Thorny

To your ending question: I suppose we’ll never know, as apparently all Adams is next year, too, is a combination of Pegula’s budget constraints and Lindy Ruff’s reshaping of the roster I cannot agree with much of any of the framing of your post relative to the extent of the “rebuild” we needed to undertake. What we’ve gotten is so far off the map in terms of futility that I’ve only become more certain over time an attempt to turn over into a playoff contender with immediacy was the correct course of action to take. I absolutely do not agree we needed a “rebuild” in 2021 the way you use the term. Jack and Sam didn’t need to be traded (and you utter revisionism on Ullmark need not apply. We could have signed him) Jack was a Sabre. Adams said he wanted to rebuild. Jack said ok trade me. Team said ok we’ll give winning a shot. Team barely gave it the old college try over an anomalific 40 game COVID season and then threw their hands up on the air and said “we are inept and can’t do it, we are going back to the rebuild plan” and Eichel was gonzo behind the guise of the injury Adams Kruger and Pegula being terrible in 2021 didn’t prove to me I wanted Adams undertaking an even longer, riskier, rebuild encompassing more of my years on this earth. Absolutely the opposite lol. 2021 didn’t prove *anything*, I cannot stress this enough. We already knew the team needed to be fixed: it did not represent any sort of evidence that a quicker fix would not have been more apropos (like how the majority of the rest of the league does it), it just illustrated that those in charge failed, and that the season was ripe with Covid related anomalies the “long form” rebuild has failed significantly more throughly and for a much longer period of time and we are still going at it you said it yourself: Adams views this year as a “blip”. An 82 game failure. The covid season was much less convincing. Why couldn’t that be a blip? We know the answer, and it’s the initial instigating issue: we ALWAYS knew it - Adams bias is the long form build. It’s what he wanted when he first took over and he was always going to find a way to get it there So no, I know we agree on the timeline to success now, that last year was a failure on expectations and the deadline for playoffs is this coming season: but I can’t agree and will never agree the plan made sense upon conception. I’ve always stuck with my opinion that it’s been a failure of execution, yes, but also conception. I hated it from “go””, I thought it was an awful idea relative to where the franchise and fanbase was (this has borne out accurate) and, again speaking for myself, the last 4 years have have been orders of magnitude beyond the previous 3 before that in terms of a horrid product to follow - - - Kevyn Adams “go for it” try with Jack Eichel encompassed all of *21 games*. I think people forget this. That’s not a reasonable sample size. It’s not even a sample size. I do not believe there’s a more salient point to be made in this discussion Also, I don’t know what you are getting at with your “3 years of considerably worse hockey.” 19-20 our total was a prorated 81 points. So, we needed to undertake a 5 year plan to get to, checks notes…84 points. What are we even doing here

No I disagree. From what I’ve heard, Adams plan to rebuild was initially going to be put into place before Eichel ever made a request, it’s indeed what spawned the request - which led to the “college try”’ 2021. I absolutely disagree that Covid year ripe with anomalies (including a hurt Jack for most of it, and a bogus Hall, and a Krueger as a result of a duped Adams and Pegula), represents *CLOSE* to a reasonable sample size of evidence a massive rebuild was necessary - a rebuild that takes 5 years to make the playoffs is NEVER necessary - but even a long form rebuild - absolutely disagree it’s why I keep saying if Adams gets canned a new GM need not elect to institute a long form plan. I do not believe it was necessary when Adams took over. Reinhart specially said he was open to a contract - according to popular opinion we bridged him due to Covid, but that certainly was a choice and didn’t need to be the case - - - We are also taking the *actual GM* thing way too far. It’s ok to score an argument point on a message board and for us all to agree the true rebuild started a year later, but Adams WAS the actual GM in 2021 lol. We’ve cemented the narrative so hard it’s like we are literally saying we can’t analyze his work that year: which would be absurd. We can agree not to “count” it for the sake of arguments but I think you are conflating it with the reality: he was still partially responsible for the construction of that win now team as well: so some of its blame falls to him

Kane being the replacement seems less absurd if you think about how Adams was probably, in his mind, debating whether it was worth making a move sooner to replace Quinn to finish second in the Atlantic rather than third. He *can’t* be so utterly nonchalant about playoffs to the extent he’d pass on a replacement (YES he could have done something) if he thought we’d be hit-miss on WC2. I just can’t believe he would be. Adams definitely thought we’d be better off keeping whatever trade asset dry in the case the injury ended up more less irrelevant to our high powered offence to use on a deadline deal for a superfluous but beneficial add a costly mistake @DarthEbriate his overconfidence was his weakness

