deluca67 Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 I've seen enough this season that says the Sabres are nowhere near ready for a serious playoff run. Dropping three of four points to the Sens is a clear message this team just isn't ready. They need to start dumping older vets and UFAs and clear cap space for the upcoming season. Hank, Teppo, Timmy, Kotalik, Max, Spacek, Mair and Hecht should all be made available. I am even willing to put Pominville on that list. It's time for a cleansing and clearing out of the dead weight. The front office should be concentrating on adding some heart to the core of this franchise. Bring in some players willing to get their noses bloody when Miller gets run. Some players who actually wear the loses on their sleeves. This team lacks talent, heart and focus. For them to give away three points they desperately needed shows that they don't have the same drive to make it to the playoffs the fans have.
el_Polako Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 you can do both... sell a few guys and bring in a few guys... Playoffs are crazy, Miller goes on a hot streak and anything can happen. The team has enough talent to make a run once they get in, as do most teams.
deluca67 Posted February 13, 2009 Author Report Posted February 13, 2009 you can do both... sell a few guys and bring in a few guys... Playoffs are crazy, Miller goes on a hot streak and anything can happen. The team has enough talent to make a run once they get in, as do most teams. I couldn't disagree more. They are going into a game against the best team in the league and their answer for the power play woes is Matt Ellis. Take a good hard look at their roster. With the void in talent they have it's amazing they are in a top eight spot for the time being.
wonderbread Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 I hope they don't get the snot beat put of them Tomorrow night. San Jose is by far the Best team in the league. I wouldn'ty be suprised to see some chicken little commentary in the Snooze sunday. Not that I disagree. On a side note. If this team is going to lose at least lose with some heart and balls. How many times does our Goalie need to get interfered with before someone has to get hacked in there. Jarko should have been leveled the first time. Nevermind the second. Whats another penalty. It'll be better than the infamous Macaurther hook/interfere/hold. Level anyone near your tender. The Senators did to the Sabres what the Sabres should have been doing to Elliot the whole game. I didn't see one drive except for a Kaleta drive.
carpandean Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 While I don't entirely disagree that we aren't really ready to make a run -- I said before this season that I expected some improvement over last year, but we wouldn't be a real contender until 2009-10 or even 2010-11 (assuming the FO does some things right) -- however, I would make a couple of points. Right now, with every team playing some variant of the trap or at least the left wing lock, this game is won on special teams more often than not. Last night, we lost 2/8 to 1/14 last night (the third goal, 5-on-5, wasn't a dangerous play, it just squeaked through Miller.) Consider the two guys that we just lost. Gaustad is arguably our best penalty killer and Vanek has certainly kicked in some there, too. Vanek leads the league in PP goals. Vanek and Gaustad play the same position on the two PP units: right in front of the goalie, screening and deflecting. Both are big bodies (Goose has the edge there) and both have decent to exceptional hands (obviously Vanek has a big edge here.) It's going to affect your play when you lose both of you players in that position. You need someone to be there, in the goalie's face, in order for any of your perimeter guys to have a chance with their shots. So, yeah, they are scrambling to find players on this team with big bodies, decent hands and the will to stand in that spot and fight. Plus, they have to do it without diluting the rest of the PP units. They tried Stafford and Kotalik, both of whom played other spots on the PP units. Neither was too effective, but it was their first try. I'd say that Stafford has the potential to be very good there, but Kotalik is better off elsewhere. On the second unit, why not give Ellis a shot? He's big (not too tall, but ... thick) and will fight hard to stay in that spot. He won't give you the hands, but he'll fight tooth and nail. Besides, if he gets hit with a puck, it's less of a loss. Mair would have been another option with better hands, though he's got a bit of a temper and is likely to cancel the PP with penalties of his own. This team still goes as Miller goes a little too much. This means that he could get hot and carry us into the playoffs and through a round or two. Or, he could get cold down the stretch and we would miss the playoffs again. The right one or two players could help ensure a playoff bid even if he suffers a cold spell. I would definitely like to see a little of both (buying and selling), but don't expect to see any significant (big name) splashes. We won't mortgage our futures or bring in any superstars. I would prefer not to trade for too many picks, rather for either NHL players or prospects that could be ready next year. We're not going to go into full rebuild mode, so we need to start pushing next year. Edit: I forgot to add that the Sens are not as bad as their record. They've always had their three stars and some other decent players. Their new coach has them playing a new style more suited for their players. They also have a new goalie, Elliot, who is playing much better than either of their previous two goalies. He has very good numbers outside of one Washington game. They took Boston to OT and beat the Flyers 5-2 in their (Phillie's) building tonight. Had they made these moves earlier in the year, I bet that they'd be competing for a playoff spot right now.
