GAME DISCUSSION THREAD

[bob_sauve28]

Not exactly a shot to the head, but something that might have been addressed. It wasn't, but it was well into the 3rd period of a 1-1 game -- and it was about 10% of what Kaleta did to Prucha.

 

 

excellent post. I will say that I thought Kaleta's hit was within the rules (I thought it was a lot like Soupy's hit on Umberger in the playoffs). I'd like to change that rule though.

I didn't like that kid looking like he was knocked out. I love hockey and the Sabres but hurting other players isn't right at all. I don't blame Kaleta, he's just a bowling ball out there, and I don't think changing the rules can stop a hit like that. So I just don't know. I thought it was a clean hit, but part of me hates that.

[carpandean]

- Kaleta left his feet. It appeared to be a cheap shot no matter what RJ and Harry said.

Watch at the 1:00 mark:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOVSY2Y_2IA

 

I don't think he came off the ice until after contact was made.

[Taro T]

In the Montreal GDT from Saturday, I mentioned that VanstheMans may have seen a different game at the rink than I saw on TV (you see more at the rink, he was there and didn't think the team looked good, and on TV, I thought the Sabres looked great). Had the opposite experience tonight; a friend watching on TV kept texting me with messages about how sharp the Sabres looked, how the forechecking was excellent, etc., while I was seeing it live and thought the team looked horrible. I can totally see how Vans & I saw "different" games on Saturday.

 

They were skating hard, they took chances, they did all the things that we want the team to do, but something wasn't right. And it was--I hate to use this word--an intangible something that was missing. The effort was there, but it just wasn't working out. There was no coordination among team members; at some points, it was like watching five skaters, each of whom was playing hard, but playing a different game from the other four.

 

Kudos to Pominville's defensive play. He stuck out especially on the Coyote's first power play (before it became a 5-on-3) and probably prevented a goal by sticking to his man in front. All in all, he was great in the Sabres' end. Speaking of which, the D was great in general, in the Sabres' end. Montador fits on this team well (his hustle was terrific, and he didn't back down from anything), Rivet cared for the puck as if it were a newborn, Butler and Sekera had strong games, and even Hank, yes, Hank, was strong (except for a penalty call that was a complete BS call). Myers was over-used on the PP, but I guess Ruff has to look at him in as many situations as possible before ten games are up. He was a force out there defensively again, though, and I liked him on the PK. Defense was pinching again in the offensive zone, and doing it well. Good amount of pressure; the team kept the puck in the Phoenix zone really well.

 

Not so good: The D was great in the Sabres' end, and did a good job at the points, but was horrible in the neutral zone. The O took too many shots at LaBarbera, and not enough at the open goal behind him. Roy still needs to find the skate sharpener, so he can stop falling all over the place all the time. Kennedy missed two passes that were right to his tape on the same shift in the second, and the latter of those nearly led to a Phoenix goal. Vanek made some unnecessary passes before finding his game in the late third, and of course, some of those passes didn't exactly work out. Hecht dressed for the game. As someone said in the Montreal thread, please stop the one-man-point PP scheme. Not working. There's no need for two defensemen on the point on a power play in the first period in a 0-0 game, either. Too many times where Sabres ran into each other or nearly did so.

 

Glad for the win, but I want to see some better hockey.

Sabres were very sharp in the 1st period of the Habs game (they dominated after the 1st shift until ~4 minutes were left in the period). But after that, they were outplayed badly in the 2nd, and although they won the shots battle (9-1?) in the 3rd, I think they were outplayed and outchanced 3-2. They dominated the OT, but all it takes is 1 bounce. They didn't deserve to win that one. At least that's how it looked from my seat in the 300's. (No comments on tonight's game as I only got to watch about 10 minutes of it.)

Watch at the 1:00 mark:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOVSY2Y_2IA

 

I don't think he came off the ice until after contact was made.

Pretty much it was a classic Peca hit. Exploding up into the checkee. That's why Peca occassionally drew suspensions. If you don't time that hit right, you have left your feet by the time you lay the other guy out. This time, Kaleta seemed to get it right.

