More frustrating player: Afinogenov or Kotalik?

[SabresFan526]

I wonder if these guys read this message board because they both had really good games last night. Max, especially assisting on all three goals and Kotalik with the game winner in OT. If these two can play like they did last night every night, I expect a really good offensive season for the Sabres.

[inkman]

I wonder if these guys read...

 

Fixed. :thumbsup:

[Bmwolf21]

I'll be the contrarian on this one. Although I like Al, he has a "quality" that I find at least as frustrating as any of Max's flaws. Here it is: he doesn't seem to play with any fire in the belly. For example, he's one of the biggest, strongest guys on our team, and, although he forechecks pretty well, he NEVER goes flying into a scrum to defend a teammate. He never gets PO'd when someone takes liberties with Miller or Vanek or Roy and knocks them down. Has he ever been in a fight? On those rare occasions when there's a group square-off, Al is so clearly going through the motions that it seems he doesn't give a crap.

 

Say what you will about Max and his blind drop passes at the blue line, but he doesn't shy away from the after-the-whistle scrapping, and he sticks up for his teammates immediately and feistily.

Good point on Al's MIA "fire in the belly." He's shown flashes in the playoffs of that "bull in a china shop" ability, but it's too few and far between. He could be an absolute terror in front of the net and along the walls.

 

All that being said, my vote still goes to Max. While I like the occasional after-the-whistle scrap, Max is supposed to be one of our skill players, and I don't want to see a skill player taking a dumb penalty or getting hurt with a broken hand or concussion. He takes dumb penalties, has bad turnovers, and generally freelances so much that his linemates seem consistently surprised by what he is doing.

 

I really hope they trade Max and move on. If they don't I hope he proves me wrong and I'll gladly eat a serving a crow if he returns to his "New NHL" form.

[Guest Sloth]

I still have the hope that he'll return the level of play he had before last season. Max was VERY good and you simply just don't lose talent. Last year he dealt w/ injuries and you know that had an affect on his team chemistry, his endurance, and his "feel" for the game. People do get rusty. I also think a lot of pressure was put on the guy last year for team leadership. That type of pressure won't be on him this year, so I think Max will be able to play w/ more confidence. People have written this guy off after one disappointing season. People have forgotten what Max has done in past. People pull 180's on their opinions way too fast.

[stenbaro]

Good point on Al's MIA "fire in the belly." He's shown flashes in the playoffs of that "bull in a china shop" ability, but it's too few and far between. He could be an absolute terror in front of the net and along the walls.

 

All that being said, my vote still goes to Max. While I like the occasional after-the-whistle scrap, Max is supposed to be one of our skill players, and I don't want to see a skill player taking a dumb penalty or getting hurt with a broken hand or concussion. He takes dumb penalties, has bad turnovers, and generally freelances so much that his linemates seem consistently surprised by what he is doing.

 

I really hope they trade Max and move on. If they don't I hope he proves me wrong and I'll gladly eat a serving a crow if he returns to his "New NHL" form.

I have watched 5 practices and 2 games now and I gotta tell ya he is by far way more into the game than he was last year..He is practicing at a fever pace and he is playing that way on gameday..The more I see him play this year I really gotta believe something was amiss last year..I think he is going to have a pretty good year and the only way they trade him this year is if they are out of the playoffs at the deadline..The only other way I see him getting dealt is if some team watches him play and decide they want him now and ante's up bigtime..He has too much speed to give away

[Bmwolf21]

I know there are a lot of Max fans on here, because it's hard not to like a guy with that kind of speed and arguably that much talent. But let's be fair - he's had 1 1/2 good seasons out of eight. It's not like he's been putting up a point-per-game every year and then was bitten by the injury bug for one year. It's been two straight years of missing a ton a of games and production dropping like a stone. And it's been mentioned before, but bears repeating - his best stretch in the NHL was right after the lockout in the "no-touch defense" new NHL.

 

Think about that for a second -- outside of the two "New NHL" seasons Max has never scored more than 40 points in a season.

 

As the league has gotten away from the New NHL/no-defense style, Max has returned to what I think is his true form - a 45-50-point scorer who is irresponsible defensively, freelances too much, and is more often than not a liability rather than an asset.

[stenbaro]

I know there are a lot of Max fans on here, because it's hard not to like a guy with that kind of speed and arguably that much talent. But let's be fair - he's had 1 1/2 good seasons out of eight. It's not like he's been putting up a point-per-game every year and then was bitten by the injury bug for one year. It's been two straight years of missing a ton a of games and production dropping like a stone. And it's been mentioned before, but bears repeating - his best stretch in the NHL was right after the lockout in the "no-touch defense" new NHL.

 

Think about that for a second -- outside of the two "New NHL" seasons Max has never scored more than 40 points in a season.

 

As the league has gotten away from the New NHL/no-defense style, Max has returned to what I think is his true form - a 45-50-point scorer who is irresponsible defensively, freelances too much, and is more often than not a liability rather than an asset.

So who do you propose they replace him with?

[Stoner]

This is Max's ninth year with the Sabres. I take it that means he brings enough to the table that he's an asset for this team. Anyone can tell you what that asset is -- but he's far from a perfect player. I just don't get the "the guy's a bum, let's trade him for a bag of pucks" sentiment. I'm looking for a good year from the guy.

 

As for Kotalik, he's never going to be that "energy guy" who throws his body around and gets in scraps. He has done it and can do it, but in the words of Roby, it's just not in his breadbasket or gullet or piehole or whatever. He's got the Ketusha Rocket, and that's his thing.