billsrcursed Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 Edit: I forgot to add that the Sens are not as bad as their record. They've always had their three stars and some other decent players. Their new coach has them playing a new style more suited for their players. They also have a new goalie, Elliot, who is playing much better than either of their previous two goalies. He has very good numbers outside of one Washington game. They took Boston to OT and beat the Flyers 5-2 in their (Phillie's) building tonight. Had they made these moves earlier in the year, I bet that they'd be competing for a playoff spot right now. This was going to be my point. I agree that our talent level is "eh", but basing our lack of faith in a playoff run because we gave up 3 of 4 to the Sens is premature. They're starting to play pretty well and look to be in position to make a serious run (games in hand). That said, we have som dead weight that needs to be trimmed, and we also have some questions regarding our "up and coming talent" (weber, Mancari, etc.). I think Darcy will be carefully watched these next few months leading into the off-season.
tom webster Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 While I also don't entirely disagree with the notion they should do both selling and buying the notion that the two games against Ottawa somehow carry more weight then any other games is the typical over-reaction common among fans. There are simply some teams that others have trouble with no matter what the record or the situation. There is still a couple of weeks to evaluate this team but like I said in a previous post, who in the East do you think this team has no chance against?
deluca67 Posted February 13, 2009 Author Report Posted February 13, 2009 While I also don't entirely disagree with the notion they should do both selling and buying the notion that the two games against Ottawa somehow carry more weight then any other games is the typical over-reaction common among fans. There are simply some teams that others have trouble with no matter what the record or the situation. There is still a couple of weeks to evaluate this team but like I said in a previous post, who in the East do you think this team has no chance against? The games against Ottawa are the final straw not the first sign. Too many nights over the past two seasons have looked like Wednesday's performance. If this team can't muster up enough effort during a playoff push what chance do they have of actually making the playoffs let alone doing something once there. I'm tired of hearing players say it was one of those nights. This Sabres team seem to have more of those nights than any Sabre team I can remember. I ask, look at the roster and tell me they are good enough.
nfreeman Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 The games against Ottawa are the final straw not the first sign. Too many nights over the past two seasons have looked like Wednesday's performance. If this team can't muster up enough effort during a playoff push what chance do they have of actually making the playoffs let alone doing something once there. I'm tired of hearing players say it was one of those nights. This Sabres team seem to have more of those nights than any Sabre team I can remember. I ask, look at the roster and tell me they are good enough. The bolded part is undeniably true, but IMHO this comes down to leadership and mental toughness. The Sabres let all of theirs get away in FA in the summers of '06 and '07 and were left with an immature team. They added some back this summer with Rivet and Teppo, and some of their younger guys have grown up a bit this year, resulting in what is clearly a better team this year than last year. They are still pretty immature, though, and so we lose time after time to the Tampas and Ottawas of the NHL, while nevertheless beating the Bostons and New Jerseys. I think this team has plenty of talent and just needs to add another piece or 2. My wish list would be a veteran center who can score and lead, a return to form from Pommer and a healthy Connolly. Give me that, some more internal maturity and play Miller closer to 60 games than 70 and I think this team is very close to contending next year.
Guest Sloth Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 The bolded part is undeniably true, but IMHO this comes down to leadership and mental toughness. The Sabres let all of theirs get away in FA in the summers of '06 and '07 and were left with an immature team. They added some back this summer with Rivet and Teppo, and some of their younger guys have grown up a bit this year, resulting in what is clearly a better team this year than last year. They are still pretty immature, though, and so we lose time after time to the Tampas and Ottawas of the NHL, while nevertheless beating the Bostons and New Jerseys. I think this team has plenty of talent and just needs to add another piece or 2. My wish list would be a veteran center who can score and lead, a return to form from Pommer and a healthy Connolly. Give me that, some more internal maturity and play Miller closer to 60 games than 70 and I think this team is very close to contending next year. Couldn't have been said any better. :thumbsup: Pomminstein has to turn his game back on. In my opinion, he's been the biggest disappointment this year.
