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Come on man, now you guys are just grasping at straws. Every single goaltender in the league has a weakness but you're just using the excuse to justify that Enroth might not be good just because he hasn't been given the chance. All somebody has to do is blink the right way and Miller drops to his knees and he gets scored on top shelf. Miller isn't getting any younger, he's worth something on the trade market, Enroth is proving to be just as good and Miller is part of that core that core that brings the aura of negativity. No matter what happens Enroth will never be good enough for some on here even if he won the Vezina. You and I both know that's not what I meant. I've been arguing that point about goaltenders getting overpaid, where were you when I needed you? ;) Miller has one year left, Luongo has nine. Big difference. Either way, Miller brings in something good. Be it picks or a #1 center. BFLO could end up with 7 top two round picks this year. A lot can happen with that kind of bait.

Yes, no matter how bad he plays. This team has an unwillingness to accept that he is average and nobody will ever get the chance that he got to take the starting job. It's not a conspiracy against Enroth, it's the love affair with Miller. Remember Darcy's hanging on to players he brought up for too long hoping they'd turn into something? Well he's waiting for Miller to win the Vezina again and he isn't ever going to do it and he hasn't been close since. The Olympics were more important for him. He's not going to bring in any less than Pominville. If it's for picks that would give us plenty to trade with if a top 3 pick is that important.

There is a gap, one can net you a #1 center, or some really high draft picks. Enroth has been unstoppable since Lindy left, he had two bad starts. He carried this team to the playoffs two years ago, and finished with a better save percentage than Miller last year despite getting most of his starts when everybody was hurt. He's also going to finish out this year with a better save percentage. I don't know what more you guys want from him. You do lose a job by being equal. You can't win a job when you get 3 starts a month. Miller was given 40+ starts to prove he could do it. Can you see Enroth ever getting 40+ starts with Miller around no matter how bad Miller is? He was bad his first two starts. Considering those were the only two starts he'd had in 9 months. These are professional athletes, I'm going to go out on a limb and say making 60-70 starts as a 24 year old goaltender probably isn't going to be very taxing. ;)

I think most places are going to be pretty limited in 4G (or similar) coverages unless you're downtown in any city. All carriers really push how much coverage there is, but when it comes down to it it's not that widespread.

That's what I said. Miller was given an opportunity. Enroth won't be given that opportunity as long as Miller is around no matter how bad Miller plays. Perhaps I could have made it more clear if I said Miller was ACTUALLY given an opportunity.

Just be careful. Like I said, with the no contract deals they charge you per month for your phone over two years so if you only have them for 3 months they will charge you the remaining balance of your phone which could end up being $450-500. They also have a bring your own phone plan without a contract, but the compatible phones are limited.

I think you're going to find that coverages are going to be pretty similar, even more so as time goes on. I just went through looking at all the carriers this week because I was thinking about switching, only because my Motorola died and Sprint had to order me a replacement which took a week to get here. I'm a month away from an upgrade and they wouldn't give me an early upgrade to make things easier so I don't have to go through the same BS next month. Anyways, I found them all to be pretty similar. The difference in T-mobile is their no contract deals are with only a select few phones; also with their regular contracts they charge less for plans but they charge you per month for the price of the phone. So you'll end up paying the $500-$600 for the price of the latest phones over the course of two years if you fo that route. Whereas AT&T and Sprint knock off a ton of money for the price of the phone up front if you sign a two year contract.

No matter how much better Enroth is/has been than Miller, he will never be good enough. I don't know why people think a healthy 24 year old goaltender can't play 18 out of 20 games. Even though Enroth is as consistent (if not more) than Miller, I'd rather take 3 spectacular games with 1 bad game out of 4 than 4 average games. Doesn't Miller have 7 wins in his last 18 starts? Let me rephrase that for you.......... he was GIVEN the opportunity to beat out the other goalies. Do you honestly think anybody will be given ample opportunity to win a starting job over Miller as long as he is here no matter how bad he is?

Label it as you wish. I don't think there are two groups to put us in. I'm not a Miller hater to the point I want himm gone just because I like Enroth. I don't think he should be moved 'just because'. I think he should be moved because I think his time has come, just like has been mentioned, very similar to Roy's situation. I don't think Miller wants to be in BFLO and I think that carries over into the locker room. When you have another goaltender putting up similar (better) numbers and your other goaltender can bring in some assets, you go with what will improve the team when you're in rebuilding mode. Putting assets aside, I'll go on record (as I've said before) by saying that I have no problem keeping Miller around. But that would entail a lighter contract (3 mil max) and no guarantees that he is the #1 goaltender.

