2 RFA items

[nfreeman]

Both of these guys are RFAs. Dubinsky is 22, a true center who is good at both ends of the ice and improving, 6'1, 210, and has 2 seasons in the NHL under his belt (he played all 82 games in both). He's been one of the best Rangers on the ice vs the Caps. He is already better than Dominic Moore. He has 81 pts over the past 2 seasons. Stafford has 83.

 

A team can sign an RFA for up to $2.6MM per year without giving up more than a 2nd round pick as compensation. (From $2.62MM to $3.9MM, it's a 1st and a 3rd).

 

I'd gladly give Dubinsky $2.6MM per year for 3 years, and fork over the 2nd-rounder, to get him here. I don't think I'd go for the 1st and the 3rd though, especially since the Sabres will have a pretty high pick (yippee). The Rangers would likely match, but it certainly wouldn't hurt to turn the cap screws on them a bit.

 

I think at least one NHL team might think the same thing about a $2.6MM offer to Stafford (it only takes one -- this is how Bernier got the same contract). At that point, I'd probably want the Sabres to match the Stafford offer and keep him -- but that will increase the need to unload salary elsewhere -- and I don't think it will be easy to dump Hecht and/or Tallinder. I don't think the Sabres would just let Stafford go for the 2nd-rounder.

 

If the Sabres are going to improve things up front, they should consider the RFA route. It would also be nice if they didn't get blindsided by a Stafford offer sheet.

[slapshot1619]

Both of these guys are RFAs. Dubinsky is 22, a true center who is good at both ends of the ice and improving, 6'1, 210, and has 2 seasons in the NHL under his belt (he played all 82 games in both). He's been one of the best Rangers on the ice vs the Caps. He is already better than Dominic Moore. He has 81 pts over the past 2 seasons. Stafford has 83.

 

A team can sign an RFA for up to $2.6MM per year without giving up more than a 2nd round pick as compensation. (From $2.62MM to $3.9MM, it's a 1st and a 3rd).

 

I'd gladly give Dubinsky $2.6MM per year for 3 years, and fork over the 2nd-rounder, to get him here. I don't think I'd go for the 1st and the 3rd though, especially since the Sabres will have a pretty high pick (yippee). The Rangers would likely match, but it certainly wouldn't hurt to turn the cap screws on them a bit.

 

I think at least one NHL team might think the same thing about a $2.6MM offer to Stafford (it only takes one -- this is how Bernier got the same contract). At that point, I'd probably want the Sabres to match the Stafford offer and keep him -- but that will increase the need to unload salary elsewhere -- and I don't think it will be easy to dump Hecht and/or Tallinder. I don't think the Sabres would just let Stafford go for the 2nd-rounder.

 

If the Sabres are going to improve things up front, they should consider the RFA route. It would also be nice if they didn't get blindsided by a Stafford offer sheet.

 

I like the thought, but If I'm not mistaken we do not have a 2nd rounder to give... we traded ours and the 2nd we got for Bernier for Rivet prior to the season

[shrader]

The Bernier deal is a bit more complicated than that, thanks to the Vancouver offer sheet with David Backes. That contract was nothing more than St. Louis returning serve.

[FearTheReaper]

If the Sabres are going to improve things up front, they should consider the RFA route. It would also be nice if they didn't get blindsided by a Stafford offer sheet.

 

Yes. Stafford could command any thing from 2.6 to 3.5 . If they sign Stafford to anything over 2.8,there shooting themselves in the face.

[nobody]

I like the thought, but If I'm not mistaken we do not have a 2nd rounder to give... we traded ours and the 2nd we got for Bernier for Rivet prior to the season

 

 

And doesn't the NHL have some weird rule that the pick has to be the original teams? So even if they had some other teams 2nd rounder they still couldn't use that one.

[slapshot1619]

And doesn't the NHL have some weird rule that the pick has to be the original teams? So even if they had some other teams 2nd rounder they still couldn't use that one.

 

yup, I believe you are correct on that one.

[cilevel]

Yes. Stafford could command any thing from 2.6 to 3.5 . If they sign Stafford to anything over 2.8,there shooting themselves in the face.

 

They already shoot themselves in the foot often enough - let's hope they don't move to the face. OUCH!!

 

I'm a little torn on Stafford, I really think he can turn into a solid player but at the same time, if someone offers stupid money how can we take the risk on his potential? Given many team's cap situation, I'm leaning toward the idea that Staff will not receive a large offer sheet but who knows?