[wjag]

In the Montreal GDT from Saturday, I mentioned that VanstheMans may have seen a different game at the rink than I saw on TV (you see more at the rink, he was there and didn't think the team looked good, and on TV, I thought the Sabres looked great). Had the opposite experience tonight; a friend watching on TV kept texting me with messages about how sharp the Sabres looked, how the forechecking was excellent, etc., while I was seeing it live and thought the team looked horrible. I can totally see how Vans & I saw "different" games on Saturday.

 

I share this opinion as well. I went to my first game in forever. I was expecting to 'see' the whole game vice the window of the game that television provides. In person, I actually think you may miss more or maybe the lack of announcing makes it feel like you see less. There are clearly more distractions in the arena than in my livingroom. My eyes followed the puck as much as possible. Since I was in the lower bowl behind Miller, I lost the puck from the trapezoid in. When they were at the other end, I saw movement, but lost the puck a bunch. What you do get in person is the speed. I saw the GWG play perfectly as it unfolded right in front of me. My over riding perception of the game was that it had no flow, it was stilted. SO I was surprised to see so many opinions that the Sabres played a great game. I saw shots being peppered from all over the place, but very few clean tic-tac passes, odd man rushes, blocks, etc. And this perception held for both teams. It just seemed off to me and judging by how quiet the crowd was, it was off to many.

 

I'm hitting two more this year, Buf-Car and Buf-Ott so I'll be interested to see if my opinion changes.

[inkman]

I will say that I thought Kaleta's hit was within the rules (I thought it was a lot like Soupy's hit on Umberger in the playoffs). I'd like to change that rule though.

He launched himself right into Prucha's upper torsoe/head. I didn't mind the hit, but if it were one of the Sabres on the receiving end, we would not have been happy.

 

I don't think Kaleta left his feet. It was REAL close but I really don't think he did.

Well, he did end up 6 inches off the ice, his momentum is headed up. Did he jump?

 

I watched the Kaleta hit over and over again... I watched the game with the Phoenix feed on center ice... Their guys seemed to conclude that it he might have been jarred into the air and his skates were on the ice going into Prucha. I found a nice video of it on youtube after and it kind of confirmed that. It looked like he was kind of rising as he braced for the hit but it wasn't really a jump and it seemed he only flew into the air as/after he connected.

Seems like we are picking nits here. "might have been jarred" sounds a lot like "might have jumped"

[nucci]

Not exactly a shot to the head, but something that might have been addressed. It wasn't, but it was well into the 3rd period of a 1-1 game -- and it was about 10% of what Kaleta did to Prucha.

 

 

excellent post. I will say that I thought Kaleta's hit was within the rules (I thought it was a lot like Soupy's hit on Umberger in the playoffs). I'd like to change that rule though.

 

Also, while Kaleta did get under their skin, I thought Phoenix looked like a pretty smart, well-coached team.

 

Also, Doan is a heck of a player. If he were a few years younger (he's 33), I'd trade Pommer or Roy for him in a second.

How nice of you to trade one of our underachieving forwards for arguably their best player. :D

[wjag]

I agree with Inkman.. Kaleta appears to have left his feet. There would be some serious hooting and hollering here today if the Sabres were on the receiving end of that hit.

 

My take:

 

1. He was off the ice when he made contact.

2. The hit was borderline and could have been called either way as it is right on the line in the NHL.

3. He smoked Prucha.

4. He became the game within the game last night drawing 10PP minutes for Buffalo including the game winner.

5. He knows how to 'accentuate' the retribution.

6. It is just a matter of time before someone smokes him. He plays a high risk style of hockey.

7. Glad he is on our team.

[wjag]

Last comment on this one. Doan is a hockey player. He is always around the puck and every Sabre knows when he is on the ice. If the Yotes aren't in the playoff hunt and presuming he stays healthy, that guy is the player to go after to help a team. He makes any team he plays on better.

