Curt

Yeah, he is a big kid at 6’3” but still pretty lanky at around 180-185. He definitely has some weight to put on.

Yeah, yeah, it was a glitch. Yup, uh huh, that’s what it was. ?

True that they didn’t spend years in the AHL but Point spent 2 years in juniors, Cirelli 2 in juniors and 1 in AHL. They were not brought into the league as teenagers. Most importantly, when they were brought to the NHL, they had proper support of a quality NHL team around them. Also, it’s probably true that Point and Cirelli are just flat out good and TB has drafted well.

AND he will still be 19 at the END of next season, unless Buffalo makes a deep playoff run.

Both Reinhart and Laine play RW. I don’t know if Laine was being legitimately bullied, or were the leaders just getting on him for not doing what the team needed him to do? I think the real difference for Skinner was skating next to Eichel. His RAPM charts were similar, and better in CAR in some areas. I don’t think Skinner himself was better. It just kind of makes sense that he scored more with Eichel than with Rask or whoever. CAR wasn’t just better because of better chemistry after Skinner was gone. Their goaltending was better(BIG reason), Aho took a step forward, they added Svechnikov, Ferland, Niederreiter, Hamilton. Anyway, not putting any more thought into Laine. I don’t anticipate Buffalo going after him even if he is available. Doesn’t seem like their type of player so I won’t worry about him.

Haha, I know. I don’t know if those guys are actually good leaders or bullies as dudacek phrased it. I will tell you one thing, I would rather have a team’s leadership group put one guy in his place than have rookies coming up thinking maybe they don’t need to backcheck THAT hard, because, look, Laine doesn’t do it at all.

I’m not sure who would work best with him. He is a RW though, so probably not Reinhart. I just feel like he is such a passenger, and will be expensive. If I’m going to pay a guy like one of the top 4-5 players on the team, I feel like I shouldn’t have to dream up ways to shelter him. I honestly think it can be bad for the team too, having a highly paid player out there who clearly is not putting effort into a lot of areas of the game. That’s not what I want on a young team. Maybe on a good team with established veteran leadership you can absorb a player like that more easily, but that’s not Buffalo. For this young, growing team, I want players who are self motivated, hard working, and push eachother to be better.

I don’t think it would be a terrible trade, because I think Risto is also deeply flawed, but I don’t think Laine is the type of player that Buffalo needs at all. I think I would rather hold Risto into next season and see what becomes available. Not only do I think Laine is very flawed, I also thing he is going to become very expensive to keep around long term, because Goal$. Much more expensive than the value of his overall on ice contributes. If I’m going to to trade Risto in a 1 for 1, I want someone who can be part of the team long term.

At 5 on 5 they have actually gotten incremental worse each season, and they were pretty bad to start off with.

I don’t hate Laine, but I think he is a lot less valuable than his 30-45 goals would lead you to believe, because he is pretty bad at doing things that help his teammates score goals and things that stop the other team from scoring goals. Perhaps you are right that he will become a slightly more well rounded player with age, but I think that is pretty uncertain. He has had 4 years of pro coaching (1 in Liiga, 3 in NHL) and it seems like this past season was his worst. I don’t know. He would need to want to change and it seems he may be resistant to that. Big picture, he probably is not a guy who I would want to commit big money to.

Yes, in order to be a very good team, it’s basically a prerequisite to draft and develop well. However, even Tampa went out and acquired Valteri Filppula to be a quality 2nd/3rd C for them when they were looking at entering the 2013-14 season with a 23 yr old Stamkos and unproven 23 yr old Tyler Johnson as their C’s. Just because the long term plan is to run out a C group comprised of Eichel, Mittelstadt, Cozens, Asplund, or at least to hope that most of those guys work out, that doesn’t mean that they don’t need help until they are actually ready. Added Note: Mitts basically proved last season that he wasn’t ready. I think it’s unwise to expect some sort of explosive improvement from him. His improvement is much more likely to be slow and incremental. He probably is not going to be able to drive the play and create scoring chances for Laine. I think the only one who can do that well is Eichel, otherwise you are wasting a lot of what Laine can do. Johansson playing C for Buffalo could help this situation a lot I think. No idea if that will happen though.

Favorite Sabres of all-time:  1. Dominik Hasek 2. Brian Campbell  3. Rasmus Dahlin Favorite non-Sabres of all-time: 1. Peter Forsberg 2. Scott Niedermayer 3. Connor McDavid  Least favorite NHL players of all-time:  1. Milan Lucic 2. Sean Avery 3. Marty McSorley (and any other POS who hits someone in the head with a stick while playing a game)

Because it probably wouldn’t be a $500K contract. He could probably get something like $2M in the KHL. The better guys over there make good money. I’m guessing a bit on the figure of course, but he was making $3M when he left the KHL.

If Sobotka refuses to report to Rochester, violating his contract, and instead decided to go sign somewhere in Europe, then Buffalo would be free of his contract. $0 cap hit. Cant say for certain if that’s what he would do, but it seems like a possibility.

Mantha would be a very good return for Risto. I don't think the fact that he is not a 2C changes this. There are other ways to acquire players other than trading Risto for them. Buffalo acquired Skinner for spare futures, St. Louis acquired O'Reilly for futures and a couple vets on meh contracts. A Risto trade is not the only way that a 2C could be acquired. Everyone getting tunnel vision on the idea of Risto for a 2C.

