PerreaultForever

Well, we do have some agreement/overlap but two things. One, just because we rebuilt after the tank wrong doesn't mean you don't try to rebuild again. You presumably learn from those mistakes and do it right this time. Second, if Eichel has checked out, and it sure looks like he has, you really have no choice. A team whose captain has checked out and doesn't care or try is never going to win. Trade him while you still can. Yzerman endured losing years but eventually that team grew and got better. Stamkos ran off to greener pastures. The other two never had to endure this level of losing for as long. My feeling is the team asked Eichel to step up last year and he did. He had his best season. But we still lost, and so he said F... it I'm done trying. That's it, he's a quitter. Team is full of quitters. Hence, tear it down.

no new words.

We're not going to agree on this. imo we've been trying the patient addition and it doesn't work. I mean we added Skinner and that was supposed to work. Added Hall and that was supposed to work. Nothing works around this core and this team culture. What I really want to point out though is it's not like the tank at all. Then, he gutted the team to try and land 1 generational player. Then proceeded to empty the cupboard with the assumption that that was all we needed to do. It was complete folly. So, you trade Hall to a playoff team at the deadline or a little before. A 1st and a prospect seem reasonable there? You trade Reinhart. A first and a prospect and? maybe? You trade Eichel. you get ? The old offer sheet thing used to be 4 1sts I think? Lindros went for 5 players/picks/top prospects if I remember. So a top prospect maybe 3 1sts plus something like that. Risto I'm reluctant to trade but would due to the baggage. Plus lesser picks and prospects for the rest of the losers like Montour, Staal. Eakin, whoever. You see where I'm going with this? It's a much bigger treasure trove than the tank. A true chance to do it right and get the right players with the right attitude. Cozens types. You hire Gallant or some other coach who can build a hard work first culture. Lastly, there is an absolute ton of UFAs coming up and you sign a bunch of leadership hard work types to build the new youth around. We'd be competitive and have a strong foundation in 2-3 years max.

If those are the bones of a good team I think we have osteoporosis. I'm tired of excuses and losing with the same core. I want a new culture and I think the only way to get that is to tear it all down and start again building around unspoiled new talent.

I'd actually prefer if they sent them all to Rochester to make that team a winning team and save them from a year of losing culture. Gut it, start over.

Well that was 2 1/2 hours of my life I'd like back. Worst game of the year so far. Zero entertainment value (although I did chuckle once when Montour and the Philly player mixed up the sticks they both lost). So Skinner is back and as a team we were back to zero effort, quit on plays, don't even bother trying hockey. Not saying that is related, but this was absolute crap. Everybody sucked. Reinhart was back to being everything he's annoyed me with for years. Nobody leads, nobody gives extra. You know you have a serious problem when the best player on the ice (and even he wasn't great) is a guy just coming back from a major battle with covid. And there is no putting this on a goalie or a coach or any one or two players. All those would be valid points, but the entire team sucked bad. Philly walked to this victory and never had to break a sweat doing it. and I don't buy the idea that the core has lost knowing what it takes to win tough games, I think they're all a bunch of hockey karens who have never known what it takes. It's just not in their character. I feel bad for Dylan Cozens and the other kids. Welcome to losing culture.

To be fair, what does he mean by "team meeting"? Maybe all he's saying is the team gathers before practice/game for 5 minutes and after for 5 minutes. That'd easily be 100. But sure, lets keep dumping on Ralph and giving the slack players who have been here for years a pass.

Pity we're not playing Boston right now, they've lost it at least for now. Rangers smoked them.

Honestly, the bar's pretty low so they actually might. They shouldn't, but they might. I don't want to go to the kid though, he will be ruined with this D. Let him develop properly. Skinner for Bobrovsky would work for me, but I very much doubt that's an option even though Florida does have several good young goalies in their system.

I put him in the middle, mostly because it's too soon to tell. What he does with Hall (assets at the deadline?), whether or not he trades Eichel (and for what), signing or trading pending FAs, solving Skinner situation (miracle worker if he can do that) , lots and lots of big changes might be coming, or not, and to me what we look like at the beginning of next year along with how full the prospect/draft cupboard is at that point will determine my real assessment of him. I'm still not really clear on what his vision/direction for the team in terms of style etc. is. Are we in a transition or just a mess? I'm not sure.

I believe him on the first, but it's not for hockey reasons. He knows there's no way he can fit into Toronto's plans or budget so Buffalo was his closest spot close to the area of family etc. that he wanted. That was his priority, not hockey. The second I agree, he was gingerly walking around things and a lot can be read into that.

As much as he has not delivered like we hoped 5 on 5 Hall has made the big difference on the PP. He is a very good and quick passer and makes the right decision often. Adding that to what we already had puts enough weapons on at the same time that teams can't over focus on Eichel or any other one player. When they do, Olofsson is wide open or Sam is unchecked in front. We could still screen goalies a bit better but otherwise, it's a pretty lethal unit.