[BeeWhy5]

 

 

Also, Doan is a heck of a player. If he were a few years younger (he's 33), I'd trade Pommer or Roy for him in a second.

 

Agreed. Big guy that skates hard and distribues. If they would take Pommers I would do it no matter how old he is because J-Poms is, and has been (last year as well) stealing money. And for those of you that don't believe that, please tell me what he brings to this team. It is rather early to be ripping him but as I mentioned, it has been a steady decline. Other thoughts last night:

 

Vanek- nice shot - pretty invisible other than that

Roy- some nice passes, moves but continually getting muscled off the puck along the boards

Stafford- hopefully he can keep up the agressive play. I like him on the 4th line. Keeping some balance.

Myers- Looked good again. What I loved is seeing his rifle of a shot on the PP. He kills the puck.

Miller- I think he is playing great right now. I feel like you can tell when Miller is feeling good when he makes everything look so easy and that is where he is at right now.

[deluca67]

Not exactly a shot to the head, but something that might have been addressed. It wasn't, but it was well into the 3rd period of a 1-1 game -- and it was about 10% of what Kaleta did to Prucha.

Why would any of that factor into the team's response. It sounds just like the excuses we have heard for a long time now as to why this team doesn't respond. A guy takes a shot at your rookie and nobody does anything?

[LabattBlue]

Watch at the 1:00 mark:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOVSY2Y_2IA

 

I don't think he came off the ice until after contact was made.

It was close, but I don't believe the contact with Prucha caused Kaleta to leave his feet. I'll stand by my statement(and I like Kaleta a LOT), it was a borderline cheap shot.

[Stoner]

Why would any of that factor into the team's response. It sounds just like the excuses we have heard for a long time now as to why this team doesn't respond. A guy takes a shot at your rookie and nobody does anything?

 

The lack of an immediate response can be pinned on the players on the ice at the time, but the fact that nothing followed has to be on Ruff. It's his strategic decision to make. Are you willing to give up two points to make a point? Which means more in March? Do you think even an aggressive response would stop cheap shots in the future?

[2ForTripping]

It is only a matter of time before Kaleta gets his ass handed to him. The hit on Prucha was a little iffy and Kaleta with his whip lash head jerk on lesser hits is going to be a man skating with a bullseye on his back.Only time will tell.

[Stoner]

It was close, but I don't believe the contact with Prucha caused Kaleta to leave his feet. I'll stand by my statement(and I like Kaleta a LOT), it was a borderline cheap shot.

 

This hit needs to be taken out of the game. Consider the rule-related house of cards you have to build to justify it as legal: 1. He skated a great distance to make the hit, but not great enough under the "distance traveled" provision. 2. He left his feet, but not until the act of hitting. 3. He hit him in the head, but not with an extended elbow. 4. The player hit was not in possession of the puck, but the hit came "immediately" after he lost possession.

 

Until the league gets serious and changes the letter and spirit of the rulebook, this garbage won't go away. Thank you ink for pointing out the obvious: Sabre fans would be going apeshit today if the hit had occurred on Tim Kennedy.

[SwampD]

Why would any of that factor into the team's response. It sounds just like the excuses we have heard for a long time now as to why this team doesn't respond. A guy takes a shot at your rookie and nobody does anything?

Let it go. The hit on Myers wasn't overly aggressive. It was just awkward. That's why he went down and that's why nobody responded at the time. You can relax, everything that needed to be responded to was responded to last night,... Oh yeah, and they won.

[SteamRoller72]

This hit needs to be taken out of the game. Consider the rule-related house of cards you have to build to justify it as legal: 1. He skated a great distance to make the hit, but not great enough under the "distance traveled" provision. 2. He left his feet, but not until the act of hitting. 3. He hit him in the head, but not with an extended elbow. 4. The player hit was not in possession of the puck, but the hit came "immediately" after he lost possession.

 

Until the league gets serious and changes the letter and spirit of the rulebook, this garbage won't go away. Thank you ink for pointing out the obvious: Sabre fans would be going apeshit today if the hit had occurred on Tim Kennedy.