james duncan Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 The games against Ottawa are the final straw not the first sign. Too many nights over the past two seasons have looked like Wednesday's performance. If this team can't muster up enough effort during a playoff push what chance do they have of actually making the playoffs let alone doing something once there. I'm tired of hearing players say it was one of those nights. This Sabres team seem to have more of those nights than any Sabre team I can remember. I ask, look at the roster and tell me they are good enough. I tend to agree a little more with Webster. Ottawa just flattened the Flyboys last night. The East is up for grabs given how the Sabres have played the Bruins. Devils will end up the team to beat IMO. But see your point. If they could land the right tough D man so the kids learn from, I'd be ok selling. Way too many passengers along for the ride up front. Suspect Vanek's recovery will end up dictating whether they are buyers or sellers.
LabattBlue Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 I've posted before on this and continue to be torn as to whether the Sabres should be buyers or sellers. I DON'T want any future mortgaged for rental players. The price is always too high especially for a team that does not appear to be consistent enouogh to make a deep run. IMO...If Darcy wants to deal for a player how is under contract for 2 years or more and addresses weaknesses, almost everyone is in play. This includes all prospects, all picks and the majority of the roster players except for Vanek, Roy & Miller. In terms of being sellers, I think several players could be traded without having a huge impact on how far the Sabres go this year. Kotalik would be at the top of my list. I also think you could get good value for Tallinder. With the loss of Vanek, the offense is going to struggle and I wouldn't deal Connolly even if the intention is to let him walk at the end of the year. I'd also keep Spacek for the rest of the year and let him walk at the end of the year unless Darcy feels he can sign him to a reasonable deal which is in line with his age. My guess is that he is going to cost at least 3 mil per year. I don't think there will be a huge market at the deadline for whipping boys like Paille and MacArthur. PS The little interest there may have been in Max disappeared when he got hurt. Unless he can recover from the injury and play like gangbusters prior to the deadline, they are stuck with him.
SwampD Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 The games against Ottawa are the final straw not the first sign. Too many nights over the past two seasons have looked like Wednesday's performance. If this team can't muster up enough effort during a playoff push what chance do they have of actually making the playoffs let alone doing something once there. I'm tired of hearing players say it was one of those nights. This Sabres team seem to have more of those nights than any Sabre team I can remember. I ask, look at the roster and tell me they are good enough. I always discard Ottawa and Atlanta games when I ask myself how I feel about this team. For some reason it's always one of those nights whenever we play them. We did go 9 - 4 in January with mostly road games. I feel like two maybe even only one move could change the complexion of the team for the better. If nothing else, this team keeps it interesting. They can win...or lose...against anyone. :wallbash:
shrader Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 There is still a couple of weeks to evaluate this team but like I said in a previous post, who in the East do you think this team has no chance against? This point should be made over and over. The east sucks. Every single team that makes the playoffs out of that conference will have a decent shot at making the finals.
kingcongkorab Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 This point should be made over and over. The east sucks. Every single team that makes the playoffs out of that conference will have a decent shot at making the finals. I totally agree. I think NJ is the the team to beat right now but they always seem to peak just before the playoffs each year. I am not as down on this team as others but I agree it's time Kotalik, Max, Hank to find a change of scenary.
carpandean Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 There is still a couple of weeks to evaluate this team but like I said in a previous post, who in the East do you think this team has no chance against? Fortunately, teams that have little to no chance of making the playoffs. ;) Seriously, though, the Capitals scare me the most for some reason. The have talent and we don't match up well against them. Maybe it's just me, but we seem to have more trouble with top-heavy teams (Ottawa, Tampa, Capitals, Atlanta and Pittsburgh when the put Crosby and Malkin on the same line) than teams that are more balanced. We can't shut down a line of stars, but top-to-bottom, we can handle everyone else.
shrader Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 Fortunately, teams that have little to no chance of making the playoffs. ;) Seriously, though, the Capitals scare me the most for some reason. The have talent and we don't match up well against them. Maybe it's just me, but we seem to have more trouble with top-heavy teams (Ottawa, Tampa, Capitals, Atlanta and Pittsburgh when the put Crosby and Malkin on the same line) than teams that are more balanced. We can't shut down a line of stars, but top-to-bottom, we can handle everyone else. Fortunately for anyone who runs into the Caps, they have Jose Threeorfour in net.
shrader Posted February 13, 2009 Report Posted February 13, 2009 Nice. I wish I could take credit for that one. I think it's Red Wings fans that have been throwing that one around for years.
