Radar

In the end both TM and DB had to go or you would be patching not repairing a problem.

I agree to a degree with this but I also think you can learn from mistakes. My hope is that they will and frankly think they will because I still believe they are fans that care. The Knox family were fans who cared but didn't have the financial resources. The Pegulas do.

A lot of fans on this board represent know it all attitudes that sit back in this armchairs and just stir things up with telling everybody what's wrong with everyone and everything except themselves. If they were to come out of the dark or their watering holes we'd find out what their huge accomplishments are. Not that great I suspect. Some on here are already criticizing what they were asking for to begin with. Please at least wait until something is done before your constant negative dribble proceeds. Man you are getting so old. Followed these teams since their inception and after awhile the fans wear things down more than the team performances.

I think you may be right. TM was saying he was also under review. In hindsight he may very well thought he may be gone. I don't think this team is facing completely overhauling the roster though.

Wildcard, are you just trying to stir the pot?

I think Murray either fell on sword for Bylsma or he just couldn't convince the owners he had a good plan going forward. This team went backwards this year.

Amen to that, brother.

Maybe they've told you already. It's the end of the season meetings as they always do. It's the media and fans who have added the element of suspense that makes us feel like we should expect something.

I'm really not ready to just accept Hamilton's account as the whole truth any more than a player or his agent.

You're assuming this, of course. I posed a similar question in another post. I am not sure the most vocal are the most knowledgeable. Forums and talk shows attract the vocal but that's not proof of being more knowledgeable. While I don't follow Harrington or read the News I find myself agreeing with most everything he wrote.

Can't say this enough, but I think up and down the roster Toronto was better to start with. We have over estimated our roster and underestimated Toronto, in my opinion. If you think Babcock is the sole difference I don't agree. I would just as soon see Bylsma out but that won't be THE answer. This team needs more than that.

And not surprised by who is pissed.

I'm pretty much here as well in my thinking.

I know Wildcard that you seem to be heavily invested in an anti Bylsma campaign but in the long run it may be best to let the Murray/Bylsma stay put awhile longer. This way if change is made it maybe new GM and that would also mean new coach. That way we sort out who has the most responsibility if things don't improve. If we are not making it player wise then we need more than a new coach. That means New GM which would mean coach change as well.

amazing how we criticize players and coaches for using cliches and we're talking about "losing the room"

By the sound of things could it be worse?

I wonder what the fans in general are thinking. I've always thought in general sports talk shows and forums such as this have more passion and probably more negativity than maybe the general or more broad based fans as a whole. If the overall fan base is representative of what is expressed here the Pegula honeymoon is not only over, it's now a nasty divorce.

I think chances are slim Bylsma is fired. Pegula would fear that would look like total chaos in his organization. By mid season next year if things don't get much better I could see Murray and Bylsma both gone.

I think and stated before that we fans underestimated the Leafs roster and overestimated our own. Having said that I believe Babcock is a very big upgrade at the coach level from us but the point difference isn't all coaching. I would be all for upgrading our coaching but our GM needs to upgrade our roster as well. I expected more than we got th I s year for sure.

A sports team is "the most important thing"? I am glad that it's not for me

Kind of agree except Bylsma is no Quenneville.

I think this post has a lot of merit. We forget how really bad we were. Bylsma is not the whole problem although I would support a coaching change if the players are just not on board with him overall but we still need several upgrades in our roster and I haven't given up on Murray's being able to pull that off.

If half the opinions expressed on this board are true then I'm very concerned about this organizationally. Carry that over to the Bills and now I'd be very concerned about ownership. I know they are still relatively new owners but I remember fans thinking if we only had deep pocket ownership willing to spend we'd be all set. Well, maybe we're seeing the problems aren't all solved by simply spending. Having said that I still feel better about the Sabres than Whaley and the Bills. I'm waiting to see what transpires thus off season. We need to upgrade our defense for sure. If problems between players and coaching is at all widespread then coaching needs to change as well.

Back to you.

I was sure you wouldn't.