 

I wouldn't.

I would blame Kennedy for skating with his head down. You want to drop your head, turn with the puck in your own zone and skate like it's the Swedish elite league? This is the NHL, you should get blasted.

It was a beautiful, clean, open ice hit...I don't need to see hockey players wearing skirts like NFL QB's.

 

You mock the Sabres in your posts for the "new found" accountibility and nastiness. You then turn around and call out the most physical play of the night. I'm fully convinced you'll complain about anything, anyone on this current Sabres team.

[LabattBlue]

A play by Kaleta that I loved(no not the hit)...

 

Laying out to block a shot in the slot. We don't have defensemen who do this, let alone a forward. If I was Lindy, I'd show that clip over and over again in the film room and say nothing more than "This is what I call doing whatever it takes to help your team win".

 

:worthy:

[Stoner]

A play by Kaleta that I loved(no not the hit)...

 

Laying out to block a shot in the slot. We don't have defensemen who do this, let alone a forward. If I was Lindy, I'd show that clip over and over again in the film room and say nothing more than "This is what I call doing whatever it takes to help your team win".

 

:worthy:

 

It struck me as the first time this season I'd seen a Sabre lay out his body to try and prevent a goal -- Ryan Miller excluded.

[Stoner]

I wouldn't.

I would blame Kennedy for skating with his head down. You want to drop your head, turn with the puck in your own zone and skate like it's the Swedish elite league? This is the NHL, you should get blasted.

It was a beautiful, clean, open ice hit...I don't need to see hockey players wearing skirts like NFL QB's.

 

You mock the Sabres in your posts for the "new found" accountibility and nastiness. You then turn around and call out the most physical play of the night. I'm fully convinced you'll complain about anything, anyone on this current Sabres team.

 

OK, fair enough. Head shots and players lying in a dazed state on the ice don't need to be part of my entertainment menu. If it gets you off, great. This league will constantly entertain you, while the few fans like me will constantly complain. Who's making a better use of his time? Congratulations.

[deluca67]

The lack of an immediate response can be pinned on the players on the ice at the time, but the fact that nothing followed has to be on Ruff. It's his strategic decision to make. Are you willing to give up two points to make a point? Which means more in March? Do you think even an aggressive response would stop cheap shots in the future?

Yes! Just as I believe that if the Sabres would have addressed Miller getting run all night in Ottawa Scott Gomez wouldn't have run him and injured Miller costing the Sabres a chance at the playoffs.

[deluca67]

Let it go. The hit on Myers wasn't overly aggressive. It was just awkward. That's why he went down and that's why nobody responded at the time. You can relax, everything that needed to be responded to was responded to last night,... Oh yeah, and they won.

Why wold that matter? Your teammate is down on the ice. Why would anything other than going at the player responsible cross their minds. Here we are in a "new" season facing their first opportunity to show that things have changed and teams will not be allowed to take shots at the Sabres and what happens? Nothing. That's disappointing.

 

They did win. They squeaked out a win against a team that played the night before coming off four days rest. I looking really hard for differences between this team and the previous two seasons. All I can come up with is Myers and the Grier-Gaustad-Hecht line being a solid third line.

[...]

I wouldn't.

I would blame Kennedy for skating with his head down. You want to drop your head, turn with the puck in your own zone and skate like it's the Swedish elite league? This is the NHL, you should get blasted.

It was a beautiful, clean, open ice hit...I don't need to see hockey players wearing skirts like NFL QB's.

 

You mock the Sabres in your posts for the "new found" accountibility and nastiness. You then turn around and call out the most physical play of the night. I'm fully convinced you'll complain about anything, anyone on this current Sabres team.

 

 

I have to agree with this. If the tables were turned, one of the Sabres would have been hit likewise. There are nasty hits all over the league - most of them are legal hits. Kaleta's hit was nasty, but legal. If the Yotes or the refs thought it was not legal all we'd be hearing about right now is how the league is reviewing the play and may discipline Kaleta.

