LGR4GM

Im arguing against what you said. Jack Quick does not get knocked off pucks easily. I think that deflected off the defender and he was trying to shoot far side. Maybe it was a pass, hard to tell but here is the clip.

Not really. Arizona has 1 player above 46 points an that is Clayton Keller at 69pts. Buffalo has 5 players over 46 points and all 5 of those players are signed to long term deals. Arizona's best U23 defender is Victor Sodestrom. At 22 he has 5pts in 15 NHL games. Buffalo's best U23 defender is Dahlin and their 2nd best is Power. Power has 26pts in 63 games as a 20yr old. Arizona forfeited a pick in 2022 draft because of cheating... Buffalo didn't. The Sabres 2022 draft is better IMPO. Arizona took Cooley, Geekie, and Lamoureux in the first round and I could argue that only Cooley is better or on par with Savoie and that Östlund and Kulich easily slot above the other two. Arizona is about 2 years behind where Buffalo is to be honest so no, I don't think it is somewhere in the middle. I think it more likely is 20% as opposed to 50% similar.

No you are wrong and I know you are because I watch the games.

This is so frustrating to deal with over and over again. They did cut payroll to the bone in 2020 during the pandemic and every year since then they have added to the org. The Sabres scouting staff and analytics staff is one of the biggest in the league again. The reason they don't have to spend to the cap is because most of their talent is young and hasn't started their second deals or just broke out in the last 2 years and hasn't started their post breakout deals. Comparing Buffalo, an org that is already given out long term high dollar deals and will do so again this summer to Arizona who plays in a NCAA arean is just a lazy surface level comparison IMPO. It is almost as though ppl forget going into the 2021 season (aka last season) the Sabres were in the process of trading Eichel and starting a rebuild which clearly has done pretty decent considering only a year later we are hovering near the playoffs, have a 40+ goal scorer, and a Norris candidate.

So what you are saying is, what I said was correct. It is a myth that Jack Quinn gives up easily.

Again you have to keep changing your paremeters. Now it is NCAA to ALL Stars. I have no doubt that a team of 2023 NHL All Stars beats the 2023 NCAA team. But again, you have to change the topic and toss out strawman after strawman. I'd guess that your formative hockey years were in the 80's or early 90s meaning that you can't divest yourself from the nostalgia of those years. That's fine but bad faith arguments don't make your point.

@JoeSchmoe for all your examples you keep refusing to compare to 2023 NCAA hockey to 1983 hockey and that is basically the most telling part of this.

Let's break this down.... so he did pickup games with members. How many? How old were there? Which members? Why are we comparing Women's hockey to Men's hockey when one gets considerably more funding and players? How does that relate to 1983 hockey? How do 15yr old kids relate to 21 year old NCAA players? Sorry but you have one of the weakest arguments I have seen for this. The 10 yr jump isn't logical, comparing men's hockey to women's hockey in the same time period is a different argument all together, you fail to understand the difference between a 15yr old and a 21yr old, and you fundamentally do not understand the differences in goalie play from 1983 to 2023.... Dude, you are not only reaching, you aren't even making sense anymore.

No you don't understand and don't have a desire to. You think that because you can say that every 10 years the entire league isn't new players that it proves a guy from 1983 would be magically good if teleported to 2023. They wouldn't. Also what a ludicrous example. You literally cannot fathom the gulf between the 1983 players and 2023 players.

What's hard to follow? St Louis was the 190hp jeep when he came into the league. Because he has access to all the upgrades each year, he built himself into the 285hp jeep. The 1980 team doesn't get that. You are missing the GIANT fundamental flaw in your argument. St Louis wasn't the player at 37 he was at 25 because he had alll those years of experience playing against the incrementally improving players flowing into the league. Versus the 1980 team having to make a 40 year jump in skill immediately.

PPL keep saying this and I have never witnessed that to be true. In fact in the NYR game he was engaged, HARD, in his own zone with the puck and fought long and hard enough to clear the zone while under extreme duress. I think this is a myth to be honest and is something I see more from the boards darling, JJP. idk, in 4 months, 5lbs is probably the more likely and safe way to add good muscle. He can't just add bulk, it has to be that endurance type of muscle.

This is important. "If he is good enough" not "Levi is the goalie and everyone else can suck it". Adams holds two thoughts simultaneously, 1) Levi should be the goalie of the future, 2) the gt this year wasn't good enough. What he does this summer should be scrutinized. The defense needs improving and the goaltending needs improving and he needs to accomplish both.

Im glad you proved my point. St Louis had alllllll the incremental improvements from 190hp to 285hp because he was constantly being challenged by better players. the 1983 all stars don't have 15 years of playing against incrementally better players. They just step out as the 1983 all stars. It is amazing that everyone being like "OOOOO OOOOO the 1983 guys are better!" then have to add a bunch of caveats about training and getting better in the modern the NHL. Yea, that's the point, if I got in a time machine and put the 1983 all star team on the ice with a bunch of 2023 college kids, the college kids would smoke them. They are bigger, faster, stronger, smarter players because the game as evolved. This right here pretty much ends the argument.

They don't get modern training though. If they did, then it would be would the 2023 NHL All Stars beat the 2023 NCAA All Stars and there isn't a conversation. Everyone who is older has this belief that their heroes form 1983 could just step into the NHL and be fine, they wouldn't.

By this logic though you can say that a 1980 Jeep is the same as a 2023 jeep because if you go back 10 years the 2013 isn't that much different than the 2023 and then the 2003 isn't that much different and so on and so forth. It just ignores the incremental changes and the players themselves evolving with them over time.

He does something that is vitally important, he uses his body to prepare the space around him. Reminds me a little of how Lidstrom played defense, where if you go back and watch, there are a lot of subtle ways he engaged that gave him advantages he could exploit. Jack Quinn gaining about 20lbs would do wonders for what he is trying to do out there. I am very curious to see what October Quinn looks like.

Just a partial game report from his draft year.

This covers it but Neuchev loves to drive the center and shoot. He actually could use a bit more awareness of teammates IMO (I have seen 2 partial KHL games of his so take that for what it is worth) but in general he is an offense first attacking forward. Kinda reminds me a bit of Tuch in some ways. He has 12 points in 57KHL games at 19. That's all while getting 8-10minutes a night from the look of stuff. From EP's draft guide (seriously I know I say this a lot but EP has great content). His statistical profile gives him a 20% chance of being a 2nd line player in the NHL.

College. As stated before the speed, strength, and specifically the goalies are so much more advanced than the 1980s. I went back and watched a game from 1983 and I was surprised how slow it looked.

Granato talked about how the players who can self coach and self correct tend to have fewer mental ups and downs in a season. Specifically mentioned Power and Quinn. For Quinn he talked about how good he is at understanding what happened on a play and correcting and his only real issue is that he isn't strong enough yet for the NHL. Quinn had a nice goal last night and I really think we have a 70pt player growing up on this team right now.

Desperation cuts two ways. Food for thought... see Pittsburgh at this past deadline.

Calling Granato a "first- timer" is something you could do. You're wrong, he's been a head coach at every level of hockey but you could do it. At best you're deliberately trying to slight him.

I was scared