Why Miller Should Have Played Last Night

[tulax]

I think the more important issue at hand is judging how THE TEAM plays when Lalime is in net.

It's clear to see that the team does not have the confidence to play their game when Miller isn't on the ice.

 

Our new system relies heavily upon dmen that are willing to be aggressive and move up the ice with the forwards. The new system consists of both the d and the forwards moving up the ice in unison, using short fast passes to move quickly up the ice. Our dmen can do that without worry because they know that even if they make a mistake and an opposing forward blows past them, Miller stands a good chance of bailing them out. With Lalime, they do not have that luxury.

 

You saw our system break down last night against Atlanta. Instead of playing our game, our dmen played on their heels. It allowed Atlanta to forecheck aggressively, clogging up the neutral zone, forcing our forwards further up the ice. So, instead of the team moving in unison, you had the d playing deep in our zone and Atlanta forwards freely forechecking; this effectively split our players on the ice in half. With Atlanta crowding the neutral zone, our forwards had no choice but to skate past the Thrashers and hope for a pass. This curses our defense, because the only outlet pass our dmen had was to throw the puck up the ice to the opposing blueline and hope one of our forwards received it. It frustrated me to see the d attempt those passes, as they rarely ever work.

 

The Sabres need to learn to play their new system, regardless of who is in net. It's been awesomely effective the first few games, and will continue to be so as long as the team is committed to it. If they attempt to play the game like its 06-07, they'll be destroyed. Whether or not Lalime can bail out the d if they make a mistake matters not; the d needs to be confident, aggressive and stick to the plan. If they don't, the entire system collapses and the Sabres will most likely be unable to win the game.

This, to me, is the key statement. If you substitute Lalime for Miller when the Sabres played Detroit I would be willing to bet the outcome would be the same. Why? They executed a game plan that included getting an early lead, frustrating the opponent, possessing the puck, and playing stingy D. The only problem I have with playing Lalime on Saturday is that I feel he should have played Friday. Playing a back up goalie on the second of back to back games seems ineffective because it gives the Sabres little time to prepare for an opponent with the back up in place. If the team prepares for the Islanders, given two full days to practice, with Lalime in net they understand that it will take a similar effective effort, like that seen against Detroit, to beat the Islanders. For the next game the onus falls on Miller to help the Sabres steal a win given there is little turn around time.

 

I agree with those on this board that feel that this is an entirely different team when it plays in front of Miller than with Lalime. Miller is this team's security blanket; he is paid like one. However, effective coaching should at least curtail a team from losing the mindset that they would come into a game against a historically elite team, like Detroit, with the number one goalie in between the pipes. It becomes hard for a coach to pass along confidence in his back up goaltender to the players when historically it appears that he does not like to play his back up goaltender.

 

The Sabres have enjoyed fast starts for the past few years, only to see the boost in the standings weathered by dwindling performance in the middle of the season (especially last season). Effective playoff teams play steady throughout the season, although even the best of teams suffer the occasional slump. Couple this with the fact that Miller expressed fatigue when asked to play 70 games in a season, which this year will be made longer by the Olympics, and I would say that the back up goalie needs to play and share a good part of the load. The question is whether Lalime will be asked to play when the team has been playing well, as they were up to Saturday, or when they are in the heart of the season tired and subject to slumping?

[...]

The question is whether Lalime will be asked to play when the team has been playing well, as they were up to Saturday, or when they are in the heart of the season tired and subject to slumping?

 

No, the question is whether the team that plays in front of Lalime will be the same team that plays in front of Miller. It could be a whithered, flaccid team in the middle of a slump but STILL trying to play the system; or a confident, emboldened team standing tall on the ice playing the system and winning games. The key here is that they play consistently regardless of who is in net.

 

So, an additional question is if Lindy can get this message through to the team: that they stand a greater chance at losing games with Lalime in net by NOT playing the system than if they DO play the system. At least if they play the system, they stand a chance of getting pucks in the net, counteracting the goals that Lalime lets in. My opinion is that pucks will make it past Lalime regardless. For the players, this kind of logic is more like a leap of faith.

[nucci]

I have no idea why Mair was in last night as well. Ellis did not deserve a benching with the energy he puts out there. I would have had no problem starting Lalime last night IF Vanek was back in the lineup. I think the lineup was Ruff's first mistake of the season but I won't take too much out of last night. Get Miller and Vanek back in there with the previous lineup and they should be fine. If Ottawa is our biggest concern in the division right now, it should be a good year. Something is VERY wrong in Boston right now....................

Don't see the correlation of Lalime with Vanek. What does one have to do with the other?

[nucci]

Patrick LiLAME... am I right or what guys?