Skinner-Mitts-Sheahan on the ice at the same time as Jokiharju and Montour, fantasy players load up on your Philly picks.

I honestly think this is such a small difference between them it hardly matters. I'm not going to defend Kyle too much but since they consider him a veteran leader I would suggest he's a better team mate and his locker room presence is better and I would suspect they consider him a better influence on our kids. Kyle is clearly a slow burned out player, but maybe he does bring some leadership. The thing about Skinner not addressed much is why didn't he dominate on the 4th line? We match strength against strength a lot so on the 4th line when he went up against 4th lines you'd have to think if he was any good he'd put up some numbers, but he didn't. I know a lot of people here don't value +/- any more but it is worth mentioning that he is a career minus player. A lot of his stats are not that good and he does not back check, he plays undisciplined and he is a defensive liability. Skinner is a sniper, nothing more, and if a sniper doesn't score goals he is useless. Maybe it's a coincidence because of Jack's injury, but I don't like the idea that he's back after the agent supposedly meets with the GM. IF the GM has no spine and the agent gets what he wants the team is doomed.

Is it okay if I voted to bury Skinner AND fire Kreuger? I might agree with the Skinner fans if he'd even come close to playing well when he got that stint on the top line, but he didn't. He's been rubbish.

Leafs could never get past Boston and they still struggle against teams that play tougher and play better D so they will have trouble getting past Calgary (if Calgary makes it) or Montreal. They do well in that open offensive stuff like Edmonton and Vancouver. If the Leafs finish 1st I'm hoping Calgary is 4th and takes them out round 1.

You're nitpicking at nothing imo. It's highly possible he thought he was good to go but turned on it or put weight on it skating in warm ups and aggravated it which is what Kreuger would mean by saying he hurt it in warm ups. Nothing more.

Nor will Mitts. All these players are bottom 6 minutes guys. I'm not suggesting Asplund has been a star, but he's been better than I expected (based on last year). I saw a willingness to be a little physical from him and some decent defensive work. I can see him becoming a solid regular penalty killer and bottom line hard worker.

Definitely better than Thompson. Seems to be doing what the coach wants, and is better than Skinner (this year) so he stays for now. How long? Can't say, depends on his play and effort level. In that list I'd say at this point he's about even with Sheahan and Asplund whose game I also like although he brings a different style and skill set. The other guys have different skills. Eakin has been good on the D side, face offs and PK so I'm not as down on him as some are. KO is KO, just too damn slow and Thompson is ready for Rochester.

Meh, all teams lie about injuries. I see no conspiracy. I suspect it is from the Hiescher play, thought he was good to go but skating on it changed his mind. Ralph may have just worded it badly. I doubt it's anything. Eichel's been crap anyway. Ullmark injury is more important.

Disagree entirely. I think he's playing a lot better than in past seasons. It's the same, but with more confidence and aggressiveness. More assertiveness. It's taken him up a level. It's not just about Eichel's lack. I only saw the second half of this game. Looked similar to previous nights. The same better team chemistry and effort. That 4 minute PP did us in, otherwise maybe a win. idk if it's totally related, but the TEAM is definitely better with no Skinner and Mitts is doing okay.

Well, coasting in any situation really, but also taking a shot on goal from outside the slot when there's no one in front rather than driving the net. Easy pickings for the goalie and a loss of possession. Can anyone say Tage? Also not pursuing rebounds and just watching and admiring your play/shot.

They eat half the contract and he'd be tradeable for sure, but I'm not so sure he'd waive it.

Well I'm glad as I hate his game and have done since he got here. As for the timing, we're not making the playoffs this year anyway so it doesn't matter and it doesn't mean it's going to happen next week. Also, they might be looking to swap him to a team that wants offense for a stay at home D man in his place. Could be one move of many towards a different style of play from JBot/Housley hockey . If there are teams looking for D men now it's smart to explore it rather than waiting for the deadline when we might get less. We have Dahlin, Jokiharju, and maybe even Bryson. We don't need puck moving run around offensive D men. We need size and shutdown D skills.

I wouldn't disagree with this idea, only that there are limits to how much one bends or adapts the system to the players. idk if there is a point of overlapping common ground between them or if Kreuger is trying to assert dominance or vice versa but we didn't win hockey games with Housley's fast attack whatever it was and Skinner's 40 goals didn't get us to the playoffs so a more balanced approach (Kreuger) doesn't seem like a bad idea imo. Skinner's absence from #1 power plays and 3 on 3 overtimes speaks volumes imo about his lack of disciplined play as both those situations require strong positional play and teamwork as well as just skill. I just wish JBot hadn't given him a no trade with all that coin.