[Two or less]

Yes. Stafford could command any thing from 2.6 to 3.5 . If they sign Stafford to anything over 2.8,there shooting themselves in the face.

 

So if Stafford wants $3 million per, what would you do? Let him walk?

 

riiiiiiight

[X. Benedict]

So if Stafford wants $3 million per, what would you do? Let him walk?

 

riiiiiiight

 

You let his agent shop him for an offer sheet.

[Guest]

Dubinsky actually plays like he has a heartbeat too. I'd take him over most guys on this team right now.

[SabresFan526]

If what everyone is saying will be true and that the cap will go down next year, then I don't anticipate that Stafford would get an offer sheet. Even if he does, I think the market was set last year with the Backes and Bernier offer sheets. Stafford I feel is better than Bernier, but significantly worse than Backes. So, I can't see anyone offering more than $2.5-$2.6 million for Stafford even if he went the offer sheet route. And, if that is the case, the Sabres would match that offer, no question.

 

As for Dubinsky, I'd love for him to be on the Sabres. I agree, he's better than Moore. And, it's possible to get him, however, I find it unlikely. As of right now, Glen Sather has about $42 million committed next year to about 10 players. That leaves likely $10 million to spend on about 13 players if the cap stays the same. It could very well be less than $10 million and still he needs to sign a maximum of 13 players to field a maximum NHL roster. There are some major cap problems with the Rangers going into next year, especially if the cap comes down, so it might actually be a good idea to put some pressure on the Rangers and give the $2.6 million offer sheet or work a trade that sends a 2nd and 3rd rounder to the Rangers for Dubinsky. I think the Rangers like him a lot, but they have very little money to work with and a lot of players to sign. It will be very interesting what happens there this offseason.

[shrader]

If what everyone is saying will be true and that the cap will go down next year, then I don't anticipate that Stafford would get an offer sheet. Even if he does, I think the market was set last year with the Backes and Bernier offer sheets. Stafford I feel is better than Bernier, but significantly worse than Backes. So, I can't see anyone offering more than $2.5-$2.6 million for Stafford even if he went the offer sheet route. And, if that is the case, the Sabres would match that offer, no question.

 

The market really has nothing to do with Backes and Bernier. It's tied directly into the compensation limits. So yes, any potential offer sheets will be right around those numbers as well, but it's not because a guy would be a similar player to either of these guys.

[Kristian]

Both of these guys are RFAs. Dubinsky is 22, a true center who is good at both ends of the ice and improving, 6'1, 210, and has 2 seasons in the NHL under his belt (he played all 82 games in both). He's been one of the best Rangers on the ice vs the Caps. He is already better than Dominic Moore. He has 81 pts over the past 2 seasons. Stafford has 83.

 

A team can sign an RFA for up to $2.6MM per year without giving up more than a 2nd round pick as compensation. (From $2.62MM to $3.9MM, it's a 1st and a 3rd).

 

I'd gladly give Dubinsky $2.6MM per year for 3 years, and fork over the 2nd-rounder, to get him here. I don't think I'd go for the 1st and the 3rd though, especially since the Sabres will have a pretty high pick (yippee). The Rangers would likely match, but it certainly wouldn't hurt to turn the cap screws on them a bit.

 

I think at least one NHL team might think the same thing about a $2.6MM offer to Stafford (it only takes one -- this is how Bernier got the same contract). At that point, I'd probably want the Sabres to match the Stafford offer and keep him -- but that will increase the need to unload salary elsewhere -- and I don't think it will be easy to dump Hecht and/or Tallinder. I don't think the Sabres would just let Stafford go for the 2nd-rounder.

 

If the Sabres are going to improve things up front, they should consider the RFA route. It would also be nice if they didn't get blindsided by a Stafford offer sheet.

 

It's always tough to judge a player who's still young and supposedly improving, but after this year I wouldn't mind at all if someone decided to throw Stafford an offer sheet, and take him off our hands.

 

If he gets signed to anything even remotely over 2 mill. for the next 3 years, I'm going to scream.

 

Too much money is already invested in the deadbeats, and while the jury may still be out on Stafford, we need to start spending the remaining cash on guys who WILL contribute, and not sign any more guys who MAY contribute.

[nfreeman]

It's always tough to judge a player who's still young and supposedly improving, but after this year I wouldn't mind at all if someone decided to throw Stafford an offer sheet, and take him off our hands.

 

If he gets signed to anything even remotely over 2 mill. for the next 3 years, I'm going to scream.

 

Too much money is already invested in the deadbeats, and while the jury may still be out on Stafford, we need to start spending the remaining cash on guys who WILL contribute, and not sign any more guys who MAY contribute.