el_Polako Posted February 14, 2009 Report Posted February 14, 2009 I couldn't disagree more. They are going into a game against the best team in the league and their answer for the power play woes is Matt Ellis. Take a good hard look at their roster. With the void in talent they have it's amazing they are in a top eight spot for the time being. and tonight they beat the best team in the NHL.... so i guess it can be done.
jad1 Posted February 14, 2009 Report Posted February 14, 2009 The whole concept of being a "seller," where you trade veterens for valued prospects, really doesn't fit the Sabres. The guys with the best value, Roy, Pominville, Stafford, Sekara, should not be traded for prospects. If you trade any of these guys, the Sabres should get equal or better (as part of a package) value in return. They have a bunch of scrubs, Afinogenov, Paille, MacArthur,Tallinder, who will not bring much return in the market, and can be traded away for other mid-level guys, which really doesn't fall under the category of buyer or seller. The guys who could be considered candidates for sale are Rivet, Kotalik, Teppo, Lydman, and Hecht. And aside from Rivet, who Regier would be insane to trade none of these guys are going to warrant a top notch prospect. Without having a guy like Borque, Tkachuck, Ryan Smith, or Sundin, the Sabres aren't really in a position to "sell." They may make some (low) value trades, especially to shed guys who are in the last year of their contract, but they're not going to be able to restock Portland with quality prospects with what they have to offer.
LabattBlue Posted February 14, 2009 Report Posted February 14, 2009 The whole concept of being a "seller," where you trade veterens for valued prospects, really doesn't fit the Sabres. The guys with the best value, Roy, Pominville, Stafford, Sekara, should not be traded for prospects. If you trade any of these guys, the Sabres should get equal or better (as part of a package) value in return. They have a bunch of scrubs, Afinogenov, Paille, MacArthur,Tallinder, who will not bring much return in the market, and can be traded away for other mid-level guys, which really doesn't fall under the category of buyer or seller. The guys who could be considered candidates for sale are Rivet, Kotalik, Teppo, Lydman, and Hecht. And aside from Rivet, who Regier would be insane to trade none of these guys are going to warrant a top notch prospect. Without having a guy like Borque, Tkachuck, Ryan Smith, or Sundin, the Sabres aren't really in a position to "sell." They may make some (low) value trades, especially to shed guys who are in the last year of their contract, but they're not going to be able to restock Portland with quality prospects with what they have to offer. I wouldn't consider Tallinder a scrub from a trade point of view. I think trading Hank and Kotalik at the deadline would bring a nice return without hurting the current season in a big way.
DR HOLLIDAY Posted February 14, 2009 Report Posted February 14, 2009 I am not ready to give up on this team........I think the Sabres can do some damage in the playoffs...... :beer:
BamBam Posted February 14, 2009 Report Posted February 14, 2009 I've seen enough this season that says the Sabres are nowhere near ready for a serious playoff run. Dropping three of four points to the Sens is a clear message this team just isn't ready. They need to start dumping older vets and UFAs and clear cap space for the upcoming season. Hank, Teppo, Timmy, Kotalik, Max, Spacek, Mair and Hecht should all be made available. I am even willing to put Pominville on that list. It's time for a cleansing and clearing out of the dead weight. The front office should be concentrating on adding some heart to the core of this franchise. Bring in some players willing to get their noses bloody when Miller gets run. Some players who actually wear the loses on their sleeves. This team lacks talent, heart and focus. For them to give away three points they desperately needed shows that they don't have the same drive to make it to the playoffs the fans have. Far be it from me to disagree with you. If you look at the present team I feel that they are not close enough to making a serious run (Deep into the playoffs) which would justify them giving away our future to bring in a player or two. However...when looking at some of the names you mentioned as tradeable players I wonder what the team would be able to get back for them. Are there teams out there that want some of the older players that we would look to move? What true value do they have? About Pommer... I feel he should be apart of that list as well, but you can't trade him when his value is low.
spndnchz Posted February 14, 2009 Report Posted February 14, 2009 Besides geting beat last night, I see Lydman as a good d-man, blocks shots all the time, good positionally. Does have a tendency to try and block shots and ends up screwing up Miller sometimes (see last night again) but I want him to stay, especially at 3.1 million next season. Notwithstanding bringing in another guy like Rivet, net clearer.
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