Thwomp!

And coincidentally two the the younger posters on here. You guys have all the time and patience in the world for the rebuild to occur.

Highlight of the GDT for me. "Kinda drunk" Dudacek :w00t: Bravo!

Ah, ok I was 2000ish.

I love how I'm told I'm evaluating this trade too early, but people keep dragging me back in. Maybe I'm only being told that because I'm not evaluating it the same way as everyone else? 1) I don't particularly like Stafford or Myers. Just about any other trade(s) would have been better, especially when you add in the other 3 valuable assets we parted with. Stafford was going no matter what, so even a draft pick would have been better than the horrible trade that did occur. Myers production would be a huge upgrade this year to what we've gotten from Bogo, even including any additional "concepts". Isn't a big complaint the lack of offense generated from the defensemen on this team? 2) I want more production, not "concepts", from the players we received. If they are so superior to what we parted with, why aren't we seeing that? 3) We would be better off with Myers, Armia, Lemieux, the 1st rounder, and a draft pick which replaces Stafford. And that's sad. The trade is a negative thus far. We didn't necessarily have to part with all of that. As a rebuilding team, was it even wise to do so? Early indications are no.

Oh, I was kind of thinking that. I remember that place. Mall convenient store. I went there a few times and the prices on things sucked, but they were the only convenient store in the mall. I can't believe they paid you that little as a manager. When did you work there?

Yes, but Staff, Myers, Armia, Lemieux, and our first. I want the trade fully rescinded. They can even have Kasdorf back. Oh and to turn back time because I'd still like to unload Staff (especially him due to the expiring contract) and Myers before the deadline last year :P

Ok, I'm probably missing something easy and obvious here, but I can't figure out wtf that is? :P

OK, is it wait for the end of the season or argue now? I've chosen wait until the end of the season. I've said all I can say and more and I'm not going back in despite the fact that Liger is mischaracterizing several of my points and plain making stuff up as well. See you back here April 10th!

I worked there too and used to live right down the street from it. I was quite a mall rat while I was working through college or "taking breaks" from college.

I would love the Bogo from last year. That's not the current Bogo. Will he come back? I currently hate him because he's nothing right now: doesn't generate offense much, doesn't move the puck well, and he isn't the big, bad physical defensive presence either. I really don't know what he currently is.

My position is officially staked. OK, gents I'm off this thread until after the season. Should be less ifs, ands, or buts then. Thanks beerme for perfectly explaining the "concepts" of Kane and Bogo. Carry on with the discussion of how Kane and Bogo just have to break out at any time now. Oh and Liger, Winnipeg could easily make the playoffs again. Half a season and 4 points out is nothing. May not have improved, but they haven't slid far either. I don't know their team well, but I'm sure Ducky would have several factors on his list before he got to Stafford and Myers' play as holding the team back. How far down the list is Kane and Bogo's struggles as reasons for the Sabres' lack of success? Not nearly as far, imo.

Well at least I have company on the "maybe it's time to move on from Bogo" train. Unfortunately I can't imagine Bogo's value being very high or for Murray to unload him anytime soon.

Well it was a pretty mall at the time and probably about 1/3 occupied. Last I heard it's now a condemned eyesore with burst pipes and a leaky roof, but it's been a while since I heard anything about it.

You're putting words in my mouth. According to the large majority of stats Winnipeg is getting better production from the trade with a chance of more to come in the future. That's what I meant that they have gotten more improvement from it. One of those stats is that they're much closer to the playoffs than the Sabres are. Isolating the trade is all I'm doing. Individual performances on two under performing teams. They made the playoffs after that trade. They may be worse after the off season and so far this season, but Myers and Stafford's play has been good for them and not the reason they're worse imo. Kane and Bogo's under performances are one of the reasons the Sabres are under performing. Supposed key cogs not living up to their potential. Again imo.

I was a young man working at the mall sitting in my car on lunch break and listening to the radio broadcast. I still remember Murph exclaiming something like "That was a forward pass! They've got to call that one back. The replay review indicates that this one will be called back folks." :wallbash: Oh and it was Irondequoit Mall in Rochester. Anyone familiar with that place will know how funny that fact is.

Yep, we've improved in some (too few) areas. Not as many as Winnipeg has and they've got a bunch of futures to play with as well. I'm fine with revisiting after a full season. As I've said numerous times it'd be nice to see signs of hope with regard to this trade, but I'm not seeing it yet, and I fear it's not coming. We'll see if the "concepts" are fact or fiction at that point.

Yeah, you know, games played, goals scored, assists, plus/minus, points per game, points pace for the whole season, etc etc. Those crazy stats. If literally none of those work for you, go #fancystats. And I even like #fancystats. It's just kind of a stretch to invoke them in this case. It's like going to the 12th tiebreaker.

Just alarmed as opposed to general consensus that the trade was fine despite much evidence to the contrary. I want Kane/Bogo to turn it around. I just see no evidence that it will happen. As Liger says, "We'll never know". What we did get is not good so far. If Stafford/Myers are schlubs and are clearly outperforming Bogo/Kane, what does that make Bogo/Kane? What do they do again? Where are the results? Where are the signs of being in the "future core"? The "concept" of Kane and Bogo is getting quite strong around here. It's crazy because there's nothing to back it up. Thanks. That actually makes it a better comparison. An almost level playing field if you will. Except for one team being out of the playoffs by 4 points and one being out by 10. :ph34r: Neither pair is playing on a great team currently. One pair's stats are worlds better. That better stats pair's team also has a bunch of futures as well. Great trade for that team. Not so much for the other. When all else fails.... #fancystats

I live to please Hillary. :sick: This trade is currently so bad in my view that it couldn't have gotten any worse, so I'd be willing to take that chance. And Myers is equal in scoring to Kane and Bogo combined. And we're not getting anywhere close to enough of the physical element from them to even come close to making up for any current deficit in scoring, either. I can't believe I'm the only one alarmed about this.

Willing to do that, but a half season is a good benchmark to see where things stand. If things were going well in the Sabres favor at a half season, I'm sure we'd be positively evaluating the hell out of it and not waiting for the end of the season. See O'Reilly, Ryan and McGinn, Jamie.

Yep because a more beneficial trade couldn't have been made on the Sabres end to achieve the same result. <_<

Yet we've only gained 3 points in the standings. The Sabres have 260 more shots than last year. That means that it takes ~87 shots to gain one point in the standings. :ph34r:

1) I would rather have what Myers and Stafford would have brought us from another likely trade(s) along with still having more of the assets that we gave up. But yes, I'd rather have Myers and Stafford at this point, and I'm not a huge fan of either of them. They're playing better, they've been healthier, and they make much less in salary. 2) The Jets are already winning the trade. Anything that happens for them in regard to the futures is icing on the cake. This trade is backwards thus far. The team getting the futures isn't supposed to win the trade before the futures have come into play. The hill for the Sabres to climb to even get to even on this trade is getting steeper and steeper.

Okay, but the guys who agitate and score are great to have. Why I mentioned Marchand/Gallagher/Burrows. They all have a solid place in the league. Lemieux's ceiling is one of those guys. We don't currently have that guy in our system. But to summarize everything. I don't like the trade for several reasons. The main one being that Winnipeg is currently winning the trade and has a good chance to run the score up on it as time passes.

And we could have had him for just money. Not a first round pick. He's having a heck of a year.