I'm not happy with Stafford's streakiness either, but would you really want to unload him for a 2nd-round pick? I think that would be crazy. Now, a 1st and a 3rd is another story, and worth considering, but I doubt anyone offers over $2.6MM.

[Kristian]

I'm not happy with Stafford's streakiness either, but would you really want to unload him for a 2nd-round pick? I think that would be crazy. Now, a 1st and a 3rd is another story, and worth considering, but I doubt anyone offers over $2.6MM.

 

I agree, but is Stafford even worth that?

 

Don't get me wrong, I see the potential there, but given our penny-pinching owner, can we really afford throwing 2.6 mill. Drew's way, when you have Clarke MacArthur here as well?

 

I don't see Stafford developing into much more here unless major changes are made, and I have to believe that if major changes are in fact made, Drew is one of them since he's got some upside to him that other GM's might be willing to take a chance on.

[nfreeman]

I agree, but is Stafford even worth that?

 

Don't get me wrong, I see the potential there, but given our penny-pinching owner, can we really afford throwing 2.6 mill. Drew's way, when you have Clarke MacArthur here as well?

 

I don't see Stafford developing into much more here unless major changes are made, and I have to believe that if major changes are in fact made, Drew is one of them since he's got some upside to him that other GM's might be willing to take a chance on.

I'm fine with including him in a package for a player we really need, and I can see us trading him, but not for a 2nd-rounder, which is essentially what choosing not to match a $2.6MM offer would be. Bottom line is that he has 2 seasons in the NHL, size, strength and pretty good hands. He also has enough guts to have tackled Chris Neil after he blindsided Drury, way back before TG and LQ wrecked the team (unlike, say, Tallinder, who offered Gomez a bite of his snickers after he injured Miller). I'd be pretty surprised if Darcy let him go.

[SabresFan526]

The market really has nothing to do with Backes and Bernier. It's tied directly into the compensation limits. So yes, any potential offer sheets will be right around those numbers as well, but it's not because a guy would be a similar player to either of these guys.

While I think you are right specifically with regard to the compensation limits, I do believe to some extent that comparable players are used to determine what you would offer in salary when balancing how much you are willing to give up in terms of compensation. While comparables are the measure used in salary arbitration, I think there is some level of comparables that GMs use as part of their decision calculus for an offer sheet in addition to draft picks willing to give up and messing with a team's cap number. So, while the market has nothing to do with the offer sheets Backes and Bernier received as that was clearly a fight between two GMs among other things, I do think that their offer sheets impact future offer sheets for comparable players. I consider Stafford comparable to Bernier albeit better than Bernier, and if an offer sheet were to come, a GM would offer something in the $2.5 million range not in the $4 million range because the draft pick compensation at $4 million does not justify the return from Stafford's production. So, my argument is that production, compensation, as well as comparable salaries go into the decision calculus for an offer sheet not just compensation.

[FearTheReaper]

They already shoot themselves in the foot often enough - let's hope they don't move to the face. OUCH!!

 

I'm a little torn on Stafford, I really think he can turn into a solid player but at the same time, if someone offers stupid money how can we take the risk on his potential? Given many team's cap situation, I'm leaning toward the idea that Staff will not receive a large offer sheet but who knows?

 

Right on. He could prove to be a solid power forward. Its just the point of how long will that take? We have young talent on the rise. I dont see the need to risk paying him an undeserved rate.

[FearTheReaper]

So if Stafford wants $3 million per, what would you do? Let him walk?

 

riiiiiiight

 

Why not? Your basically taking Max off the pay roll and replacing him with Staffords money then. Theres no guarantee what type of player he'll become. Maybe he'll never play consistently. Its too early to tell. But i dont want to see the sabres locked into another 3 mil a year bust.

[FearTheReaper]

You let his agent shop him for an offer sheet.

 

There you go. Let Atlanta pick him up if it gets that far.

[nfreeman]

Why not? Your basically taking Max off the pay roll and replacing him with Staffords money then. Theres no guarantee what type of player he'll become. Maybe he'll never play consistently. Its too early to tell. But i dont want to see the sabres locked into another 3 mil a year bust.

I don't want that either, but GMs generally have to make hard decisions, not easy ones. Signing him for $1.25MM per year is an easy decision. Matching an offer sheet for $2.6MM per year -- not so easy. I have a feeling the Sabres are going to need to pay him over $2MM per year, and probably pretty close to $2.6MM, if they want to keep him. That's the decision they're going to be faced with.