Live look at Kevyn Adams as fans watch on from a helicopter Or is THIS a live look? We’ll have to wait until next season to find out

Absolutely. One mulligan is fair its all about playoffs in ‘25 now

It’s pretty much like in that Big Bang Theory episode (or, see also: real life) where they are sitting around making fun of phantom menace and Penny chimes in and Raj says “we can make fun of it. You can’t”. WE aren’t really part of this. WE don’t really know what we’re talking about. It was just another sad indicator of the disconnect between this regime/its players and the fan base (and probably why hiring Lindy was so important) They have no interest in claiming actual Sabres identity. Maybe we don’t have one. But if we don’t, our identity is definitely failure to make the playoffs for 13 years: which is the exact identity Adams goes out of his way to distance himself from, like with Seravali recently Even the long form plan they took was with full knowledge of and I’d argue disregard for the position the fans are in, of no playoffs: there was zero urgency to claim that and fix that: they are doing their own thing it’s been hard for me. I see the crest, but since Adams took over the team has been unfamiliar. And they’ve done it by choice for the record, I get WHY. It is difficult though. Ideally you’d think there’d be a middle ground - we haven’t seen it but Ruff is a sign it might be now here

I don’t even think it’s some nefarious thing, liger is right they take on the mindset of the organization, but they more less imbibe it: the top-down refusal to measure results in the now becomes part of a fabric of their developing identity Some recognize it and ask out Don’t forget that Jack specifically said on record he asked to be dealt *because* Adams wanted to rebuild. We didn’t have to rebuild because Jack wanted out

Such an odd vibe. Not what I expected from the group at all honestly, and I’ve had my beefs obviously. So much we are hearing is just so weird. Tuch’s comments *during the season*/playoff push on a podcast that “we are young, we’ll eventually get there.” Why? Why throw the towel in verbally when you are still in it EDIT - just realized there’s a thread for this specific discussion already, my mistake

Big part of the reason season was so disappointing is again alluded to here by KO. The bit specifically about how they “knew” in *OCTOBER* things weren’t right. So if they knew so soon things weren’t right, and they knew the locker room was feeling entitled (KA’s press conference), how did it get to a situation it went south so fast? If it was imminently obvious that quickly, presumably it was discoverable or even obvious before the season started? Why did the GM allow the situation to exist, and the fester for so long? At this point the discussion on the failure of this season is sort of getting redundant, what matters now is the coming season: it’s just disheartening we keep getting forced to come back to the analysis cause we keep getting more hard-line confirmation they really were lost right out of the gate

Chara or Logan Stanley

It’s annoying when literally any of the teams left win

It’s because everything is happening according to a clear plan. Sounds funny, but if you think about it. People are weary of his plans so in an odd way a longer process for these things with less certainty would psychology reflect better Adams is deliberate, it’s been to a fault, we’ll see which way the cookie crumbles next year

There’s not much sense looking beyond this year anyways tbh. We are either in the playoffs and we wanna keep everyone, or we miss and Adams likely gets fired and we have no idea what happens with anyone

But we’ve got the succession plan all mapped out. We are a well run franchise.

Why would they have this already mapped out? They are assuming failure? Are they assuming success? If Ruff is good, wouldn’t you keep him? Did Ruff say he only wanted 2 years?

Bruins on the ropes

He’s hit the 2 coaches mark and he’s hitting 5 years this year. Especially cause you’d expect to fall on the below average side of things considering the severely below average performance, nonetheless we reach his likely endpoint if we miss this coming season

you know what they say about responsibility

I’m not arguing against you I’m arguing with you

Than the next closest ALL TIME

I’m of the opinion we undersell this stuff due to the nature of the news cycle and our media and the scroll culture and just an overload of content. We see a tweet that shows where the sabres sit in the record books and we “ha ha” but forget about the specifics cause “ya I know we suck I’ve heard it a million times.” they have the longest playoff drought of *all time*. Just think about it for a bit. No one has been that bad, ever. In centuries. Multitudes of teams. It’s us: we are it. Hyperbole cannot and need not apply, ever we are extraordinary Our longest all time drought is THIRTY PERCENT longer than the next closest

Is this post from 2019? What page are you on? Spoiler, the drought is still going. We left colossal shite show in the rear view several hundred miles ago

I just disagree, as I’ve stated. Pegula being a terrible owner is an admittedly crappy handcuff but that’s the job: Adams took it willingly, did he not? Winning with an owner who won’t spend is still possible when winning is defined as being top 16. It’s not a hard thing to do with competence