VERY creative. :doh:

[nfreeman]

The only problem I have with playing Lalime on Saturday is that I feel he should have played Friday. Playing a back up goalie on the second of back to back games seems ineffective because it gives the Sabres little time to prepare for an opponent with the back up in place. If the team prepares for the Islanders, given two full days to practice, with Lalime in net they understand that it will take a similar effective effort, like that seen against Detroit, to beat the Islanders.

Good call.

[Taro T]

The problem w/ swapping Miller and Lalime's playing time this weekend is Miller doesn't play particularily well against Atlanta (heck, the whole team doesn't play well against them). Miller is 6-2-4 against them in 13 games. Considering how pathetic Atlanta is historically, those are absolutely horrible results.

 

The Sabres should have, and did, beat the Isles. Last year, playing Miller 1 game too many (against Atlanta) because he'd had back to back shutouts sent him on a downward spiral which really messed up a decent start. If the team was going to lack focus in a game, it was probably Atlanta. Starting Lalime, when the team knows he's not as good as Miller, could be reasonably expected to get them to actually play soundly. (It worked back in the early '80's w/ Edwards and Sauve. The team played far more soundly defensively when Sauve was in the net than they did when Edwards was in.) It didn't happen Saturday night, but I really doubt the Sabres would have won that game w/ Miller in the net. I'd rather have the (reasonably) sure 2 points in the bag against the Isles and take my chances w/ the Thrashers than going the other way round.

[tulax]

The problem w/ swapping Miller and Lalime's playing time this weekend is Miller doesn't play particularily well against Atlanta (heck, the whole team doesn't play well against them). Miller is 6-2-4 against them in 13 games. Considering how pathetic Atlanta is historically, those are absolutely horrible results.

 

The Sabres should have, and did, beat the Isles. Last year, playing Miller 1 game too many (against Atlanta) because he'd had back to back shutouts sent him on a downward spiral which really messed up a decent start. If the team was going to lack focus in a game, it was probably Atlanta. Starting Lalime, when the team knows he's not as good as Miller, could be reasonably expected to get them to actually play soundly. (It worked back in the early '80's w/ Edwards and Sauve. The team played far more soundly defensively when Sauve was in the net than they did when Edwards was in.) It didn't happen Saturday night, but I really doubt the Sabres would have won that game w/ Miller in the net. I'd rather have the (reasonably) sure 2 points in the bag against the Isles and take my chances w/ the Thrashers than going the other way round.

On the second night of back to back games, wouldn't you settle for a point (overtime loss) and try to come out with three rather than two? According to your stats on Miller, he has been able to get points in 10 out of the 12 games which he has played in. I agree with you that that record should be better than it is. However, in a game where the guys were sure to be tired, I would be fine with an overtime loss. It should not be forgotten that Atlanta also played on back to back nights and had to fly from New Jersey through the night after their first game.

[tulax]

No, the question is whether the team that plays in front of Lalime will be the same team that plays in front of Miller. It could be a whithered, flaccid team in the middle of a slump but STILL trying to play the system; or a confident, emboldened team standing tall on the ice playing the system and winning games. The key here is that they play consistently regardless of who is in net.

 

So, an additional question is if Lindy can get this message through to the team: that they stand a greater chance at losing games with Lalime in net by NOT playing the system than if they DO play the system. At least if they play the system, they stand a chance of getting pucks in the net, counteracting the goals that Lalime lets in. My opinion is that pucks will make it past Lalime regardless. For the players, this kind of logic is more like a leap of faith.

Fair points, although so far history has shown that this team is incapable of playing in front of Lalime the same way they do for Miller. I think part of this new system involves playing a much more defensive game by playing smarter in their own zone. If they can get more pucks on net, like you say, and forecheck with conviction this should enable them to get out to early leads. That would counteract anything Lalime is liable to let in. None of this takes into account the fact that Hedberg, in this particluar game, played solid on the road and was able to frustrate early. This frustration will essentially negate any "system" that is put in place.

[Taro T]

On the second night of back to back games, wouldn't you settle for a point (overtime loss) and try to come out with three rather than two? According to your stats on Miller, he has been able to get points in 10 out of the 12 games which he has played in. I agree with you that that record should be better than it is. However, in a game where the guys were sure to be tired, I would be fine with an overtime loss. It should not be forgotten that Atlanta also played on back to back nights and had to fly from New Jersey through the night after their first game.

Shouldn't the Thrashers have been more tired than the Sabres heading into the game? The Sabres didn't have to travel and hadn't bothered playing in their own end the previous night, so they should have been fresher. Combine that with an expectation that the Sabres SHOULD play more disciplined when Lalime gets a start, I don't have a problem with starting Lalime against the Threshers.

 

I would NOT have played Miller both nights. Lalime HAS to start some games, or the Sabres need to have a different backup and HE has to get some starts. The expected outcome, IMHO of either game w/ Miller in net is 2 pts against the Isles and 1 against Atlanta.

 

If you start Lalime against the Isles, you very well could have thrown away 2 points. Turns out, they ended up throwing away a point against Atlanta.

