JohnC

When I look at the list of young players that you presented the issue becomes how long is it going to take before the critical mass of these young players become a factor with the Sabres. Next year, I see an infusion of half a dozen players (including Tuch to this group) that will reshape this roster. In my estimation it will take another year or two for those players to become more established. When I look at the sparse crowds in the arena I'm just hope that the organization does something like upgrading the netminding to accelerate the rebuilding process and give the fans something to hold on to.

You two are a couple of the more knowledgeable hockey people here. You don't have to like the person to engage with that person. When it gets to the point where it gets personal then it is time to stand back and let things cool down. Sometimes when strong-willed and opinionated people duel it gets more heated than necessary. Very often you learn more from people you disagree with than with people you agree with. You just have to listen harder and dig through to what is actually being said. And you know very well that on a few occasions I have been the target of your bombardments. On those occasions you pissed me off! But I stood back and let the embers cool. I'm glad I did. The point here is that you don't have to go to the wall on every point you disagree with, especially when it is with someone you have some animus toward. I appreciate @Taro T and your contributions. That is not to say that I always agree or am happy with the sharp retorts given back. The operative word for the day is: Tolerance. I apologize if I come off as preachy or sanctimonious.

I read @Taro T and your comments about Levi's ability to handle rugged play. I agree more with your take than with his take on the player. But that isn't the problem with the exchange here. In my opinion you framed your response to him in a hard challenging way that wasn't required. If you would have asked in less pugnacious/antagonistic way to elaborate as to why he felt that Levi was more vulnerable than bigger goalies the response back would have been less sharp. Very often in a dialogue the tone can drown out the point. I believe that is what happened here. It can't be denied that the stature of a goalie has become an important consideration when evaluating prospects. In the NHL of today most franchises prefer bigger goalies than smaller players. That's one of the main considerations when evaluating the position. The issue is more related to how the position is played in today's NHL than it is related to durability. However, it can't be denied that Levi's play has been outstanding in college. And it isn't a stretch to believe that right now he might be our best goalie prospect in the system.

As you point out Tanev basically out-muscled him and Dahlin struggled to keep up. He's certainly not a finished product. And he has the raw skills where there is more room to grow. From my vantage he's the least of this team's problems. There are occasions where our defense puts the goalie in a vulnerable situation; and there are situations where the goalie doesn't do enough to support the defense. This team needs more additions starting with the backstops.

I simply don't see what other people are seeing when evaluating Dahlin. It is obvious that he had some lapses last night that proved costly. But overall when you review how he has played thus far he has played very well. What I have seen in his game is less razzle dazzle and simpler and more efficient play. He is playing a lot more disciplined game. In my eyes that is a progression. There is a broader context that needs to be considered when evaluating him. It shouldn't be forgotten that he is playing on a less than fully staffed team. Thus there is less support and more individual exposure. A lot is being asked of him. He is playing more minutes than he probably should at this point. A lot is being asked of this young defenseman and for the most part he is holding up reasonably well.

I also want an upgrade in goaltending. I don't know anyone who has stated otherwise. Putting aside the goaltending issue last night's game demonstrated to me that there was a clear difference in effort between the two teams. I'm starting to see it more and more as the losses mount. I'm bothered by it. I'm hoping that trend doesn't continue. I've attached a WGR link that includes a 10 min segment with Granato. He talks about the game, Dahlin and the injured players. He seems to believe that this faltering is all part of a learning process. I'm a strong believer in Granato as a coach for this team in this rebuilding situation. There's just a long way to go. One hurdle at a time. https://www.audacy.com/wgr550/authors/howard-and-jeremy

What was most disappointing about this game was evident right from the beginning: Seattle had more energy and was forcing the play. They were a road team at the end of a long cross country trip while we were at home. Yet they played with more vigor. The home record for the Sabres is dismal. They are playing in an arena that is 3/4s empty while on the road they are playing in front of near capacity and enthusiastic crowds. (Not blaming the customers.) My fear is that the mounting losses accumulated over the past few years will dispirit our young core as it did with our previous young core that was dispatched. The truth of the matter is that there isn't enough talent on the current roster. What's positive and provides some hope is that there are some young players in the pipeline that are close to being ready to move up. But my concern is that this steady stream of losing will mushroom into a malaise as it did under Krueger. I'm hoping that the return of Mitts, and a little later Tuch, will help to jolt this lackluster playing team . My big worry is that the psychology of losing infects the young core as it did with the previous core.

