'm saying they had tons of space to add the veteran center, veteran d-man type that gets you through the playoffs. A bunch of the same types of players that have been together for years and massaging each others whatevers after losses doesn't cut it. DR should have someone here besides Grier to tell the guys to quit being a bunch of non-finishers.

[Sam Williams]

It doesn't necessarily need to be one 5 million player. I don't want Kovalchuk on this team. I'm saying they had tons of space to add the veteran center, veteran d-man type that gets you through the playoffs. A bunch of the same types of players that have been together for years and massaging each others whatevers after losses doesn't cut it. DR should have someone here besides Grier to tell the guys to quit being a bunch of non-finishers.

 

2010 FA List

Here is the list for next year .... if we dont pick up anybody from this discustingly huge list of UFA's ...then i give up on this team

[theend]

It doesn't necessarily need to be one 5 million player. I don't want Kovalchuk on this team. I'm saying they had tons of space to add the veteran center, veteran d-man type that gets you through the playoffs. A bunch of the same types of players that have been together for years and massaging each others whatevers after losses doesn't cut it. DR should have someone here besides Grier to tell the guys to quit being a bunch of non-finishers.

 

I don't disagree that this team is missing key elements. FA is where to add though, not inflated-price deadline deals that almost always fall on their face. Again, look at this year's deadline transactions...not one of them is making the type of impact the Sabres need right now. But if Darcy doesn't make a push in FA, that's grounds for a riot.

[tom webster]

Sorry, but it's quite apparent he's being taken to school in this series, regardless of past achievements.

 

Playing a complete floater like Stafford, who has shown Jack ###### all season, and just back from a concussion to boot, is plain bad coaching. Simple as that.

 

 

Yeah its just the same as playing a floater like Satan, ah wait that doesn't work.....its like playing Ryder ah wait....

 

Who the ###### is he supposed to play? Gerbe, Mancari, give me a break.

[tom webster]

And in order to sell high, he needs a team that turns a profit. Breaking even every year isn't going to bring in many potential buyers.

 

 

If you think that buyers look at paper profit and losses when buying a sports franchise, then it will take a lot more then a few post to explain.

[Mbossy]

If you think that buyers look at paper profit and losses when buying a sports franchise, then it will take a lot more then a few post to explain.

 

:w00t:

[nfreeman]

And you can criticize Darcy all you want for his management style - but the man is not resting on his effing laurels. He truly BELIEVES in his plan, in 'the Core'. You can rightfully criticize that and say he doesn't do enough at the deadline, in FA, that he's chosen soft players, etc, etc. But to think that he's not TRYING to build a winner is absurd. It's a question of approach and decisions, not effort. Ditto any criticism of Lindy.

+1

 

I would say that I'm at the point where I'd be fine with losing Lindy, as long as we also lose Darcy. I like Lindy and he's highly respected around the league, but what we are seeing isn't working well enough. If that means that we have to change both, then fine, do it.

I'm not sure yet where I come out on whether they should be gone, but I will say that if Lindy goes, Darcy should too.

 

They had the room to add a 5.5 million dollar player at the deadline and didn't. How could they believe that the whole team is going to stay healthy, especially a guy that gets beat up in front of the net, game in game out, and that you don't need someone else?

 

I don't think Lindy has let his players or this city down. Management has. If they truly believed that this year was the cup run they would've added that 'special' player, 5 mill and a few 2nd rounders should've done it. Don't tell me it can't be done. If you are as smart and talented as you say you are why didn't you do it? And if you're not that talented get the Fk out.

 

They didn't believe in this team this year.

I agree with this, although I don't think it's a bad approach to say that the team realistically wasn't a cup contender this year, so it didn't make sense to raid the nest egg in a desperation move for Kovy or someone similar -- it certainly isn't working for NJ. I'd like to think that if the Sabres were closer to elite status, DR would've made a more substantial move at the deadline.

 

I don't disagree that this team is missing key elements. FA is where to add though, not inflated-price deadline deals that almost always fall on their face. Again, look at this year's deadline transactions...not one of them is making the type of impact the Sabres need right now. But if Darcy doesn't make a push in FA, that's grounds for a riot.

Well, or via trade (perhaps at the draft). But DR may be gone by then.

[theend]

If you think that buyers look at paper profit and losses when buying a sports franchise, then it will take a lot more then a few post to explain.