 

In years past, Lindy has rode his starter too long, causing both the starter to show signs of exhaustion at times and putting thick coatings of rust on the backup. My take on it is, Lindy looked at it the way you appear to be looking at it; we won yesterday, let's ride Miller today and find some other game to sit him later. Well, you never really get to that point where the Sabres have as good a chance of getting a W w/ Lalime in the net in a particular game as they do w/ Miller. So you never get to that obvious correct game to start the backup. The problem is, the chance of getting the most wins over the course of the season is maximized w/ the backup making the occassional start.

 

It seems, based on your statements above (and I am not trying to put words in your mouth, so correct me if I didn't read you correctly) that you expected Miller starting would have gotten the Sabres 1 more point than they ended up with. If that is the case, definitely I'd start Lalime as my expectation w/ him starting was pretty much the same. That the probable outcome of the game was a single point for the Sabres. 1 point isn't worth the risk of riding Miller too long, IMHO. And if the Sabres don't expect at least a point out of that game w/ Lalime starting, then he flat out should not be on their roster. They have to believe he gives them a chance to get that point or somebody else would necessarily have to be in there.

[tulax]

It seems, based on your statements above (and I am not trying to put words in your mouth, so correct me if I didn't read you correctly) that you expected Miller starting would have gotten the Sabres 1 more point than they ended up with. If that is the case, definitely I'd start Lalime as my expectation w/ him starting was pretty much the same. That the probable outcome of the game was a single point for the Sabres. 1 point isn't worth the risk of riding Miller too long, IMHO. And if the Sabres don't expect at least a point out of that game w/ Lalime starting, then he flat out should not be on their roster. They have to believe he gives them a chance to get that point or somebody else would necessarily have to be in there.

 

I completely agree with you that Lalime needs to get his starts. In fact, I don't think Ruff uses his backups enough and will have to change due to the Olympics. Earlier in the topic I wrote a rather long winded post on why I thought Lalime should have started on Friday, rather than Saturday, along with other points. To me, as I stated before, Miller is a number one goaltender because he is able to "steal" points from games where the other Sabres skaters have no business in earning points. In other words, on some nights Miller is going to have to carry this team. Therefore, if you start Lalime on Friday against the Islanders, you give the team two full days to practice with Lalime getting starters time between the pipes. I think this is a missing link, Lalime getting more reps than Miller on some days, because they are clearly not as comfortable with Lalime. However, Ruff went with Miller on Friday, the game following two days of practice. He then goes to his backup for the second of back to back games, a game where you want a goaltender (i.e. Miller) is going to be able to "steal" a win or OT loss for your team.

 

Your right in stating that if this team starts Lalime on Friday, as I suggest, they may not get two points. Nothing seems certain for this team in front of Lalime when he starts. I'm guessing Ruff wants to continue his teams confidence going into a tough weekend by putting Miller there. However, as many have said on this topic, this team needs to play confidently and in their system in front of Miller AND Lalime. Therefore, to clarify my position: start Lalime when the team has a couple of days of practice in front of him and if it is a back to back situation start Miller on the second night to steal some points.

[Taro T]

I completely agree with you that Lalime needs to get his starts. In fact, I don't think Ruff uses his backups enough and will have to change due to the Olympics. Earlier in the topic I wrote a rather long winded post on why I thought Lalime should have started on Friday, rather than Saturday, along with other points. To me, as I stated before, Miller is a number one goaltender because he is able to "steal" points from games where the other Sabres skaters have no business in earning points. In other words, on some nights Miller is going to have to carry this team. Therefore, if you start Lalime on Friday against the Islanders, you give the team two full days to practice with Lalime getting starters time between the pipes. I think this is a missing link, Lalime getting more reps than Miller on some days, because they are clearly not as comfortable with Lalime. However, Ruff went with Miller on Friday, the game following two days of practice. He then goes to his backup for the second of back to back games, a game where you want a goaltender (i.e. Miller) is going to be able to "steal" a win or OT loss for your team.

 

Your right in stating that if this team starts Lalime on Friday, as I suggest, they may not get two points. Nothing seems certain for this team in front of Lalime when he starts. I'm guessing Ruff wants to continue his teams confidence going into a tough weekend by putting Miller there. However, as many have said on this topic, this team needs to play confidently and in their system in front of Miller AND Lalime. Therefore, to clarify my position: start Lalime when the team has a couple of days of practice in front of him and if it is a back to back situation start Miller on the second night to steal some points.

You make a good argument. It's possible that having Lalime in on Friday they weren't risking the 2 points they came away with as much as I think they were risking them. If I'd expect the likelihood of a win straight up in a back to back situation were roughly equal, then I see the validity of starting Lalime in the 1st game. It'll be interesting to see if Ruff does change up his philosophy and start using Lalime on the front end of back to backs.