Will Laaksonen make the roster next year? What's his style of play? If Power, Samuelsson and Laaksonen are on the roster next year that's quite a young group on the blue line. If you add them with Joki and Dahlin you are looking at a unit with a lot of young players.

What's apparent is that the label that Olofsson is basically only a PP scorer and spot shooter no longer applies. He's become a full-length player who is developing a well-rounded two-way game that includes good passing. He made one pass to Tage that gave him a gaping open area to score on. Another young player that I'm impressed with is Asplund. He's become a solid NHL player and one of our most consistent players. There is little flash in his fundamentally sound game. I'm hoping that when Mitts gets back he continues on with the progression in his game like these other young players. As @dudacek and others have stated not only is Okposa is currently one of our better players but he is also a positive influence on the youngsters. He's embracing a mentoring role that not all veteran players are keen on doing. He's classy leader and person. There isn't a player I admire more on this team than him.

My observations are very similar to @Norcal and @dudacek's observations. This is one of the best games I have seen Skinner play from an all-around game. He made some nifty passes that contributed to Tage scores. And what is even more appreciated is his consistent effort along the boards and tracking his man. There has been a lot less floating and a lot more play within his unit. (Coaching matters.) And repeating what others observed in this game I liked the play of Eakin. He's possibly our most tenacious player. It took a year to understand why he was signed. The time off due to injury didn't seem to hurt Joki's game. I thought he was our best defenseman in this game. He logged a lot of minutes. He's not a flashy player so much as an efficient player. When the Sabres get good goaltending without the soft goal mishaps this team can keep up with the opposition even against the more talented teams. Tok was very efficient and I thought the defense played well around him. If you are a Sabre fan you are not in a position to disparage any other team. But Montreal was very lackluster. It seems as if their players are just going through the motions. They already look like a demoralized team. A win against Detroit would be big especially when the next game is against Seattle. It would be terrific to string some wins together.

What was even worse than the mounting losses under Krueger were the steady stream of blah games. It just sucked the life out of the audience. At least under Granato not are the players more energized after the life had been sucked out of them but watching them has become more than palatable. For now that might be acceptable but the wins need to follow soon.

As a coach Granato's forte revolves more around the psychology of developing players more than it does around systems. You are right that from a starting point he places more emphasis on offense, and then builds from there. Interestingly, he noted that he was also in the business of entertainment and was conscious in providing a style of play that highlights that aspect of the game. No one can deny that even with the mounting losses this is a more entertaining team than from the past.

Within this WGR link is the 15 min interview with Granato on the Howard and Jeremy show that you are alluding to. He has strong beliefs in how to develop players and improve teams. He's certainly doesn't have an old school hockey approach to the game. https://www.audacy.com/wgr550/authors/howard-and-jeremy

Your observation about the overall effort is spot on. No problem with that. But as you point out when the goaltending is so substandard (acknowledging that up to recently it has been solid) it does affect how your team plays, especially in your own zone (as you noted). In the games that the backstopping is good this team is competitive even when it is apparent that there is an imbalance in talent with the opposition. My worry is that the psychology of losing becomes more damaging on the younger players that you are counting on for the future when they haven't had any experience with the psychology of winning. The Sabres are clearly in the rebuilding mode with some good young pieces already on the roster. What bothers me, as it does most others, is I don't see what short term options there are to at least for the present stem the tide. What also bothers me is when the Sabres play at home they are playing in front of 3/4 empty arena. However, when the Sabres are on the road they are usually playing in front of a near capacity crowd. The Ranger game was an example of that. (I'm not telling you anything you don't already know because you regularly attend the games.) I'm not blaming the fans because they are expressing their dissatisfaction with their wallets. But it has to be deflating for the players when they take the ice.

Washington worked a pre-expansion draft deal with Seattle for them to select one of their goalies and then trade the player back for a second round pick. With a little creativity maybe we could have worked out a deal with Seattle in advance to select one of the exposed goalies and then use a draft pick for the selected player. Getting a better solution is preferrable over getting a predictably inadequate solution.