 

Come on, man - I'm not being simplistic here. I understand how investments and profits work. I never said it was the ONLY thing they look at. But at a fundamental level, a business still needs to be successful and profitable to attract buyers, so the idea that Golisano, Quinn, and Darcy are happily smoking cigars while watching the receipts break even is ridiculous.

 

They WANT to win. They WANT to turn a bigger profit. They have spent at or close to the cap for several seasons now. If they really didn't care, contracts like Vanek's would never have been signed, no matter what the outcry, and the team cap number would be far lower than what it is.

[Kristian]

Yeah its just the same as playing a floater like Satan, ah wait that doesn't work.....its like playing Ryder ah wait....

 

Who the ###### is he supposed to play? Gerbe, Mancari, give me a break.

 

So the coming back from a concussion doesn't play a part? If this were Pat LaFontaine, I'd understand you'd want him in the lineup, but this is Drew Stafford we're talking about.

 

Heck yeah, I'd take Mancari over him at this point, at least he looked good the few games he played this year.

[notwoz]

This is so off-base. I'm really sick of the idea that 'management' is content with mediocrity. You do realize that with the size of Buffalo's market, that pretty much any real team profit comes from making and surviving deep into the playoffs? Even if he was just a money-hungry jerk, Golisano still NEEDS this team to go deep into the playoffs for this to be a lucrative investment. And you can criticize Darcy all you want for his management style - but the man is not resting on his effing laurels. He truly BELIEVES in his plan, in 'the Core'. You can rightfully criticize that and say he doesn't do enough at the deadline, in FA, that he's chosen soft players, etc, etc. But to think that he's not TRYING to build a winner is absurd. It's a question of approach and decisions, not effort. Ditto any criticism of Lindy.

I don't know for a fact, but I'm sure Darcy is trying hard.(I still don't know how Larry Quinn fits into this equation. Despite his title and minority owner status, his history is in real estate development, not hockey team development) But Darcy's approach and decisions have not resulted in a championship and that is the ultimate goal. Between 1998 and this season, the Sabres have been in the playoffs seven times: two trips to the first round (including this year), one trip to the second round, three trips to the conference finals ('98,'06-07) and one trip to the Cup finals.

 

I'll give Darcy a lot of credit for dealing with the fallout from the Rigas family scandal. He's done an average job of getting the team to the playoffs (better than average if you discount the post-Rigas/bankruptcy years). But if he's paid to put together a Stanley Cup winning team, then he hasn't succeeded. Granted, the book isn't closed on this year's playoffs, but I'm not holding my breath on the Sabres advancing beyond the first round.

 

In the final analysis, the job of Darcy, Lindy and Quinn is to put a championship team on the ice. That's the bar they have to clear, and that's the bar they have to be judged by. In 13 years, Darcy hasn't cleared that bar.

 

Will we be better off without Darcy and/or Lindy? Who knows? I like Lindy as a coach, and I give Darcy credit for dealing with adversity and that "small market" situation.

 

At some point however, ownership has to say, "Thanks for all your hard work, but ..."

[theend]

I don't know for a fact, but I'm sure Darcy is trying hard.(I still don't know how Larry Quinn fits into this equation. Despite his title and minority owner status, his history is in real estate development, not hockey team development) But Darcy's approach and decisions have not resulted in a championship and that is the ultimate goal. Between 1998 and this season, the Sabres have been in the playoffs seven times: two trips to the first round (including this year), one trip to the second round, three trips to the conference finals ('98,'06-07) and one trip to the Cup finals.

 

I'll give Darcy a lot of credit for dealing with the fallout from the Rigas family scandal. He's done an average job of getting the team to the playoffs (better than average if you discount the post-Rigas/bankruptcy years). But if he's paid to put together a Stanley Cup winning team, then he hasn't succeeded. Granted, the book isn't closed on this year's playoffs, but I'm not holding my breath on the Sabres advancing beyond the first round.

 

In the final analysis, the job of Darcy, Lindy and Quinn is to put a championship team on the ice. That's the bar they have to clear, and that's the bar they have to be judged by. In 13 years, Darcy hasn't cleared that bar.

 

Will we be better off without Darcy and/or Lindy? Who knows? I like Lindy as a coach, and I give Darcy credit for dealing with adversity and that "small market" situation.

 

At some point however, ownership has to say, "Thanks for all your hard work, but ..."