 

These are very good role players in a different sense of the word. Instead of kicking them to the curb, I think Darcy and Lindy are intent on getting them back to previous form.

 

Neither frustrates me.

[Bmwolf21]

So who do you propose they replace him with?

Who? ANYONE.

 

I'd rather see Gerbe in there than Max.

 

Max is mostly hype and unrealized talent.

[Bmwolf21]

This is Max's ninth year with the Sabres. I take it that means he brings enough to the table that he's an asset for this team. Anyone can tell you what that asset is -- but he's far from a perfect player. I just don't get the "the guy's a bum, let's trade him for a bag of pucks" sentiment. I'm looking for a good year from the guy.

 

As for Kotalik, he's never going to be that "energy guy" who throws his body around and gets in scraps. He has done it and can do it, but in the words of Roby, it's just not in his breadbasket or gullet or piehole or whatever. He's got the Ketusha Rocket, and that's his thing.

 

These are very good role players in a different sense of the word. Instead of kicking them to the curb, I think Darcy and Lindy are intent on getting them back to previous form.

 

Neither frustrates me.

I can't recall Regier coming out and all but saying they were looking to trade a player before he said that about Max. I've never heard him say that a current Sabre might need a change of scenery. As for Lindy - well Max has been in his doghouse more than once. I think he'd rather trade him and be done with it.

[stenbaro]

Who? ANYONE.

 

I'd rather see Gerbe in there than Max.

 

Max is mostly hype and unrealized talent.

I stiil would take Max over any other winger in the minors we have now..Mancari might be a nice change of pace to switch up with max when you need some size...

[Stoner]

I can't recall Regier coming out and all but saying they were looking to trade a player before he said that about Max. I've never heard him say that a current Sabre might need a change of scenery. As for Lindy - well Max has been in his doghouse more than once. I think he'd rather trade him and be done with it.

 

Wow, you're inside the lockerroom and Lindy's head. You get around.

[Bmwolf21]

Wow, you're inside the lockerroom and Lindy's head. You get around.

Wow, and you're still being a jackass. You don't get out much, do you.

 

EDIT: In fact, I think that's it. I'm done with you for now. I tried to respond with what I thought was a well-thought-out response to your post, and you once again chose to be a smartass. Welcome to the ignore list.

[Stoner]

Wow, and you're still being a jackass. You don't get out much, do you.

 

OK, Mr. 4,518, soon to be 4,519, Posts.

[nfreeman]

Wow, and you're still being a jackass. You don't get out much, do you.

 

EDIT: In fact, I think that's it. I'm done with you for now. I tried to respond with what I thought was a well-thought-out response to your post, and you once again chose to be a smartass. Welcome to the ignore list.

 

I'm calling BS on this. I see a resumption of barb-tossing in short order.

[Bmwolf21]

I'm calling BS on this. I see a resumption of barb-tossing in short order.

Nope, not this time.

 

You have chosen to ignore all posts from: PASabreFan.

 

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[carpandean]

Nope, not this time.

Oh man, you should see what he wrote. Wow, I can't believe he went there. That's just low and uncalled for, not to mention gross.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Curious aren't you? It's just killing you not looking, right? Come on, you know you want to!

 

 

:nana:

[Bmwolf21]

Oh man, you should see what he wrote. Wow, I can't believe he went there. That's just low and uncalled for, not to mention gross.

Curious aren't you? It's just killing you no looking, right? Come on, you know you want to!

:nana:

:lol:

 

Not anymore. :bag:

[wjag]

You have chosen to ignore all posts from: PASabreFan.

 

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Nope, not this time.

That's like ex-communicating him... He still has my favorite quip of the year when he referred to a banned troll as being hauled off to Gitmo...

[Stoner]

Damn, this is like a breakaway on an empty net.

 

I got nothing here.

 

It's no fun doing it alone.

[carpandean]

Damn, this is like a breakaway on an empty net.

Those aren't as easy as one might think (see 0:19):

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qet0ACXEmQs&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qet0ACXEmQs&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[nfreeman]

Damn, this is like a breakaway on an empty net.

 

I got nothing here.

 

It's no fun doing it alone.

 

Well, it all depends on your technique...

[Kristian]

Those aren't as easy as one might think (see 0:19):

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qet0ACXEmQs&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qet0ACXEmQs&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

 

Without having the faintest clue of any similar situations, I seriously believe there are only two players this could ever happen to : Patrik Stefan, and Alexandre Daigle.

 

Talk about busts with a capital B.

 

And it's not like he misses the net on a poor shot - The puck takes a hop, but then he panics in turns it over when all he should've done was take it round the net, and stuff it in the other side. At least hold on to it.

 

Anything but that desperation move he tries.

[R_Dudley]

:lol:

 

Not anymore. :bag:

 

Damn, this is like a breakaway on an empty net.

 

I got nothing here.

 

It's no fun doing it alone.

 

:thumbdown: Allright kids can't we all just get along and disagree without taking it personal ? :rolleyes:

 

Besides as an infrequent poster but constant reader as many other's, your reparte is enjoyable for other's to read. :D

[spndnchz]

:thumbdown: Allright kids can't we all just get along and disagree without taking it personal ? :rolleyes:

 

Besides as an infrequent poster but constant reader as many other's, your reparte is enjoyable for other's to read. :D

I have no clue what is going on here, all I see is

You have chosen to ignore all posts from.....

:nana: