Marvin

What is sad is that Dahlin routinely made better plays than this and was more confident and decisive when Housley was his coach. I would be up with PH as an assistant with Boudreau if that's what it takes...

Mighty mighty.

IMHO, you are right. The only thing that has a chance --and it may not work anyway -- is hiring a top notch, well-established, accomplished coach.

Neither Vanek nor Miller was OK initially with even a rebuild. I do not know what Pominville thought. There needed to be players who were old enough to have had success in Buffalo, young enough to have solid careers after a rebuild, fewer mercenaries, and support from management when things went well. The handling of those teams was chaotic. If there was a player worth learning from, he was out the door because he made the team too good. Some fans booed when they won. WGR taught people how to ridicule and attempt to intimidate fans like me who wanted to win. Management deliberately overpaid Strachan, Meszaros, and Benoit. The GM got upset in the newspaper and denigrated the results when they were closer to the playoffs than the basement. The team learnt its mercenary attitude during the tank. The younger players have no intrinsic loyalties to the older players, each other except within their cliques, and the organisation, whence the whole is far less than the sum of its parts. And now coaching and management...

PA FTW!

Your question is a non-sequitur. The point was that Eichel is the face of the franchise and its best player. T&KP will automatically have a say. Your reasoning is also a non-sequitur. If the GM does his best to make the best trade and the ownership says what it will, the GM can follow orders or quit. You are writing as if Pegula is the only Sabres owner to do this. That is why Gil Perreault did not win a Cup with Danny Gare in Edmonton. It is why Chris Drury was an FA on Black Sunday. It is why Mike Peca wasn't on the team in 2001 and why Hasek wanted out. IMHO, all these were at least as bad as the worst thing which T&KP's influence in Eichel's negotiations could be. I see no reason why I should expect something different from the Pegulas. I CAN hope for something better; whether I get it or not is another matter. And maybe they are persuaded. I see no reason to assume that they won't be persuaded if KA makes a good case. And maybe it will be like letting Satan and Zhitnik go for zilch while getting Teppo Numminen and Toni Lydman.

I hate to tell you this, but I think you need twice as long to correct bad development. We are talking 3 years before he becomes something he might reasonably have been projected to become.

No. he deserves it.

Question: Answer:

Honestly, that team was a lot of fun to watch once Miller, Vanek, Pominville, Myers, and a few others decided to carry the team on their backs. There were games where it seemed like these guys just willed them to victories.

They are deceptive. If you look by division, we are far and away the worst team in the division. There are several posts from @LGR4GM et al. where the Sabres are the ONLY team in our division in whatever the hockey antonym of "Gartner's Magic Quadrant" is.

I have a different perception: they were two of the fans rooting for the tank. As such, we the fans, T&KP included, were the triggering mechanism. When it comes to the tank, I put them in the same boat as we are. JMO. YMMV.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.... <vent> T&KP are ultimately responsible. They listened to the most vocal fans who wanted to be mind-numbingly horrible for multiple season, were conned into The Tank and allowed profligate spending of assets, oversaw the creation of our current losing culture, and now can't hire the right folks to pull us out of this. Let me be clear. IMHO, it is irrefutable that The Tank is THE ORIGINAL SIN of the Pegula era. We increased the odds of the decade of disaster by tanking because for at least 2 seasons, losing was not only acceptable but encouraged from management and many fans. And that mindset has contaminated the franchise since then until now. Players should not have ever got even the joking idea that players who are doing well were angling to get traded in 2013-5. Ted Nolan had every right to be angry with GMTM at the end of 2015. Dan Bylsma actually has forward and defencive depth in 2015-7. The plan of "losing to win" never enters the argument for 2017-8. Phil Housley had every right to be angry with GMJB at the end of 2019. Finally, even those who excused losing are fed up. Now a real rebuild can start. Pity it could result trading Jack, Sam, Rasmus D, Joker, et al. and a few more years of crap. But at least we are in year 1 of a fully non-tank mindset. </vent>

Why is trading Ristolainen less acceptable than Reinhart or Eichel? More posters will accept the expected minimal return for Eichel and a negligible return on Reinhart but don't even consider trading Ristolainen. IMHO, it is blindingly obvious that if you want to shake up the rotten core and/or want to keep Borgen, then you move Ristolainen. I have seen exactly one poster consider this. (Yes, if T&KP nix trading Risto in a hockey trade, then he deserves getting roasted even more.) It seems as if, in all the negativity, people forgot that entertaining stupidity is worse than having actual good players. Trade Risto for the next Richard Smehlik or, even better, Bill Hajt and I will be a happy boy.

I was about to post this. They don't want to go to the root cause of the problem below the owner and the owner's inexplicable buy-in making him responsible for the travesty we have been witnessing. Nice article on https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/the-issue-with-rebuilds.2811547/ in this vein.

I am reluctant to label any goalie as young as Johansson, UPL, etc. as a bust at their age. Dominik Hasek was 28 when he took the Sabres' job from Grant Fuhr.

I just had a PTSD flashback to the 1975 Stanley Cup Finals.

How obvious is this? I would have assumed that they have already done so.

Yes. Try this mentally. Compute your complete net worth. House. Retirement. Collectible stamps. Everything. Now, liquidate enough of it to have 1% in cash in your hands. Flush it down a toilet. Now listen to me. 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 "YOU STOOPID ****! WHY COULDN'T YOU DO THAT TO 2% OF YOUR MONEY FOR MY ENTERTAINMENT? WHAT THE **** IS WRONG WITH YOU? YOU MUST BE TRYING TO KILL PEOPLE! WHO CARES THAT IT IS YOUR MONEY! SPEND IT FOR ME! WHY DIDN'T I GET MORE?"

You can't let facts, intelligence, and common sense get in the way of an agenda. You obviously don't know any politicians.

Honest question: If you are Seattle, why would you take an unprotected Ristolainen? He has only 1 year left. He could be permanently damaged in hockey attitude from his years in Buffalo. His handling by the organisation has done more harm than good for his hockey development. Your AGM is part of the reason he had some horrible teams in Buffalo. He has terrible career analytics. You have no idea if he will ever fully recover from COVID-19. He's grossly overpaid for his performance. As a Sabres fan, regardless of what I think of him, I protect Borgen over him and don't even think twice.

I admire your courage.

I listen to the games rather than watch them now. They sounded better against the Rangers, so the Pittsburgh games will be on TV. If they keep improving, I will pay attention for more minutes on a stretch. What I hope is after the TDL, they will be as good as the 1995-6 squad in the last game at the Aud -- flawed, but working hard, with a lot of character trying to improve themselves. Have a gander at how the team developed from 1995-2001, 2001-7, and 2007-11.

We need the volume of the Pegula era with the Quality before the lockout.

That's what I would do currently. If he is not taken, what are the chances that we could bring Pilut back?