 

This is a very reasonable assessment. I took issue more with your previous post, especially the line - 'I get the impression that management is content to do as much as it takes to fill the arena but not to do what it takes to build a legitimate contender.'

 

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Lindy, Darcy, Quinn, or Golisano should be immune from criticism, or that they have done their jobs perfectly...I'm just saying the idea that they're content is not in any way correct. I don't look at Darcy and Lindy's actions over their tenure and say 'Yup, those guys are phoning it in.' I don't look at Golisano allowing Darcy to spend to the cap (or very close to it) as a sign of him only caring about filling the arena.

 

I don't think there is any argument that they are trying to build a winning team and franchise. Whether or not they're doing it RIGHT is a perfectly valid debate to have.

[Sabre Dance]

 

 

'It's that simple'? Your ludicrous reduction of Lindy and Darcy's success here shows how little you actually know about hockey.

 

NHL success = Stanley Cup championship. We don't have any.

[Sabre Dance]

 

I don't think there is any argument that they are trying to build a winning team and franchise. Whether or not they're doing it RIGHT is a perfectly valid debate to have.

 

Yep - a third-grader can work really hard on a fifth-grade math problem, but he just doesn't have the ability to solve it. Working hard only gets you tired - you need to have the skills to put together a champ. After 13 years, I think it is safe to say Darcy just doesn't have the chops.

[tom webster]

Come on, man - I'm not being simplistic here. I understand how investments and profits work. I never said it was the ONLY thing they look at. But at a fundamental level, a business still needs to be successful and profitable to attract buyers, so the idea that Golisano, Quinn, and Darcy are happily smoking cigars while watching the receipts break even is ridiculous.

 

They WANT to win. They WANT to turn a bigger profit. They have spent at or close to the cap for several seasons now. If they really didn't care, contracts like Vanek's would never have been signed, no matter what the outcry, and the team cap number would be far lower than what it is.

 

Successful and profitable are two different things. As the great Doctor Fever once said, profit/loss are merely theoretical terms..

 

That said, of course they want to earn as much profit as possible but every decision goes through a cost/benefit analysis and then is tinged with what the owner really wants to achieve. An owner who is passionate about hockey and the lore for the Cup is going to make some decisions that an owner who merely wants to win the Cup wouldn't make.

 

If TG wanted to win the Cup as badly as he wanted Paychex to be the number payroll processing company in the world, Darcy Reiger would not still be the GM. Not necessarily because that would be the right decision, but because no vice president survives the fall from success that Darcy survived.

[tom webster]

So the coming back from a concussion doesn't play a part? If this were Pat LaFontaine, I'd understand you'd want him in the lineup, but this is Drew Stafford we're talking about.

 

Heck yeah, I'd take Mancari over him at this point, at least he looked good the few games he played this year.

 

 

Mancari looked like a slower version of Stafford.

[theend]

NHL success = Stanley Cup championship. We don't have any.

 

Come on...there's NO other type of success except winning a Stanley Cup? By that logic, screw the French Connection. Screw LaFontaine. Forget 'May Day'. It's all worthless because none of them or their teams brought home a Cup.

 

The Cup is the ultimate goal. And yes, the team should always be trying to reach that goal. But to simplistically cast aside anything else positive is silly.

 

Yep - a third-grader can work really hard on a fifth-grade math problem, but he just doesn't have the ability to solve it. Working hard only gets you tired - you need to have the skills to put together a champ. After 13 years, I think it is safe to say Darcy just doesn't have the chops.

 

Really? Darcy has his problems, but you're comparing him to a third grader working on a fifth-grade math problem? He has tried and, just like 29 other GMs each year, failed to bring home a Cup. But he has had more success than most of them during that time. Only a handful have delivered Cups and had more success than he has.

 

I'm not advocating that it's not time for him to move on - 13 years IS a long time, especially with no championships to show for it. But it's not like we had Matt Millen at the helm. THAT's a 3rd-grader trying to work on a 5th grade math problem.

[nfreeman]

If TG wanted to win the Cup as badly as he wanted Paychex to be the number payroll processing company in the world, Darcy Reiger would not still be the GM. Not necessarily because that would be the right decision, but because no vice president survives the fall from success that Darcy survived.

