dudacek

"Jack would be happy to come to Anaheim and will follow the course of treatment your doctors prescribe. All he wants is for you to hear him out on why he prefers disc replacement." I am not sure how anyone could not think hearing those words from someone he trusts might influence Bob Murray off the fence. Pat Brisson could be that person. Maybe Peter Fish was not. It's just an example of how this might help. What do people think agents actually do?

I agree. I am suggesting that it is in Adams' best interest to stay on very good terms with Pat, just like it is my best interest to stay on good terms with my mother-in-law.

A while back, in the context of Drury and an Eichel trade, I posted about the influence agents have and got mocked a bit for it. Anyone not think images of Owen Power are burrowing into Kevyn Adams' brain every time he talks Eichel with Brisson?

Someone who wasn't trying to send him to New York? I've always liked you And I've always liked you. It hurts when you don't read my posts more than you will ever know. Mr. Owen Power who also is a client of Mr. Brisson Sr? I'm pretty sure someone posted that somewhere?

I think the grind has affected me enough that I accept he has to go. Once you get there, it’s easy to say “they waited this long, that’s obviously the most they could have got.” Even if the return itself pisses me off. New agent allows Jack to hit the reset button and blame Fish for everything. I would be shocked if he took the extreme route you suggest under Brisson. Brisson will talk to the Sabres, talk to the suitors, talk to Jack and figure out why the process has broken down. And if there’s a path out, he has the clout to put all parties in it.

I think there is more evidence supporting this hypothesis than Marco Rossi getting 65 points this year, but your mileage may vary. 😜

That Philbony comment is so spot on. ( @Thorny fits with what we were just talking about) Hopefully Brisson can rehabilitate Jack’s value.

Yes, this has been my personal opinion. I lot of my recent posts are me trying to reconcile that opinion with the fact that GMs don’t seem to share it. Asking myself why that is, and throwing out possible answers. Unlike most hockey fans, I don’t think all GMs are idiots. So my default tends to be that they have information I don’t.

Brisson is also Owen Power’s agent. Personally, I see this as a move that could shake loose the logjam. Brisson has way more clout and connections than Fish. He could bridge communication gaps and leverage something here.

So we’re talking Tkachuk, Zary, Pelletier and a 1st, or holding out for Monahan, Zary and a 1st? Oh, I think if I was Calgary’s owner, I’d authorize paying top-10 price given the state of my franchise. My GM would be smart to talk me out of it though. Does an 80-point scorer means Auston Matthews and 70-point scorer means Mark Schiefele?

What I was trying to point out is that both of those players built toward breakout 100-point seasons - a level they reached again only once more in their careers, for a variety of reasons. I think it is more likely that Jack hits 80 points one or two more times in his career than it happens 5 or 6 more times. Crosby had 120 points in his second year and has never come close to that again. since then he broke 100 four times, yet he failed to hit 90 points 10 times. Counting on Jack to be very good is prudent. Counting on him to have several more seasons like 19/20 is not.

I think it's more like '75 was for Bert and 90 for Sneaky Pete. I think the stat lines for a lot of stars look a lot theirs.

He has only hit 70 points twice as well, but you aren't being pedantic about me calling him a 70-point scorer 😜 I think my point stands.

If a prudent GM is paying close attention to historic trends of player production, he understands that 19/20 represents peak Jack and a season that will likely be matched maybe only once or twice throughout the rest of his career.

I don't think they are either. GMs forgive all if it comes to wins. But I believe they are a consideration. You can talk about 19/20 being the peak of a steady upward trend, or you can also talk about it being an outlier under optimum conditions. Where he had a coach who kissed his ass daily, fed him all the ice time he wanted, in the way he wanted it, with exactly the linemates he wanted (i.e. not Skinner). And the team still sucked. Over his career Jack is roughly a 25-goal, 70-point scorer who has played 70 games just twice. He makes $10 million and appears to be high-maintenance. That — not a top-10 MVP candidate — is what his track record shows, and the price a prudent GM pays. That is why no one is bucking up Zegras Comtois Perreault and a 1st. Jack is also an amazing talent. This year is also an outlier. That's why the Sabres have not, and should not, settled for Kravtsov, Jones and Georgiev. At some point an offer will hit a sweet spot in between.

I am of the opinion Jack should be worthy of a haul. To date, no GM has agreed, which I take as proof that I'm wrong. My conclusion is that Adams is asking fair value for peak Jack Eichel and teams have reasons to doubt they will be getting peak Jack Eichel. I think the very fact Jack is on the market is a red flag to GMs. To a man, they are saying "if I had a talent like that, I sure as heck would not be trading him." Many of you think it is simply because he is 'broken' and his repair is doubtful. I see Jack playing scrimmage games and hear about multiple teams being interested and am skeptical that is solely the case; if it was, steps would have been taken to fix his neck by now. I agree he wears the record, rightly or wrongly. I also think he wears the character questions — the coach-killing, backcheck-coasting, Kane-buddy, eye-rolling, 4th-liner-belittling, me-centric questions. Rightly or wrongly.