I’m just going to throw some stuff out here with regards to the size, weight, heavy, physical, aggressive convo. First of all, I want to share some basic facts about the size of NHL players. The average NHL skater was just about 6’”1, 200lbs in 2017-18. In 2014-15 the average D was 6’1.75” 205lbs and the average F was 6’0.75” 199lbs. Size has probably gone done slightly since then. https://theathletic.com/210035/2018/01/12/sizing-up-the-nhl-2017-18-nhl-teams-by-age-height-and-weight/ https://hockey-graphs.com/2015/03/05/nhl-forwards-vs-defensemen-height-weight-1917-18-to-2014-15/ Montour, Miller, and Jokiharju are all close enough to average that I don’t see their size being an issue worthy of an concern. Pilut is the only defenseman who I would label undersized. In my opinion, there are many ways for undersized defensemen, or any player, to be effective against a larger opponent. Mostly it involves being quick. Quick passes, quick stick handling, quick skating, quick decisions. Basically, you have to do something with the puck before the big guy gets on you. In the inverse situation, quickness is still key. The small player needs to get onto the big guy, and disrupt the play, before he is able to do something with the puck. In the back and forth of NHL even strength gameplay, I don’t think size is a real issue. It can definitely be overcome by being quicker. Where a lack of size can become a problem defensively is when the opponent has firm control of the puck in the offensive zone, such as when a good offensive zone cycle is established or when a PP gets set up. It is in situations like this that there are the most purely physical battles, both in the corners on the cycle and in front of the net. A quicker, smaller team can limit how often these situations occur, but of course they can not be eliminated completely. This is why I feel that any team is best served to have 1or 2 large D who can be trusted to play heavily on the PK and play important defensive mins. Guys who can physically battle in the corners or in front of the net when needed. There is a certain balance of size/strength vs other skills that needs to be met, even with these players. I’m not going to place size on a pedestal above all else, but I feel it can be very situationally important. In the case of Buffalo’s defense moving forward, we can start off with Dahlin (of course). He is 6’3” and something like 190+ right now. He should continue to gain weight and end up at 200+. He should be able be a plus, size wise, and will play heavily in all situations. Risto, if he remains on the team, adds size, but his ability to counted on defensively is questionable. McCabe plays the style I’m thinking of, but I think I would like a little more size if I’m going to sacrifice some other skills. I think the best bets in the organization for player I’m looking for would be Borgen and Samuelsson. It remains to be seen what either will be in the NHL.

I believe the situation is that if he does not make the NHL, he is still contractually obligated to play for his Liiga team. However, he can request from his Liiga team that he be allowed to play in the AHL. It has been suggested that if he were to ask, they would probably allow it. Liiga teams do not want be seen as an organization that holds players back from chasing the NHL. It is bad publicity that would have a negative affect on future signings, plus Fins want to see other Fins succeed at the highest level.

Honestly, when I wrote it, I wasn’t thinking about a trade at all, because I think there is about 0.1% chance that either of Point/Cirelli are traded. It’s likely that Risto is traded, at some point, but not necessarily for a 2C. Trades can be made that do not involve Risto. Not all trade or player discussions need to be filtered through the Risto lens. I think we are getting a little bit of a Risto-2C tunnel vision. A #1LW was acquired for low end futures last offseason, a #2RD for low end futures this offseason. Risto could be moved to acquire a 2C, and it’s fine to speculate about it, but it shouldn’t be considered to ONLY possible thing that could happen. This management group has been anything but predictable with their player acquisitions.

Ok, you don’t want to trade Risto for Cirelli. Cirelli has proven that he is at least a good #3C, to me at least. I would think long and hard about a trade centered around Risto-Cirelli. In my post, I never said to trade Risto for Cirelli though. I didn’t even mention Risto. You didn’t even mention Risto in the post I was replying to.

I don’t think he is the answer at #2C. He has a wide range of potential outcomes. His production in Liiga should be regarded pretty closely to similar production in the AHL.

Point would have a good chance of being the perfect #1C for Buffalo. Cirelli would be the perfect #2C.

Ah, but the true question is not, does Risto make VAN a lot better? The question is, does Benning think that Risto would make VAN a lot better?

He was among the worst players on the team at ES. I think only Thompson and Sobotka were worse. Okposo, Girgensons, Larsson Sheary, and ERod were all better. He performed like a 4th liner at best. That’s basically where he was at last season. If you want to take a more developmental view, he showed a lot of good puck skills and, in general, I liked the way that he played the game. I personally feel like he was a bit overwhelmed physically by the speed of the NHL. I think he will need to get stronger and faster. Good news is that’s one of the easier things to improve. Have to keep in mind that this guy was playing against high school kids 2yrs ago. He could not do a pull up 2yrs ago. I know, I know, pull ups have nothing to do with hockey, but I feel that I does say something about his overall physical development at that time. He then followed that up with a good, but not great season in NCAA. Then he jumped to the NHL. I just don’t think he was ready.

I disagree. I feel pretty confident that Pilut is a no doubt NHL defenseman.

He had only 15 points at even strength. Less than Girgensons or Okposo.