From a future perspective I have the same positive outlook that you have. That is to say that a foundation is being built with its young players. My biggest worry that has happened before with our core players is that systemic losing becomes corrosive and dispiriting. That is exemplified by ROR, Jack, Reinhart and Risto all becoming emotionally and psychologically fatigued by the constant losing resulting in each of them desperately wanting out. Each player had somewhat different situations but at its core the issue was losing and the inability to envision a change in that dynamic in the near future. As you point out the expected shaky goaltending (after some quality goaltending) is starting to manifest itself. The fear of contaminating the rest of the roster which you allude to is a big worry. What is the short-term answer? I don't know. This is an issue that is usually addressed in the offseason. The GM didn't have an adequate fallback position with regards to Ullmark. That oversight is a costly mistake that can reverberate throughout the rest of the roster.

Dahlin's soft back pass to Tage which put him in open space on his score was nifty. Dahlin seems to play a tighter and less free wheeling game than he has in the past. In my eyes he is playing a much more mature game. I hope he doesn't get discouraged with the mounting losses to better teams. I don't understand why anyone would single him out as a detriment.

After I saw the replays of the disallowed goal I didn't understand the call made against Eakon. It was such a marginal call because Eakon was being pushed by a Ranger and I didn't see much contact. I also thought that the Sabres had enough control of the puck when Ranger's scored after the penalty call. I thought Cozens touched the puck and our goalie did also. The Sabres have a lot less margin of error than most teams. Those calls were crushing. There is no hiding the fact that when a more talented team makes a push against a less talented team that ultimately talent prevails. That's what happened here. And that's exactly where we are at.

He ended up playing better than a number of pro players on that team.

When Power was on the World team with top tier pro players he started as a fringe defenseman. Based on his play his role increased and became a first of second pairing ?? player who got a lot of minutes in high pressure situations. He will undoubtedly earn a roster spot and important role with the Sabres in his rookie year. That's why he was the first pick in last year's draft and is shining in college.

Starting with this year I have felt that this is a three year rebuild. Assuming that the bumped up players don't get a NHL role that's ahead of their developmental stage it falls within the approach how most successful teams handle their prospects. Krebs was the top prospect in Vegas's system and was getting playing time with the big club. Samuelsson got some NHL time last year (and performed well) and probably ?? was going to make the roster with the Sabres this year before he got hurt. Quinn, JJ, along with Krebs will be getting a lot of playing time this year in the AHL. So it is unfair to say that they were rushed beyond their stage of development as happened with Mitts and Tage. So as you and others have projected it is likely that a half dozen of young (new) players will be on the roster next year. (I'm including Tuch to the list.) And as others have emphasized the big issue determining success to this rebuild deals with our near term goaltending situation. That's a big challenge that the GM has to address.

Why do you find it improbable that your list of young players won't make the Sabre roster next year? Which one would you exclude? Their roster spot is not automatic (maybe except for Power). Just because they move up the ranks that doesn't mean that they will automatically be thrust in top two line or top pairing roles. It's likely next year there is going to be an infusion of young talent. If the players in question are not ready they won't be called up until they are ready. That's how it works and that has been the declared plan. So it shouldn't be surprising.

Your comment is exactly the same comment that KA made when after he traded for him and then had him start off in Rochester. As you noted the GM wanted to get this young player comfortable in his new environment and give him a lot of playing time. Sometimes we forget how young some of these players are and the challenges they have to face dealing with being uprooted.

Excellent analysis. The one sentence that struck a chord is the sentence about the coach's ability to solve problems. Moving Tage to center was a terrific decision that not only better utilized Tage's talents but also addressed a critical position for this team. And how the coach has handled Skinner and put him in a position to succeed was masterful. He took a player who was buried by the prior coach and has gotten him revitalized as a player. In yesterday's game I thought that even though he didn't score a goal this was his best game. Salvaging a player that is not a factor and turning him into a factor is like bringing in a player from the outside to bolster the team. I can't say enough positive things about the coach.

It seems that Dahlin is simplifying his game instead of playing a more flashy style of play where he carries the puck for longer stretches. It's a more fundamental and mature approach to playing the defense. I, as you do, like his play. As you noted I was surprised that he was able to stay of the ice after getting hit with the puck. He was clearly hurt but stayed in the fray. That's to his credit.