Hell, at this point, Hecht is worth Stafford's contract more than Stafford.

Good points. I think the verdict is stil out on the young kids right now. Porter, Flynn, Foligno, Ruhwedel, etc.... might look good right now because there is little talent left on this team. Surround them with some serious competition from first and second liners and we'll see how they do. Not saying they aren't good enough, I just don't think this is a good gauge as to how good they really are (or aren't).

I don't either. People are upset because he's not putting up a 25 goal equivalent season. He wasn't re-signed for that role. He was signed to be a defensive forward and has done a great jon of it this year, better than most of our forwards. He seems to be playing with a little bit of an edge lately too. I'd have no problem with them re-signing him for next year. As opposed to figuratively? Why would anybody be figuratively tired?

All I'm saying is if they can't get a #1 center or legitimate first line forward for Miller, then picks are acceptable. If MIller has a list of teams he won't be traded to, having picks could open up the possibilities a little more. Of course that all depends on who is available and who is willing to deal. You go with Miller for a #1 center first, if all else fails then go for picks. With #16 and #40 on top of what we already have, that leaves a lot of possibilities open AND still leaves enough picks to strengthen the team. I would feel like Darcy isn't trying to move forward.

If you read the rest of that post, I said I preferred that we had a legitimate first line forward, preferrably a #1 center, coming back. I would be willing to take #16 and #40 because that would just load us up with even more picks.......... trade bait.

I'm glad they won. I'm glad Ott showed why he should be signed to a long term deal, I'm glad Vanek has been showing everybody why he neeeds to be signed to a long term deal, I'm glad to see Hecht pull ahead in goals over Stafford, I'm glad that the Pens are 22-3 in the last 25 but 0-2 vs. BFLO and I'm glad Miller was strong after his letdown against the Rangers.

Was he filling in for somebody?

Jiggs McDonald?

Who said he should be shipped out with return only being a secondary concern?

They're usually pretty fair. At least in BFLO they are in my opinion. I think he deserved it, and the last two to be honest.

Three straight #1 stars for Enroth. Seven straight top 3 stars. Just saying........ :P

Maybe next year when everybody expects them to suck, things could seem a little more optimistic.

Vote for Kris Versteeg for NHL14 cover. :lol: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxJRKKBmN24&feature=share&list=UUSSc4wVk6telelb58RrLYdg

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That's a good point. I'll be interested to see if they do in fact get comparable contracts. Like you said, back in the day Miller's contract was comparable to many. Now (like you said that may change), not so much and I think it's because GM's are seeing that goals are being scored is a way that doesn't necessarily rely on a goaltenders talent. That's why many have invested in bigger, taller goaltenders. They'll stop a deflection or a screen simply by percentages because they are bigger. Screened and deflected goals are much more common nowadays, I think you'll see small goaltenders make a comeback because they can move around easier to respond to a deflection and see around a screen. Either way, I don't think goaltenders are the backbone of a team like they once were.

I addressed the issue because it was a question YOU ignored that was relevant to the post in which you replied to. I actually asked you that before you even made the point that you're referring to, so in essence you were once again trying to deflect the topic. The fact is, and I proved it, 'elite' goaltenders don't necessarily get you to the playoffs. Part of that is because 'elite' goaltenders are a dying breed. I mentioned that twice on this thread and nobody seemed to disagree. Great point, too bad it has nothing to do with what I am talking about. First of all, you actually helped to prove my point because I showed you how goaltenders with big contracts are not making the playoffs yet 13/16 teams have a bonafide #1 goaltender. Using some simple logic, their #1 goaltenders aren't making 'elite' money. Second, I didn't say goaltenders didn't get contracts equivalent to Miller, I said they won't be GETTING contracts equivalent to Miller. Why? Third, you are biringing up all these goaltenders who recently signed lucrative contracts. NONE of them are equivalent to Miller's like I have been talking about all along, with the exception of Rinne. (How have they been doing by the way?) You are talking about contracts in the 3-5 mil range. I'm talking about contracts in the 6+ mil range......................you know, Miller type contracts. If you're going to contradict my point, use similar examples. He might be analytical, but he's not very good at it. This all started when he told us that the majority, if not VAST majority of playoff goaltenders are high paid.......... and then backtracked by telling us that playoff bound goaltenders have yet to sign a lucrative contract. He then went on to use 3-5 mil contracts as a comparison to Miller's 6+ mil to say that I was wrong about goaltenders getting equivalent contracts. 3-5 isn't the same as 6+. That's not very analytical. Just because he has PhD in his name, doesn't make him smarter than everybody else. :P