...unless TG was being fair and made his decision on DR based on his understanding that DR had gotten the team very close and then had the rug pulled out from under him by TG and LQ. Now, that doesn't mean that TG won't decide shortly after the end of the Sabres' season that DR's now had a fair chance and hasn't produced and it's therefore time for a change. It just means that TG, being in possession of all of the facts and (hypothetically) being an objective and fair-minded guy, and one who isn't answerable to anyone on this decision (ie no public shareholder base to whom he is legally obligated), likely decided not to scapegoat DR without giving him a fair shot to rebuild after the 2007-08 debacle.

[theend]

...unless TG was being fair and made his decision on DR based on his understanding that DR had gotten the team very close and then had the rug pulled out from under him by TG and LQ. Now, that doesn't mean that TG won't decide shortly after the end of the Sabres' season that DR's now had a fair chance and hasn't produced and it's therefore time for a change. It just means that TG, being in possession of all of the facts and (hypothetically) being an objective and fair-minded guy, and one who isn't answerable to anyone on this decision (ie no public shareholder base to whom he is legally obligated), likely decided not to scapegoat DR without giving him a fair shot to rebuild after the 2007-08 debacle.

 

+1

[Scotty]

My biggest complaint for the last three times we have been in the playoffs is "WHERE IS THE POWERPLAY!!!!"

 

I think if Lindy sticks around this offseason the powerplay has to be addressed along with the sagging "core players"

[SabresRepublic]

Lindy is clearly the second best head coach in this series. At the beginning of the third - I had missed all but the last 48 seconds of the 2d period, it was depressing to realize that my thought was "whoever scores the next goal wins" and we had a 2 goal lead. Within 5 minutes of play I shut the game off, after noticing Lindy's bewildered (although po'd) look on ther bench. He looked as if he had no idea how the B's came out and promptly tied the game.

 

I'll tell you why he was bewildered and PO'ed and he had a pretty good idea as to why the Bruins got back into the game!

The officiating made it possible for the home team to crawl back in by disadvantaging the Sabres by shifting the momentum via questionable(at the very least) penalties.

 

Essentially, the officiating this series has been to give Boston the benefit of the doubt while keeping the Sabres guessing as to what is - according to the rules - acceptable aptitude and skill! BS!

 

In spite of the mediocre officciating:

 

GO BUFFALO SABRES!!!

[Taro T]

I'll tell you why he was bewildered and PO'ed and he had a pretty good idea as to why the Bruins got back into the game!

The officiating made it possible for the home team to crawl back in by disadvantaging the Sabres by shifting the momentum via questionable(at the very least) penalties.

 

Essentially, the officiating this series has been to give Boston the benefit of the doubt while keeping the Sabres guessing as to what is - according to the rules - acceptable aptitude and skill! BS!

 

In spite of the mediocre officciating:

 

GO BUFFALO SABRES!!!

So, the officials giving Boston all the breaks is why they had 6 pp's through the 1st 3 games to Buffalo's 12? :huh:

 

Of course, putting the Sabres on the pp does give Boston the edge, so maybe you're onto something there. ;)

[SabresRepublic]

So, the officials giving Boston all the breaks is why they had 6 pp's through the 1st 3 games to Buffalo's 12?

 

Of course, putting the Sabres on the pp does give Boston the edge, so maybe you're onto something there.

 

NO!

 

It's the questionable calls and non-calls at critical moments in the game that shifted momentum away from the Sabres. The two calls early in the third yesterday. The two high sticks with blood drawn non calls in the previous game to name a few specific instances!

'Tis NOT quantity! It is the quality of the opportunity granted or denied I am speaking about!

All other things equal and randomly occurring if those two examples I gave you were officiated transparently we would at the very least be 2 - 2 heading into game 5. As it is we, like the Red Sox did to the Yankees, can win out! Despite the officiating foibles, we have led for more than 75% of total playing time

 

GO BUFFALO SABRES!!!

[SwampD]

NO!

 

It's the questionable calls and non-calls at critical moments in the game that shifted momentum away from the Sabres. The two calls early in the third yesterday. The two high sticks with blood drawn non calls in the previous game to name a few specific instances!

'Tis NOT quantity! It is the quality of the opportunity granted or denied I am speaking about!

All other things equal and randomly occurring if those two examples I gave you were officiated transparently we would at the very least be 2 - 2 heading into game 5. As it is we, like the Red Sox did to the Yankees, can win out! Despite the officiating foibles, we have led for more than 75% of total playing time

 

GO BUFFALO SABRES!!!

You mean like when they gave the Sabres the first PP in OT that should have ended it?