 

I often think some people are expecting everything around them to somehow turn into an idealized dreamland. Regarding the Sabres, this would be a "tough" team that doesn't have to fight or hit, their "toughness" somehow being enough of a factor where they don't actually have to exert it. And then they're looking for 4 or 5 point blow-outs every game, and every goal is highlight reel material.

[SwampD]

Why wold that matter? Your teammate is down on the ice. Why would anything other than going at the player responsible cross their minds. Here we are in a "new" season facing their first opportunity to show that things have changed and teams will not be allowed to take shots at the Sabres and what happens? Nothing. That's disappointing.

 

They did win. They squeaked out a win against a team that played the night before coming off four days rest. I looking really hard for differences between this team and the previous two seasons. All I can come up with is Myers and the Grier-Gaustad-Hecht line being a solid third line.

Just by what you've written in this post tells me that no matter what anyone says, your view will not be changed and you just don't get it. You've been beating this "retribution" drum forever and it's absolute crap. Smart hockey players take a number, and when they get a chance, make the player pay DURING play. It's WAY more beneficial to the team than a bunch of BS grab ass after the whistle. You said yourself that you didn't watch. That hit, in my eyes, did not require a meaningless scrum after it.

[nfreeman]

A play by Kaleta that I loved(no not the hit)...

 

Laying out to block a shot in the slot. We don't have defensemen who do this, let alone a forward. If I was Lindy, I'd show that clip over and over again in the film room and say nothing more than "This is what I call doing whatever it takes to help your team win".

Was that Kaleta? I remember seeing that block and thinking "great play" but not being able to see who did it.

 

2 others that stuck out:

 

1. Pommer breaking up a point-blank opportunity in the slot on the backcheck (I think 11 mentioned this one earlier)

 

2. TC breaking up a 2-on-1 with a diving backcheck

 

Why would any of that factor into the team's response. It sounds just like the excuses we have heard for a long time now as to why this team doesn't respond. A guy takes a shot at your rookie and nobody does anything?

Why wold that matter? Your teammate is down on the ice. Why would anything other than going at the player responsible cross their minds. Here we are in a "new" season facing their first opportunity to show that things have changed and teams will not be allowed to take shots at the Sabres and what happens? Nothing. That's disappointing.

 

They did win. They squeaked out a win against a team that played the night before coming off four days rest. I looking really hard for differences between this team and the previous two seasons. All I can come up with is Myers and the Grier-Gaustad-Hecht line being a solid third line.

As to the relevance of the comparison with Kaleta's hit: my point was simply that the hit on Myers wasn't much of a cheap shot, if at all. Kaleta's was debatable (as evidenced by the debate here). Doan's was much less so.

 

As for the differences between this team and the last 2: last year's team would've lost this game. They would've figured it was the Coyotes, they played last night, they'll be tired, etc. -- and the Sabres wouldn't have shown up. They would've mailed it in and felt entitled to the win. (This is more or less what Roy and Vanek did anyway.) This year's team played hard for 60 minutes at both ends and got the W.

 

Also, the 4th line (Ellis-Kaleta-Stafford) was much more effective than last year's 4th line.

[...]

Why wold that matter? Your teammate is down on the ice. Why would anything other than going at the player responsible cross their minds. Here we are in a "new" season facing their first opportunity to show that things have changed and teams will not be allowed to take shots at the Sabres and what happens? Nothing. That's disappointing.

 

They did win. They squeaked out a win against a team that played the night before coming off four days rest. I looking really hard for differences between this team and the previous two seasons. All I can come up with is Myers and the Grier-Gaustad-Hecht line being a solid third line.

 

You didn't even see the game. The situation is not what you're describing. You're like a broken record being played at the wrong dance.

 

The first chance they had to "show things have changed" happened during the Montreal game, if you were paying attention. And I think they did an okay job supporting Miller during that game.

 

I agree, overall, with the idea that the Sabres need more balls than they have had. However, crying and whining over every little incident, regardless of the circumstances, is going to get old really fast.