And you do know that cap space is a resource that can be used to make a team better right? Using it may not make you better. Not using it definitely will not.

And more bruised. (You know I'm not arguing against you, right? Just making an observation about perception.)

But compared to what expectations generally are for high picks among NHL fan bases? Recent case in point: In a recent Athletic survey, Red Wings fans gave their team a 4.2 out of 5 for drafting and developing. Sabres fans gave their team a 2.2 out of 5. Keep in mind the Sabres have won 10 more games than the Wings have over the past 3 years Comparing who they've drafted: Dahlin (1) Raymond (4) Power (1) Seider (6) Cozens (7) Edvinsson (6) Quinn (8) Zadina (6) Mittelstadt (8) Rasmussen (9) Rosen (14) Cossa (15) Johnson (31) Veleno (30) Samuelsson (32) Wallinder (32) Poltapov (33) Berggren (33) Peterka (34) Tuomisto (35) Davidsson (37) McIsaac (36) Do the Red Wings fan base have the evidence to support being twice as confident as the Sabres fan base?

It's interesting to watch the general expectations on this forum for Rosen, Quinn and Power. Generally speaking fans overestimate how good their picks are going to be: the old mystery box "no way are we giving up Kakko for Eichel" hyperbole. But I don't think @Thorny is alone around here in his skepticism that any will develop into front-line players. I wonder the last time an NHL 13th, 8th and 1st overall pick had expectations this low from their fan base less than a year after they had been picked?

In his draft year Quinn had 52 goals in 62 CHL games and went 8th overall In his draft year Alexander Holtz had 7 goals in 3 U20 SHL games and went 7th overall In his draft year Lucas Raymond had 3 goals in 9 U20 SHL games and went 4th overall In his draft year Isak Rosen had 7 goals in 12 U20 SHL games and went 13th overall William Eklund, who was the only Swedish forward picked higher than Rosen this year, did not play any junior games last year, but he did the previous year. In the year before his draft year Isak Rosen had 21 goals in 38 U20 SHL games In the year before his draft year William Eklund had 12 goals in 31 U20 SHL games Like LGR says, it's a tough comparison. That's the best I got.

To mirror @pi2000's post Eichel is traded for 4 good young pieces, including a potential top 6 centre. Dahlin emerges as stud, leading the team in scoring and getting votes for the Norris. Casey Mittelstadt creates offence and puts up 60 points Cozens gets 40 points and looks good both ends of the ice The main Eichel return piece shows he is already a good NHL 3rd liner with obvious upside. One of Tage, Skinner, Bjork and Ruotsalanien emerges as a 25-goal scorer, while the other 3 combine for 45 The majority of Peterka, Rosen, Poltapov, Quinn, Portillo and Levi dominate their leagues and climb up the prospect rankings UPL surprises and shows himself the equal to Ullmark, with Anderson a big improvement over Hutton in the back-up role. Butcher Hagg Miller and Pysyk put together decent seasons and are flipped for picks at the deadline. Johnson and Power sign as their replacements and immediately show they are NHL-ready adding to good showing s from Samuelsson and Jokiharju. The team works hard, is entertaining most nights, finishes with 70-75 points, wins the lottery and takes Wright.

I thought Adams was pretty clear that by "block" he meant a veteran standing in the way of a kid getting opportunities to play in important situations. Adding a Henrique is not a "block" to Casey Mittelstadt playing with the goalie pulled, or Dylan Cozens playing shifts against Sidney Crosby. You bring in a Henrique because the team only has two NHL centres. It needs 4.

No. Cozens and Mitts would still be top-three centres, and can be the top-two whenever it is serving the development goal. We've already seen the model over the final month with Reinhart as the other centre. Cozens and Mitts still got to play in all those situations the organization wanted them to play, even with Sam as a clear #1. Henrique, or someone similar, would be even less of a block.

I think the roster has deliberately been constructed in such a way that there is obvious cap and (non-blocking) roster room to add pieces. I think there is reason to be seriously concerned that the current situation in goal and centre will be detrimental to the development of the young players that is the goal this season. I think that Dell and Anderson were quick-strike signings in order to cover our butts and buy time when Plan A (Ullmark) fell through and the UFA goalie merry-go-round had run out of seats. I think Adams is willing to go to war with his current goalie group if he has to, but his preference is to acquire a better stopgap at a reasonable price. There is a good chance that might not be available. I think Adams doesn't want to make any more moves until the Eichel situation is resolved. That's because he doesn't want to "block" his acquisitions. I think his inability to move Eichel may force his hand, but he will wait until the eve of the season if he has to. He probably has a few prospective trades on the table that are stopgaps for him and cap dumps for the other team. And he probably has a few Sheahan-type signings on the backburner to reach the floor if he needs to. I think this is the plan, but I also think he will sit on the current roster before he will take a bad return for Jack or move for a pickup that may prove redundant.